Everyone in Mad Gear are jobbers. A bunch of “thugs” who used their numbers to intermediate people then they made the poor decision in kidnapping Jessica.
This is further proven in their inclusion in the SF series. Boss characters aren’t even bosses in SF, just random sideshows with silly stories and gimmicks vroom vroom
Hugo is the best of the bunch especially in SFIII where he wasn’t a potatotard like he was in SFIV, also his 2nd Impact theme is the best in the SFIII trilogy.
Agree 
To me multiple factors
Andrè the Giant, surely first that come to mind
The whole development Hugo had in SF3: redesign, moveset, Poison, fusion with Bratken figure, rivalry with Alex/Hogan… it worked all so well that was incredibly hard to beat (again, Hugo is best thing FF gave to SF, period. Then Cody), and Abi absolutely failed at it
Considering back to sprite era they were mostly the same, still on design side Hugo’s hair gave him far more interessing silhuette for SF visually, as on other hand we already got Gief and Birdie sporting some kind of mohawk/buzzcut (even T.Hawk on very first concept lol)
As fun it sound Hugo’s hair play great role in his design, making his head the second heaviest element after his big torso
One thing i should give credit for on SFV Abigail is i liked a lot the idea of him having a post-MGG life with former gang fellows, the whole car workshop thing felt the right direction to differentiate him from SF3 child-brain Hugo… then we know how it has ended up LOL
At the end FFR El Gado was hinted to be more or less just as good as Rolento and with knife+grappling may very likely be the better hand-to-hand fighter of the two
Also it’s not like we got so many fighters from latin america(outside Brazil and Mexico), and he’s from Cuba
I don’t buy the only the bosses “rule”, specially after SF itself successfully broke it
I like Rolento more than El Gado, but i buy El Gado over let’s say Edi or DamnD
Dhalsim: “You are still as ignorant as ever, I see…”
Balrog: “Shut the fuck up. Money is what makes the world goes around, you skinny piece of rat shit! Time to wrap this up and get pai- WHAT THE FUCK???”
Dhalsim: “Right.”
https://twitter.com/Steven7FGC/status/1282738012133240832?s=20
that’s an interesting comparison by nothingman in reddit credits to the guy
Source: Reddit - Dive into anything
Cestus claim that Abi was an absolutely fail to replace hugo, he got it wrong because Abigail wasn’t trying to be Hugo, His not very Hugo and his not a Hugo replacement or substitute. His just a brand new SF character.
What made Hugo appear more in SF as a choice, is because of poison and being more memorable than Abigail.
What made Abigail appeal is just being headswap andore that is a boss and never again appeared until SFV.
His a headswap filler boss that finally gain his own character by being a homage of another popular pop culture character.
A filler boss, either they miraculously alive again or being in different color pallet, yet abigail was made more of headswap. it’s like way back in the 90s beat em up that before you fight the FINAL Bosses.
Hugo was carefully crafted in SF3 that even his SF4 version isn’t able to compare.
Abigail didn’t get any spotlight like I said he his only reapperance was SFV.
His more an independent homage to Abobo which I pointed out years ago in the character anticipation thread.
It’s kinda way so obvious like they were doing the overall change with Poison in SFV to be akin to Linda in Double Dragon, especially because of the new weapon of choice the whip.
How I wished it would had been Roxy instead but Poison had strong appeal in the larger audience because of the controversy
Abigail is more on a Abobo homage than trying to compete, replace and be a subsititute to Hugo.
the Abobo is so popular that he even had his own game
So no wonder Capcom would want there own version, to be honest the thing that I disliked and criticism with Abigail is that he wasn’t bending down like Juggernaut in the mahvel titles. I have mentioned this before. I felt it wrong that he need his own custom screen size change compare to Juggernaut that is fixed to everyone.
Going back to popularity
Obviously even the popularity it doesn’t match it’s obvious whether andore or hugo, Capcom in the past did more references and cameo with that character than abigail. His not more reference than the other. His not even a recurring boss compare than the thug.
SO saying he was something that would fail to Hugo is obvious in terms of popularity because his not a recurring character that had tons of appearance but the thing is his not trying to be or to be in the shadow of Hugo like cestus is saying. His a brandnew character trying to homage a different character. It’s like G is not another Q and so is modern Kage not another Ryu. Like K’ is not another Kyo even with the lore behind it and etc.
Abigail was an unnecessary addition to SF who was neither wanted or needed.
Same as T. Hawk?
I just fail to see what makes Abigail stand out from Hugo (and vice versa). Their only gimmick is ‘tall’ and while later games added the ‘dumb’ trait to them the addition of Poison to Hugo makes him less of a nothing character than Abigail. Like for real, in FF what sets Abigail apart from the other Andores other than him being a stage boss?
Fair enough, poor use of the term on my part. That being said I still think Abigail is more of a nothing character than say Sodom or Rolento who have actual personality and character traits. That was more so what I was getting at.
Fuck i dunno i like Abigail.
Only SF character i dislike is Rufus.
Well, Zeku instead Guy just mirror Abigail instead Hugo too
Difference is Zeku (old one in particular) is a good addition and, if i ignore FF nostalgia, a slighty more interessing character imho
Nah, all SSF2 newcomers were born as additional variety
Cammy - offered an western alternative female to Chun
Fei Long - was in to bring Bruce Lee in our SF life
Dee Jay - was kickboxing rep and a black character in a game that got only one (see Cammy-female)
T.Hawk - gave SF2 (a game made of stereotypes) the native american stereotype, and gone into a niche (big muscle grappler) that at that point was filled only by Zangief
Abigail gone to straight substitute Hugo and his role of “giant of SF” (all while being inferior character)
You just said it. It was already filled by Zangief.
As for Abigail, he fills in the niche for the Canadian character.
“additional variety” was the key of what i said
female char
black char
big muscle char
All were at only 1 in SF2, and from there SSF2 added an alternative/new flavor for each
T.Hawk added that native american sterotype that helped build the all around the world vibe SF2 aimed for.
Also while the sprite did kinda weak job at that, on paper he was supposed to be “the giant” of SF2 cast being much bigger than Gief… if in SF2 they portrayed him accurately, ingame he will have looked like some sort of SF2 Hugo/Abigail predecessor
Last but not least they made him show unexpected agility to use his own mass as a striking object (got 2 striking special vs 1 grappling one), in contrast with Zangief being about slow close him and deal damage with a variety of powerful throws
They applied more or less same reasoning to create Abigail(T.Hawk) to contrast next to Hugo’s (Zangief)… except in SSf2 you got both of them
Eh, i guess yes (ironically was supposed to be dutch back to FF days), on national variety it was actually some kind of improvement… Hugo gone, but Falke someway still rep Germany, while Abi bring a new nation
As general rule i approve much national variety as possible, but in the specific case we loss a very good char and got a trashy one. Bad trade
But as said the difference with T.Hawk (a comparision that you made), is that when T.Hawk appeared did’nt replaced Zangief, just took a seat next to him giving us more cast options
Of course Zangief and T.Hawk were so different that have them in same cast was possible (and good imho), while obvious similarities between Abi and Hugo would have made it super redundant.
Also have 2 “super giants” kinda kill the visual vibe of get one, as the gimmick is having one looking like a freak and an anomaly next to everybody else
Feels really a “This town ain’t big enough for both of us” scenario (example i will not want Hugo in the season we are about to discover), problem is we got the far worse one
cestus get it wrong again.
NO. They were not marketed as replacement even they have lore in it. Obviously Zeku is more of a homage to Strider Hiryu, Something like a guest character but isn’t.
This is because Tekken had Akuma and Geese in Evo…
and Zeku is Capcom’s answer for SF which is successful
Even having Zeku and Guy at the same game nor Abigail and Hugo, you won’t feel that they are clone of each other same with G to Q.
Abigail and SFV Poison was something like a double dragon guest too but wasn’t really.
Most of them were just there because they were the guest character vibe that weren’t.
I would take Abigail than a guest character from Tekken, Like I said before if there would be a guest that would be from Arika that I would welcome which is Garuda,
If I would call them they are PSEUDO GUEST CHARACTERS
Since this character came into idea after people are being hype and imagining guest characters in SFV.
and cestus saying Gief replace THawk is kinda narrow like because big body kinda reasoning same goes with his opinion with both Abigail and Hugo.
agree he wasn’t even trying to be Zangief.
The guy has weird analogy justifying fighting characters because of body size and assuming them as clone and replacements. Imagine that to the other characters.
The last time he assumed Makoto to the rest of the shoto.
The whole thing here it’s a fighting game which variety of gameplay is the top most then the moveset and the least is the visual distinction, nationality and whatever was listed on the fighting style.
Yeh me too Rufus was an homage to Bob gone wrong
On the visual side we just talked about it
On character attitude in theory they could easily have made him faaar smarter than Hugo
Of course he got his MGG job not for his strategic brain but by being the biggest baddest guard dog of all, but still he was somehow the leader of a portion of the gang and had the duty to protect the most important area (as was the one to reach Belger’s HQ)
Next to Hugo that have been turned into the most slow IQ of the Andore family, they could have made Abigail have some brain, his FF lore will have supported that.
Not necessary as intelligent as Hugo is dumb, but make him someway street smart and able to take by surprise who approach him as just another anime big brainless brute
Sometimes they almost hint something in win quotes, but really to little to influence the character’s vibe
Instead we got brooom brrrrrrroooomm burp broom prot burp brrrroooommm
To be completely fair, they saved him a bit in Poison’s story, he even take offense on being called dumb lol (even if they did’nt resisted drop random broom burp broom)
but again “really to little to influence the character’s vibe”
Then Abigail is the “additional variety” “extra cast option” for someone interested in huge hulk-like characters other than Hugo.
When you phrase it like that, man, no character is “unnecessary”.
But the part you quote clearly say
“when T.Hawk appeared did’nt replaced Zangief, just took a seat next to him giving us more cast options”
v
additional variety
Abigail does’nt do it, he replaced Hugo
Then from there i was the first to admit have both may not be good option as the giant gimmick works better once, but at this point give me the superior option (Hugo) or make the replacement just as good, they did neither
They done a design that mostly ignore what SF design is about, and pushed in a character that seem from another game/universe
I seen same accusation done on Fang and Rufus (and i consider these accusations mostly wrong), but Abigail do it much much worse
I’m ok with Abi expanding SF universe (being FF he was already in SF canon) and in general i hope ever to get many new characters, they failed at make him good
To be fair, SFV preparation art had him much more fitting SF body built in most sketches
seems like in the 3D phase somebody gone full retard and it got approved, lol… not new for SFV
This is why he mostly end-up with inconsistency, He typically used something like hair, clothes, body size and nationality, depending on the topic and his favorable. You would even caught him up when his agreeing and disagreeing with his own claims. Like he tries to say it yes and also say no at the same time,
while ignoring which is the most important aspect of variety in a fighting game characters which game-play and the possibility is always there. Even with the similar names of moves fighting game gameplan still standout.
his points are mostly changed depending on his favorable for example if his mentioned something like this for Makoto if he dislike her to return. How by highlighting that she wears as karate gi like the rest of the shoto, In other words he is claiming her as redundant because he claims that she wear karate gi like the rest of the shoto so she is irrelevant addition to him. cestus is biased. nitpicker and usually contrast and conflict his claims depending on the situation and if it favor his interest.
Right now in how he claim Thawk and Gief being the same, I would agree with FFR Haggar and Gief, but not on how he spotlight it with THawk and Gief, same goes with Abigail and Hugo. He would claim they are similar then later no or later they are, because of trying to disagree on another character as a variety. It’s not even like Thawk and Gief in the same category,
A typical way of indirect gate keeping the preference and suggestion of others in casting because it isn’t fixated and clear. Which he usually does like claiming vg*na if someone had a female request that contradict his interest in the character thread or would say that others opinions is not worth other than his, it would always be depending where he would category he would used in argument to make that character feel like redundant and irrelevant, but take a look a characters he himself liked the most and promote to be in SF in the character thread.
Darun and Gief in SFEX that are clearly played as grapplers not because they are wrestlers listed on there biography or because they are wearing wrestling clothes, The way he cited Abigail and Hugo, it’s like Zangief and Juggernaut are the same and redundant because of being huge in mahvel which is a terrible analogy. cestus has no fixated logic and understanding on the subject matter and just ignore the right things to justify his interest.
You know, I really liked the pairings from X-Men Vs Street Fighter. The only one that seemed a bit outta place was Rogue/Cammy, but that was an alternate pairing (Rogue’s actual partner was Chun-Li) since Cammy wasn’t paired with anyone. I have a feeling Psylocke woudl’ve been her partner had she been in the game. She was in Cammy’s ending.
Was this posted?
