The System Mechanics Thread

Because no one asked me to.

N - Good stuff though.

Right idea, but the opposite… If you perform a move in the air, then you LOSE your tripguard. Kinda like CvS2.

I learned not to always throw a jumping attack after landing on far chun d.MK into super a bazillion times.

Divekick doesn’t cancel tripguard?

Here’s a question: how many frames after you press the up button to jump do you have to wait before you can input a parry? Or maybe a better question, considering different characters have different pre-jump frames, is: how many frames after your character goes airborn do you have to wait before you can input a parry?

I just realized, is this is why I always see uriens do dash -> d.HP into heabutt after throw? My low short gets parried, and my headbutt doesn’t come out because of the weakattack-parry disadvantage. But if I do a crouching fierce, I can cancel into headbutt and they can’t stop it! (well, besides gigas or something)

Thanks Jinrai! :smiley:

I have a similar Q to this, sometimes I’ll superjump forward and I’ll parry an attack just above the ground as I’m rising. I was thinking you could escape some denjin setups doing this as long as they don’t release denjin right on top of you as you wake. So as soon as you wake superjump upforward and they’ll release once they see you attempt a jump and you’ll register an air parry right? Fuckin denjin…

hallucin8: it should be possible, i have done it, its just one parry then =D weeee

and best kind boxer: ahh right, i always wondered why you GOT tripGAURD after doing an aerial move :wink: logic seems to seep from it.

and every divekick (akuma, necro, yun/yang) dont cancel out tripgaurd, you can block/throw/whatever after landing, same with d+mk of chun-li and probably some others.

Thanks again DooM.

I don’t think this has been asked yet. How many frames of recovery are there for a whiffed throw?

Throw whiffs are 21 frames long.

The parry data was sooo interesting. Now I can know why some parries did work and others not.

Questions for you :
How much frames is the game frozen when you hit someone ?

What is the frame window to cancel/super-cancel out of moves into super/specials?

What is the frame window for chaining in target chains and when can you press the next button?

Is there any proprieties attached to a move when you do it and the “reversal” message(ex does it come out any faster, more priority, etc)?

What is the number of frames of charge required for charge moves ?

I can’t answer any but the last two questions.

“Reversal” only means that you did the move on the first possible frame.

Charge time is 42 frames.

I get the feeling both of these properties are dependent on the specific moves. All I know is I keep accidently doing 2 jabs with chun li when I double tap… You can definitely input the next move in a chain before the previous one hits.

If we go into specific cases, let’s compare chun’s low forward x super to ken’s low forward super .

Stats: start-up|active|recovery
chun-li: 6|2|14
ken: 6|5|17

I want to know what is the window to cancel into a super/special.

Oh and what are the effects of being granted (or not) a tripguard (how long is the pause when you do not have it) ?

What is the maximal time between partitions of a charge to be still counted as a charge ?

Is the parry frame windows universal or can it be character specific ?
If you partitionned (way) more than 42 frames total does it still count as a full charge ?

There is no data available on cancel windows or tripguard. Clearly, some moves have larger cancel windows than others.

Parry frame windows are universal. What isn’t universal is whether the opponent moves backwards, forwards, or neither during parrystun.

A partitioned charge will work as long as 1) you’ve spent at least 42 frames total in the charge position and 2) you don’t attempt another partition after you’ve reached 42 frames of charging.

You’re allowed to leave the charge position for up to 10 frames before losing the charge. If you’ve charged less than 42 frames total, you can return to the charge position and keep your charge. If you go past 42 frames, you’ll lose your charge 10 frames after you leave the charge position no matter what.

Example:

With Urien, hold down for half a second (no longer). Dash and bring the stick back to down as soon as you can. Hold down a little longer after you’ve recovered from the dash, then press up+P. You’ll get a headbutt.

Now try holding down for 5 seconds. Dash and bring the stick back to down as soon as you can. After you’ve recovered from the dash, press up+P. There won’t be any headbutt because you’ve charged longer than 42 frames before dashing.

Hey thanks, that’s very well answered.

can an opponent be thrown (normal throw [lp+lk], command grab, super art throw) on their first wakeup frame? Since normal throws and many command throws only have one hit frame, the timing may be too strict to do consistently. However, if done meaty and with perfect timing, command throws and throw supers may be inescapable for some characters.

For instance, Makoto knocks Ryu down with down+hp. Ryu does not tech roll. Makoto then walks up and does kara karakusa (which supposedly has more than one hit frame). Unless, Ryu has SA II (his only one frame start up move) stocked and executes a reversal on wakeup, he will be grabbed.

This may be a poor example because karakusa can tech normal throws, so what about
Akuma’s Shun Goku Sastu or Hugo’s command throws?

There is a small window where the opponent cannot be thrown after waking up. I don’t know how many frames it is, but it’s probably around 3-5.

In other words, you can always hold up on wakeup to escape a ground throw.

But, can you be thrown during pre-jump frames? If not, then that would explain why you can’t throw someone who holds up. The first frame is pre-jump, and can’t be thrown. Right?

I know you can’t throw superjump pre-jump, but I dunno about normal pre-jump.

So regarding the charge, if I want to throw tackles while overwriting charges ([B.42f],F,[B.9f],HK) I cannot go over 10 frames of other actions before releasing the special move ?

Best Kind Boxer: I’m not entirely sure. The fact that you can’t jump out of a point-blank Raging Demon implies that you can be thrown out of normal pre-jump, but the Demon can’t grab you if you’re hit out of the air and hold up as you land.

Juchel.Zero: That’s right. You’ll have already charged the second tackle for 9 frames before the first one even comes out.