West, if you figure this doesn’t need it’s own thread, just merge with whatever. However I think this info is specific and important enough that it deserves it’s own thread. It’s tough to sort through the matchup threads and video threads trying to find out why your demonflip keeps getting punished.
Post any unpunishable setups for Akuma regarding the demonflip or his dive kick here. I’ll update this post with links to relevant vids.
I’ll start with some Cammy setups:
[media=youtube]FZTW-iPH2kc[/media]
I crouch for a moment to establish the correct timing.
I think what would be really helpful was if someone compiled all the wakeup frames for each character. Then we could know the timing for characters who get up early like Adon, or get up late like Blanka. If you could breakdown the best safejump for each wakeup timing it would make memorizing setups a lot easier.
For example
Wakeup Frame
1:Adon- Vid for safejumping chars who wake up on first frame
2: etc
btw @ d2m vids, why does he have to change to stand block? does it mean that cammy ultra/super is actually not an low attack?
i loath myself trying to do regular grab dash*2 safejump against cammy when i totally know its not gonna work, and trying to delay the timing is really hard and end up getting grabbed/dp when seh wakes up.
cammy,adon,blanka the annoying 3 with weird wake up time or is there anyone else?
btw, im sure this has been posted before but i guess its related.
I’m pretty sure not every sweep you land outside of a tatsu-sweep is at max range. Even then, if your opponent sees you divekicking in they will still be tempted to try and uppercut it. Max range just means you cant option select a sweep comfortably into it. These setups have the advantage over j.hk safejump in that it requires no difficult timing to perform successfully, whereas with j.hk it is character dependent.
Nice thread. The Vortex thread was getting too cluttered imo.
I think I remember a thread here on SRK that had this information, but I can’t seem to find it. I’m pretty sure Cammy and Blanka wake up at the same time because the command dive kick setup I posted for Cammy also works on Blanka (it’s safe from EX Upball and both Ultras). Also, forward throw–>dash–>slightly delayed HK DF–>late Dive Kick is a safe jump on both Cammy and Blanka but completely whiffs on most other characters because they haven’t gotten up yet. I’ll try to post a video of this setup soon.
@Ero_Oyaji: I didn’t have to change to stand block, I just did for no real reason. Crouch block would’ve worked fine as well.
The problem with compiling a list of wake-up timings is that, as is said in the thread above, characters get up differently depending on the knockdown. So we would need to get the data for Akuma’s sweep, then get the data for Akuma’s forward throw.
Yea, I remember there being a few characters where whether they were blocking or not determined their wake up speed. Ibuki comes to mind but I thought Capcom fixed that
Akuma
Ken
Ryu
Hakan (With U2)
Guy (With U2)
Ibuki (With U1)
Possible…If they are retarded:
T.Hawk
Zangief
Possible, but very difficult (No Frames for Errror must be perfect timing) :
Adon
Blanka
Dan
DeeJay
Guile
Guy (Without U2)
Rose (With U2)
Vega
Possible and reasonable difficulty (1 or 2 Frame error window):
Cammy
Chun
Fei
Gen
Rufus
Ibuki (Without U1)
Sagat
Seth
The “Make a Sandwich, Grab a Coke, Kiss your GF (or wish you had one), say Hi to Mom, drive to the store, grab some beer, drive back, and still be safe” class
Balrog
Cody
C.Viper
Sakura
Gouken
Juri
Rose (Without U2)
Honda
The Dollar Menu, Have it your way!
Abel
Dhalsim
Hakan (Without U2)
Makoto
I’ll adjust this list as I see problems. I have to confirm a few of the frames.
But what about the frames of their wakeup on its own? The frames that the characters get up with varies. For instance, the amount of time it takes for E.Honda to get fully up is drastically different than the amount of time it takes for Rose to completely rise and be vulnerable to attacks again.
Yeah, thats what I mean. The amount of frames that characters wakeup in general is character dependent, which adds even more complexity to the fact that they can activate reversals on certain frames of that wakeup.
I just wish capcom made everyone wake up with the same damn timing, seems like it’ll take a lot of work to check how fast opponents get up depending on how Akuma knocked 'em down (via sweep, forward throw or DF throw/palm), but if this thread ended up with setups to safejump/beat most reversals from every useful knock down it would be VERY helpful.
Some reversals don’t even need to be safejumped since they barely have any invincibility frames (if even any), like Vega’s EX ST, a meaty jump-in = free combo, his U2 must be safe jumped though, it’s a 6 frame invincible reversal
Like I said this is an early list that doesn’t include oddities like that. It will change as I look into it further. The List also assumes you timed your safe jump well.
Though I the question is not if they wake up faster or slower, but if you still have time to get into position.
I tested the entire characters wakeup time against Akuma’s most used knockdowns (Forward throw, sweep, DF throw, DF palm) and here are the abnormal results:
Adon always wakes up super fast after all knockdowns, hate that guy (around **7 frames faster **than normal).
I’ve only noticed neutral stance whiffs on these characters:
1- Gen (both stances), the jump-in attack pretty much always whiffs when he leaves the stick on neutral, his neutral wakeup animation is slow and weird.
2- Fuerte (doesn’t always whiff)
3- Guy (doesn’t always whiff)
4- Chun Li (the jump-in attack whiffed rarely on her)
I didn’t use a frame counter or anything like that, so the results are estimates and not as accurate as possible:
After a forward throw x 2 dashes (pretty much what Richard already mentioned):
Characters that wakeup 1 frame slower, I just tap down and immediately jump-in roundhouse after the 2nd dash:
Dudley (his 4 frame ex Jet upper will be safejumped)
Seth
Gouken
Viper
Vega
T. Hawk
Sagat (I though he wakes up as slow as Cammy, but the setup worked on him but didn’t on Cammy, maybe it’s a hitbox thing I’m not sure).
Characters that wakeup 2 frames slower, after the 2nd dash I hold down for a tiny bit then jump-in:
Dhalsim
Cammy
Deejay
Balrog
Rose
Characters that wakeup 1 frame faster:
Ibuki (in result her 5 frame EX dragon kick reversal can’t be safejumped after the 2nd dash).
As for the rest of the knockdowns (Sweep, DF throw and palm):
Everyone’s wakeup felt normal except:
1 frame slower:
Sagat
Cammy
2 frames slower:
Blanka
It felt like such a waste of time to test every character’s wakeup time when only 3 were different for the most part, but I’ve got an OCD thing with such things so it’s all good lol
EDIT: Added Ibuki’s faster wakeup time after Akuma’s forward throw, will add any new wakeup time information found in the future.