go play COD, go play counter strike, go play quake live
NONE of these 3d games encompass any kind of input lag to make the games play online. FPS games since 00 have been 3d games and they haven’t used input delay based netcode since 1998 from MY personal EXP.
If alternate 3d developers can make net play with 3d games with no input delay, capcom can too. Its just that they won’t for w\e reason.
@ Shoultzula
I believe inputs in shooting games don’t have to be as percise as inputs in fighting games, especially with adjustable aiming speeds.
GGPO was used for hdr and mvc2? I thought only FF? MvC2 wasn’t perfect son, it was good though
inputs need to be as accurate as fighters for shooters. Imagine if you have 3 guys in a hallway and you can take them all out based on precise inputs. To actually take them all out, that first shot needs to be a head shot. Otherwise once you give up your positioning cause you’re firing, you will have 3 players shooting @ you instead of two.
I don’t know about modern shooters but cs 1.6\source and quake demand accurate input detection and they don’t use input lag in their games.
yes, hdr\mvc2 use ggpo based netcode. Its backbones version of ggpo IIRC.
mvc2\hdr aren’t perfect but they’re sure as hell better than super lag fighter 4 online. With mvc2\hdr online, you can take that combo timing offline and still have it. Take your 10-15 frame input delay combo timing offline for ssf4 and you will drop every combo, with input delay that big you can’t even tech throws on reaction or even attempt to punish footsie because nothing comes out @ the right speed.
even with ggpo, its not perfect. You still have dropped inputs and frame skipping but these 2 things trump input delay every time. ssf4 does use some very small frame skipping, you still get dropped input AND it lags like 10-15 frames extra due to input lag. Input lag for a fighting game, or any game for that matter, belongs in 1998. Not 2011.
Truth, truth. Well, if we ever get a netcode minus input delay for a fg we’ll be good. Like the BlazBlue CT netcode. That netcode was great.
The biggest thing GGPO did was apply the “saving state” concept from online 3D games dating back some 15 years and applied it to fighting games, with the major end goal of eliminating input delay. I play plenty of games online, and the fighting game genre is the only genre where the biggest games (Tekken, SF) use such lazy input-delay based schemes. The fighters that actually try to minimize input delay? Surprise! Made by Western localization devs (e.g. Backbone).
Even if using GGPO verbatim isn’t “possible” within MvC3 (whatever that even means), there is NO REASON why Capcom couldn’t implement something similar.
I mean, aside from them not giving a shit, of course.
HDR nor MvC2 had GGPO. Only FF uses it.
Exactly, I was confused. Thats why FF was a big deal, kinda, iirc
mvc2\hdr are BASED on ggpo netcode. They copied the core parts of ggpo and did a backbone version of it.
Is it ggpo 100%, no but the method that ggpo uses to make fighters playable online is pretty much incorporated into mvc2\hdr.
taken from here
http://www.capcom-unity.com/s-kill/blog/2008/08/29/ggpo_networking_guru_talks_sf_hd_remix_
*Last week I had the opportunity to work with Dan Halpern at Backbone to check in on they’ve networking stack and provide some pointers for improvement. We hooked GGPO up to the same latency simulation tools you’ve read about on Gary’s blog and compared it to STHD. I’m happy to report that the Backbone code held up very well. At all test points, **GGPO measured only slightly better than STHD on the impact latency had on the duration and intensity of the visual glitches causes by the latency hiding code (i.e. the dreaded “rollback” effect). *This is great news for people concerned about the quality of STHD networking. It means that there’s most likely no architectural reason why STHD cannot be as good as or even surpass GGPO when it is released. It also suggests that the reports by some users of GGPO greatly outperforming STHD are most likely a matter of tuning or minor bug fixes. I made two suggestions on how I thought Backbone should spend their time improving their code.
I hope we have an option to boot people from rooms and block them from re-joining sessions. In mvc2 we have too many crazy people wasting my time with online schenanigans right after they ragequit and immediately re-join. I’d appreciate a bit more control over the quality of players in a room at any given time.
http://www.capcom-unity.com/s-kill/blog/2008/08/29/ggpo_networking_guru_talks_sf_hd_remix_
It turns out the timing couldn’t have been more perfect: in August of last year Capcom took notice of GGPO and arranged a meeting where we discussed the technology, how it worked, and particularly why it was ideally suited for arcade games. Other genres have used similar latency hiding techniques, but GGPO is the first to prove that they could be used for the most latency sensitive games, around the world, on the public Internet. Capcom was impressed and convinced Backbone that STHD needed similar technology in order to replicate the arcade experience online.
I don’t know how guys get your information but if you’ve actually played on ggpo for more than 2 minutes and have also played HDR\mvc2 for longer than 2 minutes, the way they act online is pretty identical. You don’t even need to read the article to realize that, you just need to play the games.
Speaking of Capcom-unity, can you make an account and create a petition for people to sign? I tried signing up and its being stupid.
I’m banned from CU so I can’t do it.
a guy did already
They banned you? They got IHS and Clover4Lyf running around there and they ban you? Ah, Unity and your fail.
‘based on’ is certainly different than ‘the same as’. Like I said, there are elements of GGPO that are impossible to replicate on consoles. There are also elements that they’d do good to replicate, tho’.
Also nobody’s really expressing why its worthwhile to bring this up now either. You know what they say:
PS: Shoultz, you’re supposed to [media=youtube]aGbPs5y3oz8"[/media]
its the SAME fucking thing.
the lexus alteeza is a car in japan. Here in the USA, its a lexus is-300. ITS THE SAME FUCKING CAR. However, its just repackaged differently thats all. Same concept here. STHD is ponders idea just redone with the same MAJOR elements there. IT IS GGPO, just very very small tweaks, thats it. He gave him the fucking blue print for god sakes on how ggpo works and you don’t think they’re the same?
sthd\ggpo are extremely similar, 95% IMO.
Oh, look, you two are arguing like fucktards again. What a surprise.
But you just said it wasnt GGPO but based on it. Sooo its still not GGPO. The official GGPO was only used in FF, correct?
if you base over 90% of your code on ggpo, IT IS GGPO. Its not like they took 10% of ponders idea and used 90% from somewhere else. The majority of the programming that makes ggpo work was put into STHD\MVC2, its just that it says backbone instead of ggpo. Its just repackaged thats all. It is indeed ponders code\idea that supports STHD\mvc2 online.
FF I believe was all done by ponder iirc, therefore he was able to attach GGPO on it because backbone didn’t work on it.