How’s my baby Akari doing?
From what I hear it sounds fun. I can’t wait to play it but, I’ll need to wait for a PS2 port. Probably a JPN PS2 port as we all know SCEA’s view on 2-D games.
ive seen ppl doing well with her. shes not the most popular choice but definitely can hold her own.
ill tell you whos female and a right pain in the ass… hotaru. shes got some crazy combos… nice HK cross up too which sets them up. i never played her in motw so im not sure if they are new to nbc or not.
I imagine they took out Akari’s infinite then.
And Hotaru was in MOTW.
;D
I THINK NBC is gonna be awes0me. SNK is doing it real big this time around :party: :tup:
so beelze is this game doing better than 2k3 and neowave at this point?
Is the game solid enough for tourney play?
Are the characters all balanced? i know thier will be tiers, but does it match gulity gears balance as in not much differnce between characters, and unique advantages for each character.
I understand if its to early to answers my questions.
Im looking forward to this game even if i have to wait a year for the port.
XTG
August 10, 2005, 10:50pm
307
beez, im obsessed with this game…ngbc to me equals = blood and i need a tranfusion to stay alive
Any console release in sight?
is this thread about neogeo battle collesium???
it took me a while to figure out what it was about, maybe put the title in brackets for teh newbs (ie me) so they know what it is?
anyways, im excited for anything new right now, capcom, snk, sammy or whatever
rumble fish is coming out for ps2@!
SNKP needs the competition, for sure. Being buddy-buddies with Sammy will only make them lazier.
Im hoping the next time they move to a new board (after KOFXI… i wonder if theyll move to the Aurora board?), they decide to, like… do something .
In the US?
Here are beelzes impression after the official release, from dislike to hate to liking it again (he had played the game a few times on lokes before):
short impressions after 5 or so games today:
graphics seem cleaner, aliasing is the improvement i see but dont quote me on that (or bother to include comparisons of screens to show me that aliasing isnt the word i was looking for…) long story short, the graphics look a little better than the last loke i remember.
gameplay seems pretty tight though im not sure the ebb and flow of the game is gonna lend itself to fun. sure it seems tight, times and damage seem spot on (yes ive only played it for a little so far but it seems quite a bit better than the loke versions i played in terms of the timer, damage levels, tagging, etc) but the tag aspect at this early point as i theorized before seems to lend itself to turtling… ill have to see how it pans out in the cades over the coming months.
havent seen the end boss yet… ill see if i can lay my eyes on him tomorrow.
hit sounds are a little out of place i find, i dont like the lack of tightness which remains the same way it was in the previous loke tests… it doesnt feel kof 2k2 or rb2 tight (or even breakers tight) hard to put my finger on why but i think its the hit boxes and how they match up with the sprites or something related to that… best description i can come up with is blunt (versus the “tight” feel of the games i mentioned above).
im sure itll grow on me and i plan on putting much time into exploriing its depths…
music, didnt notice it becoz i dont give a shit about music. ill keep an ear out for it tomorrow
tight like um… well as loathe as i am to say this the only thing it really reminds me of is svc…
is it cool as fuck? yeah it looks quite nice, cool roster and effects, looks quite polished. do i see the potential for it to make me like it more than rb2? no…
who’s looking strong? saw a fiendish robot guy today (has some strange take a hit then counter/reversal move which seems to really be effective) with big damage, an aa throw, etc. marco is a zoning fiend with grenades that are almost impossible to jump over combined with crazy mixup from a distance with jumping in/the machine gun normal move/ground rocket special, etc… hao does big big damage and can sit back and turtle and do really well…
nah doesnt feel like 2k3… that for god knows what reason feels tight. although its supposedly the same system as svc it doesnt feel like it.
this doesnt feel exactly like svc but thats the closest i can think of in terms of a comparison…
maybe i just need to spend more time on it.
marco and grapplers…? havent seen a battle yet so i cant make even a preliminary call.
nah theyve got really out there movesets. ai does that balloon thing and just sits in the air, youve gotta jump almost straight up to hit her out of it. she also throws those crazy tetris blocks out some that seem to hang others seems to drop… weird.
yuki seems powerful, his in the air electricity drop attack is quite hard to read.
Kikosho
August 11, 2005, 12:32am
312
I hope this game gets a PS2 release. I’ve been dying to play it for a while.
beelzes impressions, continued:
gotta be brutally honest with myself.
this game is screaming shit at me!
i gave it so much of a chance to earn my love at past lokes and for the past two days but my expectations are rapidly sinking.
sure enough as a package it has redeeming features but the two biggest things i want to have done well in a game, havent been imo.
the GAMEPLAY seems to suck at this stage. defensive play rules the day, the characters seem either ass or way too good (yuki is a fiend, he can do a slide move then outprioritize you straight after the friggin thing. he has a fb that is like a takuma palm except it fucking hits the enemy on the other side of the screen. on top of that it has three hits so even if you jump the first there is a big chance of landing on the 2nd or 3rd part…). turtling pays off big and offensive strats are limited with the attacker having get to the other side of the screen with nothing but jump or the two button bar chewing step.
the FEEL also sucks. ive decided (sorry for changing my call after all the svc discussion already ) that this game isnt actually running on the svc engine but rather some totally new engine that sucks. it just isnt refined. the hit boxes seem blocky and it feels like you are controlling a small rectangle rather than a 4 limbed human being. secondly the lights and shit are crappy… the speed is weird, they tend to come out in pairs (feels like the buttons are autofire or something with lights…).
long story short the game is not impressing me by a long shot at this point, remember the above is purely my opinion and only given as info for those interested
if you like the feel of 2k2, rb2 or breakers for example then you prolly wont like the FEEL of this. you might like the system, the roster, the music (which i couldnt hear in the arcade sorry spin), etc, etc but you almost certainly wont like the FEEL.
everytime i comment on sprites, music and the rest i preface my words with shit like “remember im far from an expert on the subject” or the like, why becoz IM FAR FROM AN EXPERT ON THE SUBJECT. unlike you i dont post that info to establish some cult of personality on this board or any board… i do it coz ive got access to the games long before most who visit here purely coz i live in japan, secondly coz im motivated enough to get on the scene first and then go out of my way to take notes for hours then come and spend an hour or two posting them up here.
once again not for admiration or ego inflation but becoz i love fighting games, in particularly neo ones and it GIVES ME PLEASURE at the same time as feeding the fans a little bit of scott tinted info.
ok as i complete my third day of play my opinion has swayed once again. for hmkays sake i will clarify why.
takes a long time for me to make my mind up about how i feel about a new fighting game, you know whether i enjoy it or not. and what i put here is mostly my opinion as im not into analyzing the more technical aspects like frames and sprites…
anyways i went into monte to get some real comp and was pleasantly surprised! the whoring of what i consider cheezy tactics was not to be found and i had good games! still the FEEL of the game is as i said before and jake said just above different and definitely not tight or sharp enough for my liking…
however the GAMEPLAY grew on me. the way the game makes rushing down important but first you need to gain the momentum, if you can do that you can keep rushing down. it doesnt have the myriad of options kof does for breaking the opponents defence though so its not too hard to withstand an assault. i did well with tung and mr big who are both getting easier to use (tung really gave me the shits at first lacking the c.C he has in rb2 etc) and who knows i may even end up enjoying the game GAMEPLAY wise.
EDIT dont know if this is new info or not but iori has a super where he jumps up at a really sharp angle and falls down ala tizocs dp+P jumping neck throw in 2k3. havent seen it hit though… looks sorta silly.
You can see that DM in one of the videos on the official site. It looks pretty cool when it hits, actually. It looks like the KOF96 ending, where you see Ioris sillhouette ripping Vice and Mature appart…
yeah its still growing on me
but something as deep as a fighting game takes time to fully understand, i go through love/hate phases depending on what sort of tactics are getting used in competitive play and how well im doing.
currently favoured characters: kim and kaede
currently favoured fighting style: whoring lp/lk combos into supers (eg kims lk->three hit kick from ground into air move->air super). both kaede and kim have easy ones plus kim can jump from miles and cross up easily with lp while kaede has that three hit move which he is virtually completely safe after.
the article says that the double assault is only for yuki and ai, doesnt mean more arent hidden.
havent seen anyone play athena, i have fought her a few times though.
1p game sucks if you ask me. you have one energy bar and one timer. everytime you beat three teams you can choose a continue options style option like extra time or heal damage. basically its sorta like survival mode or something so you are so busy conserving energy you cant really muck around and try out combos.
the games new system is weird, the angle of the jumps, the height of the jumps and the system itself makes it very easy to hit ppl out of the air as they jump over you. you are free as though you had walked under to try and hit them as they pass over. stops the intense cant do anything but block kof style of game which i think is good. makes the games tactics considerably different to kof and takes power away from iori, kyo, kim, etc and gives tung and the like more chance.
im getting used to tung slowly… his four supers are the giant beam (fbx2+C) which requires three bars, one similar to his turn into a giant and chop one in rb2 but a little different (fbx2+K) which is ok but unfortunately doesnt seem to hit despite comboing into a normal move (im trying to find a super that hits once comboed into tungs “bash punch and the giant spirit forms above him” move as its ridiculously easy to hit with (as an aa for example) and easy to combo into as you have som much time to do it while you are bashing the buttons. his 3rd and 4th supers are his turn into a giant and spin supers one which does it on the spot the other moves forward. they are not listed on the cab though so ill have to try some different inputs to find them.
marco is rad… ive found him easy to pick up and fun to play. his grenades are crazy good, they control the air and roll along the ground (and are hell hard to see as they do)…
more later!
More whining from people at neo-geo.com took place at this point, with people saying that a person should only post opinions about a fighting game after a long time playing it. Which is ludicrous, considering hes not reviewing the game, just giving first impressions (hell, everybody wants to read about new games asap…). Having someone that cares, lives in Japan and can post impressions in english is a privilege, really.
And who has never changed their mind about games before? Remember when everybody said SF3 sucked?
the feel still sucks, that opinion has not changed to this date. no way tung feels as nice as he does in rb2. that has to do with the games engine and the way hes been transplanted.
i said “at this stage” being fully aware my opinion would most likely change.
had 10 or so games today.
kim was again being used by alot of ppl as was kaede.
tung doesnt seem to be able to connect any of his supers in the middle of his anti air spirit attack
im getting better with him though and i see his potential to be a strong character. his weakpoint which was so accurately pointed out in the latest arcadia is his miniscule range. c.LKx2 will put you out of range to link a c.HK which i combo his qcb+A dash punch into to keep the pressure on with. c.LKx1 doesnt really give you time to link near as easily as doing two does.
the gcfs seems well implemented. ppl do it in the middle of supers but no one is using it to whore throws ala svc and although its way to early to say how it will balance out in the end (useless, good or broken) it seems well balanced at this stage.
throws when whiffed cost bar i think, one thing is the whiff animation is very long, you are left open for what seems like a full second so be sure with your throws otherwise kim will c.LK you into a huge combo ending with a cancelled super!
c.LKx2 with tung (or nearly anyone for that matter)->dash->throw is a great tactic which feels awesome to pull off!
tagging is working really well at this stage. theyve (snkp) obviously learnt their lesson with 2k3. you have plenty of chances to tag out and you can do it while blocking which works like a CD counter in kof. you only really get shafted before you can tag when you risk keeping a character with like 25% health in and then the guy combos you and does enough damage to kill you outright with that much energy. you can really ramp your rush down game up when the opponent has only a sliver of energy left and they are desperately trying to tagout. that can be a really fun situation (and intense).
marco is good but his normals sorta suck… for the best with his mixup options being crazy with the ground missle and grenade moves. if he had a nice ryu style c.HK hed be a nightmare on the rushdown (not to say he already isnt good at rushing down!) hes all about rushing in as the grenade rolls along the ground or whistles through the air.
geese, asura, akari, moriya, etc arent getting used at all where i play. i saw a guy really doing well with chonshu and chonrei today. that big fireball that sits in one place is great for setting up a rush down on an opponent as they wakeup. hes got lots of mixup options after it too.
hanzos air teleport is really good. he can basically just drop out of the air above you and kick or punch on the way down.
used terry today and though hes pretty vanilla moveset wise hes relatively powerful with great normals (though they stuck with the 2k3 no cancelling into c.HK grrrrrrrrrrrrr).
load times are ok though add to that the fact there is fucking about with card reading and a screen to decide whether you want to use one or not (with a 10 second timer) and well it can take a while to get into the friggin game!
hyper charge, auto charge, the timer and damage all seem to be nicely balance at (once again) this stage. it is certainly holding up much better than svc and even 2k3 by this point…
the major vid posting sites (kohatsu, acho, etc) havent got any info about tourneys in the near future so it might be a while till vids turn up (japanese players only take vids of tourneys and games that are on test as a rule so…). maybe eight one will be kind enough to do a vid…?
On the subject of blurry sprites (which i also hate - ill take jaggies over blur any day), the home port shold have the same option as NeoWave, where you could select between 6 versions of sprites, from really sharp to really blurry.
yeah blurry for sure. my opinion on that certainly hasnt changed since day one. i dont like it but it does seems slightly sharper than the loke versions. bad thing is kof xi looks exactly the same
must be something to do with transplanting the sprites onto the new hardware…
speed is spot on if you ask me… i like slower games, this is faster than cfj id say.
dont worry the system will prolly grow on you. took at least 50+ games to grow on me…
well i wouldnt say popular… im hoping itll last longer than cfj but in the place i regularly play they only have 2 back to backs rather than the 4 nw has or the 4 that cfj started with (cfj is now gone ). there are lots of challenges to be had though.
today i spent about 2+ hours playing it.
k, iori, kim can all do really well ala kof, this game is a completely new engine (seemingly) but they still do well in the hands of good kof players.
is genjuro gonna be a problem? played a guy using him today who absolutely raped with him in the corner. he can basically just do c.LP or maybe its a s.LP (im not sure as i havent used him) into fb and rinse repeat almost forever. stepping doesnt seem to help, i saw one guy super out of it between the fb and the next c.LP but that requires bar and a super that will get you out of the sitch. it was pretty irritating.
geese can do the same thing but its not quite as effective by using c.LKx2->fb and repeat. in both cases the fb doesnt seem to push you out of range so they can just keep doing it only needing to dash in after a fb to keep the cycle up…
early days of course but snkp seem to have created an incredibly offensive game finally with nbc.
turtling doesnt pay off in this game, the system makes normals hard to use as reliable anti airs and jumping fireballs is much easier with the wider play feel and easy dash jumps. everyone is playing this rush down and almost nothing else (except for a bit of runaway with marco, hanzo, etc).
hao prolly doesnt have much of a rush down game nor genjuro. hao makes up for it with a HP that hits from almost half a screen away with decent recovery and that does 25% of your bar or thereabouts!! his jump straight up HP also does crazy damage and is almost impossible to out prioritize. genjuro has a crazy corner game that is very very hard to get out of. sure manuevering the opponent into the right position is hard but thats where the skill required to play genj, hao and for that matter marco lies…
i used rock a bit today… he feels nice though ive never used him in motw. seems cool enough.
robert rocks! man i havent wanted to use him since like 98 but he looks cool and plays really nice in nbc. he’s a bit of a rush down beast and has so many close range options with his f/b+K/P moves. his new super fb looks awesome (miles better than ryos imo) and his new fb is pretty cool looking too.
ive always been a ryo man but he feels a bit weird in this, might drop him for rob this year
had a marathon sesh of nbc today, 2 hours or so with time on the machine being at least 1.5 hours…
first off, haomaru ROCKS!!! shit i never bothered to give him a try expecting him to be badly translated (didnt like his feel in cvs2) and feel clunky. woah was i wrong. hes speedier and more manueverable than youd expect. he has great c.LK which he can combo his dp or his dp super into (really easy and feels great!!) his s.HP is awesome as it has crazy 2/3 screen range and decent recovery.
good tactics are jumping straight up and HP in the air as air defence as his priority with his j.HP is sweet.
his j.HK is awesome and compares to say ryo in 2k2s j.HK. feels really nice, much more solid and shoto style than i expected… j.HK->c.LKx2->dp super works iirc and feels just like ryu or something
his s.LK is also awesome (its his s.MS in ss) has great range and decent recovery.
lastly he looks pretty cool and different.
also gave iori a stab… fuckin why is this guy so goddamned good???
snkp just hand the kof sheep characters like iori on a platter in pretty much every game he makes an appearance. how on paper mudman or washizuka compare i dont FUCKING know…
his j.NORMALS are all great. his j.LK has range, priority and active time. his j.HP is decent, his j.HK is great as always and even his goofy looking j.LP is decent. on top of that ALL of those can be comboed into fairly easily where as tung for example has maybe 2 air normals that can be comboed into and even then the timing is much stricter.
his combos do damage and are so easy to pull off (c.LPx2=>three hit move or c.HPs.HP->three hit move) add to that the great recovery on his fb, a good c.HK and s.HK, a command throw and the way his pillar of energy super works now (comes out as a super fast or slow fb and when it hits the pillar appears) well he’s just a beast…
why the hell doesnt he, kyo, KIM and maybe even k get toned down?
iori has some choice colors btw, think i might see if i can whore him just to be a bitch
Asked on Mr. Karate (Ryo) having two Hien Shippu Kyakus:
he has (mr karate):
ryos kof super punch that stuns.
ranbu.
super fb.
some sort of thing that looks like the super punch but he doesnt actually do the punch, then you push buttons and he does some what seem to be normals… have not idea how this super works and havent seen anyone use it (to be honest he isnt a very popular choice…).
well it sorta looks like a zero forward movement deadly rave. thing is i havent seen anything beyond a what i assume is random normal with some sort of shadowing on it. that is what makes me think its a deadly rave style thing… then again it could be a reversal…
IORI huh. well hes overpowered (just came back from getting a 9 win streak, my first on this game i might add) using iori for virtually my first ever time.
ive only seen his new super once, he jumped up in an arc sorta like tizocs jump grab in kof2k3 but using his hands rather than his feet… thing is it missed so thats all i saw. ill have to try it myself tomorrow.
his standard rush forward beat down super is unchanged from what i can tell and now his freeze you in a pillar of energy super comes out as something that looks like his standard fb except when it actually hits the opponent at which point it becomes a pillar. faster but easier to get over than the 98?? version of the super.
he may still have his chaos reversal super or the dp super from kof 97 or whichever one it was… im not sure… i dont know if he has the rush super follow ups either…
im a total iori noob to be honest though im sure you figured that out much earlier in my post
so beelze is this game doing better than 2k3 and neowave at this point?
Is the game solid enough for tourney play?
Are the characters all balanced? i know thier will be tiers, but does it match gulity gears balance as in not much differnce between characters, and unique advantages for each character.
I understand if its to early to answers my questions.
Im looking forward to this game even if i have to wait a year for the port.
balanced enough for tourneys? = a sure yes at this point. 2k3 and svc were pretty obviously not tourney worthy after about a month of time in the arcades… this game on the other hand seems very solid.
tiers will exist but the difference between powerful and weak seems considerably less than kof2k3 for example.
popularity wise, better than 2k3… hard to say. better than nw… no unfortunately. nw started off with 4 back to back cabinets and got play for at least 3 months solid. this game is getting play but only has 2 back to back setups…
THANKS TIMESTOP!
No problem.
Heres something i posted in a different thread that fits here:
Each other boss has a set number of things you have to do:
Number of adversaries defeated.
Number of times you used the bonus.
Number of continues.
Number of Double Assaults.
Ammount of life your team has left.
King Lion:
6
1
1
up to four (?)
Neo-Dio:
6
2
0
5 or more
Goodman:
8
0
0
7 or more
50% or more
Neo-Dio, Mizuchi and Lion give you generic endings. Only Goodman gives you the real endings (i dont think anyone has beaten him yet, so we dont know if theyre only for the real teams or whatever… well probably have to wait for NGBCs mook to find out).
Still tossing up wether or not to order this in for my cabinet setup in my friends store… signs are good though considering the game for now anyway is fairly balanced and not KOF 03 all over again.
I look forward to hearing more and more reviews, cheers Beelze!
hey beelze b thanks for answering my questions.
Yea i hope the game continues to do well and nobody finds some stupid Infinite combo or something that makes the game slack.
I guess i will have to check your reports over the next 2 or 3 months to see how things go.
If it does well enough snk could have a new franchise on their hands and give kof a break, good lord knows it been doing overtime.
Yea time stop thanks for showing how you get to bosses, hard requirements it seems like most snk games.
Still i’ll problay forget all that by the time the port gets out, so ill have to ask you again.
Ha they will problay add rugal as a boss, then another 4 others if their following trend with recent ports.
Hell 5 more characters could actually make the port better than the orginal or totaly mash it up lol.
talking of the mook any news on that?, and also when is the SoundTrack comming out?
Yea i really like the art to this game, i would get the mook alone just for the art.
Ive seen some of the in game art that one of orochi, which i think comes on just before you fight him is problay the best orochi art ive seen.
well thanks again beelze :tup:
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