you can also randomly jump out of the tick fab attempt from the super stomp… I’ll admit to not thinking that that’d work.
too bad that this game doesnt have a competitive scene but oh well
The reason Zero is good isn’t because of the infinite. And Geese is better because he can zone just about as well, is safer, takes less damage, deals more…he’s a souped up version of NGBC and Wild Ambition Geese…the similarly powerful 2K2 version for console was based off of him. Really all that needs to be said. Anyone that plays SvC knows Geese is tops under the four boss characters.
My thing is if Zero is so powerful and so abusive, then there should be plenty of match vids abusing his brokeness on YT, Youku or Nico video, right?
Right?
In short: match vids plz
Oh, THAT version…don’t like or know that version very much, but I didn’t know Angela was “broken”. What is wrong with her?
Chun has good normals, but she doesn’t have any good combos that don’t involve a SA. She can wear you down with pokes and throws but can’t really do any serious damage until she has a SA. The tough part is that she builds meter very quickly, but until that happens, she’s stuck just trying to poke at you or throw you and hope that you can’t suss out the mixup.
Yun, same deal. He has a really hard time mounting viable offense without GJ. Plus he has really low stamina so a character like Mak or Ken can make short work of him if he can’t pull a GJ together.
If you think I’m wrong, watch a video of any good player playing either of these two characters and you’ll notice that a large part of their strategy involves getting and maintaining meter.
This whole cult of Yun and Chun being these unbeatable god-tier characters in 3s really needs to stop. >_<
Zazie > Ray > Jean > Lee > Karnov
If someone’s close to being god tier in that game, that’s Zazie.
As for O.Sagat, he’s probably the worst of the top tiers (including Chun) and he still requires a lot of skill to win, it’s not like everyone uses him like Choi. People just see a lot of tigers and think he’s broken, mostly because they don’t play the game. Dee Jay rapes a lot of the same characters he rapes and nobody calls him broken. Also he’s allowed in Japan and there’s like one player who is truly good with him (Muneo). Noguchi used to use him from time to time and he definitely plays better with Fei and Vega.
WW Guile has to be the most broken character in a competitive fighting game ever, with all the glitches and stuff.
I thought Ray was supposed to be all-around best character? Zazie second, and Karnov third? I don’t see how in the hell Lee and Jean are above Karnov, at all.
What about UMK3 or MKII?
It’s Ray>Karnov>Lee>Zazie>Jean. I’ve seen people put Lee over Karnov cause of Lee’s combo’s though.
I know Zazie is supposed to be pretty high because dash ~ hellfire is so stupid, and pretty safe to boot. I knew Lee was high, but I don’t think he was ever regarded top three.
The grand finals of Brawl at PAX were Metaknight vs Metaknight. thumbs up
Metaknight Da Bess
[media=youtube]ZVFpRQdOuQ0[/media]
According to some older Jap tier list Lee was always in top 3. Lee does a lot damage from his combos. He has an infinite but the timing is pretty strict. Player 1 Lee has unblockables against certain characters. If you land his b, f, db, df + A+B consistant you can dish out some insane damage. It’s also possible to keep them in block stun and chip with that special. Dash hellfire is good but if done too close it’s a free grab/trip against Zazie. The tiers are always up for debate but top 5 is almost always: Ray, Karnov, Lee, Zazie and Jean. Most would agree that they are the best all around characters and easy to pick up for the most part. Mizo is also very good and probably tied with Jean for the 5th spot. He does require some practice to land his more advanced combos but once you do he can dish out great damage.
Bao is generally amazing in the KOF games he’s in, but I recall him being really bullshit in KOF99, at least on the dreamcast. Block reflector=full meter. Add that to really good mobility, really good fireball game, and some crazy supers, he’s easily the best character I’ve ever dealt with in that game.
However, Yun builds meter quite well, usually finishing GJ combos with about half a bar of meter.
godlike
People think Karnov is the best because they see baloon shenanigans and think there’s no way to counter them. Well, the rest of the top tiers have good answers to baloon pressure, I think Karnov goes at disadvantage against the other big four. He has great combos and pressure and teleport and shit, but the rest of the top is more well rounded up.
Zazie is just a beast when someone with good execution uses him. Dash hellfire is beastly and a lot of characters just don’t have good (or any) answers to it. Safe, fast, invincible anti-air anti-ground attack… you do the math. His pressure game is just insane. Add to that that he can take off like +70% out of a combo, and great normals and you have a contender for god tier.
Ray comes close but IMO wheel kick isn’t as stupid as dash hellfire. Basically any character can bait and duck under them, plus some characters have good answers to his zoning (Lee’s fast rushes, Jean’s slide, Karnov’s teleport, Zazies dashes)… and he doesn’t rape as many characters as much as Zazie does in my experience. Jean and Lee for example, great characters that can hang with (or beat) Ray and Karnov are just free for Zazie. And Ray’s zoning isn’t that hot against Zazie’s dash Hellfires.
Jean is the best defensive character in the game. Great zoning, great flashkick that’s pretty hard to punish, godly normals (if cr.HP did chip damage it could be a dp special move as it is), devastating dizzy combos, good pressure with ABCD…
And Noc summed Lee up pretty well.
crono, you really give zazie too much credit…
the top 4 are too close to make crazy summations about them. at the end of the day all our knowledge comes from the 10 or so good FHD players that are scattered around the americas + a few japanese. its easy to fall into the trap of describing the character based on your personal experiences against him in the hands of one maybe 2 players.
wow…this is hilarious.
I know these aren’t competitive games, but I figured I’d toss these out there for discussion since we’re on the subject of broken fighting game characters.
First up is Sanji from Jump Super Stars. For those who don’t know, JSS and it’s sequel Jump Ultimate Stars use a “deck” that is made up of manga panels stuck together like a puzzle on the touch screen, 4x5 spaces large, and there’s 3 kinds of Characters. Help Characters are 1 tile characters which in JSS give buffs/healing and stuff, and in JUS give passive bonuses like increased SP gain. Support Characters are assists and are 2-3 tiles big, and your actual playable characters, Battle Characters, are 4-8 tiles big. Naturally larger sized battle characters have more HP, and occasionally have more powerful/effective supers, but that isn’t always the case.
Sanji in JSS is one of such cases where his 4 tile piece is his most effective. See, one of his supers (and you start matches in JSS/JUS with full super bars and gain them back ridiculously fast) grants him a buff that increases his damage output based on how many female characters are in your deck. I don’t know the exact damage output, but lets say his basic B&B combo does 30 damage total normally. With an optimally built deck consisting of one 2 tile female Support character (since you have to have one of each kind of character), Sanji 4 tile and everyone else being 1 tile females, he’ll do 80 damage. It’s that much of an increase, because they neglected to implement a cap to this easily increased buff. This is enough to KO any character in the entire roster with a maximum of 3 B&B combos. Additionally, several of those 1 tile Help characters in your Sanji deck can be used to heal him a little.
Secondly, lets talk about the top 3 characters in Jump Ultimate Stars, the sequel to the above game. You could say that they’re all broken in their own ways. Taikoubou and Dio beat everything, including the third, Yusuke, but Yusuke also beats everything else below him. This is in a game with 40+ characters.
Yusuke is nicknamed Bsuke for a reason, because his 5B (JUS uses B, Y, X) has the most priority out of any normal in the entire game. At close range, he beats everything. It’s fast, it has god priority, and it easily sets up into a B&B that deals enormous damage. He also has a fairly quick to charge projectile that is very large and very powerful and can combo out of his B&B (since his B&B ends in a distant launch and you can’t air block in JUS) and will break the guard of most characters if fully charged (and if fully charged, it’s as large as the screen).
Taikoubou is a wall of projectiles, basically. He has a very quick, very long range, but low damaging projectile. A mid-range, moderately strong projectile that hits both above and forward. A mid-range anti-air projectile that also hits taller grounded characters and does moderate damage. And another long range, but not as quick projectile. The best part? HE CAN COMBO WITH THEM! But that’s not all, one of his supers is like more powerful, larger version of that first projectile, and his other super lets him create a tornado on the ground that stays in play for several seconds and if they block, you can rush in and guard break them, and lead into another combo. Oh, and he has a 2x juggle with one of the fastest close-range attacks in the game and he can then combo it into his wall of projectiles. Pretty much the ONLY thing that beats that attack is, well, Yusuke’s 5B, which we’ve already established is the best close range attack in the game. Literally the only thing Taikoubou doesn’t excel at is that he has low HP.
Dio (Of Jojo’s Bizarre Adventure fame) can either be overpowered or just flat out broken, depending on whether the player is cheating or not (and the random server just looooves to cheat, bastards). Dio, like Taikoubou, has a pair of awesome projectiles that are both fast and powerful, and can be comboed. However, he definitely doesn’t slouch at close-range either. However, Dio’s true power lies in his supers, which, again, you start with full super bars and gain them back very quickly in JUS. His first super is a rapid punching super using his Stand (anyone who has played/read JJBA should know what I’m talking about). This is, without a doubt, the most powerful and effective attack in the entire game. It has 1/3 screen range, deals 50 damage (which is a LOT in JUS, even more when you combo into it), beats the opponent around for a few seconds (which allows you to work a Support in there somewhere) but BEST OF ALL it has absolutely 0 start-up time, it comes out the instant you hit the X button. Whiff/get blocked? No problem! You can stop it and start it back up with less than a second in between. Oh, and it also has some of the highest priority of any attack in the game. Not to mention that it has a lot of ringout power as well.
But that’s not all Dio has. Oh no, people who have played JJBA should be familiar with ZA WARUDO, wherein he STOPS FREAKING TIME. It takes about 2 seconds to do it, but you’re not gonna do it unless you’re safe. It lasts about 4 or 5 seconds, and you can beat the opponent around at your leisure during that time. And yes, again, you gain super bars back VERY quickly in JUS. However, as I said, cheating is very prominent on random Wi-Fi. More specifically, the infinite supers cheat. You know what’s worse than someone stopping time? Someone stopping time, poking you, stopping time again while time is stopped, poking you again, stopping time again, repeat until you are dead.
But again, these aren’t exactly competitive games…
Hiei is up there too thanks to his broken hitboxes and his Black Dragon Super. If you’re near or off the ledge and he has super, kiss that character bye.
But honestly, some of the supports are just as broken, namely Trunks3 (Instant and buys you out of combos), Seiya3 (Brutal overhead that sets up for combos), Senya3 (Stops you in place), Whistle girl whose name I forgot (Takes meter away and can edge guard with it), and that one dude from Hitman who throws you off the ledge if he catches you.
I could go on, this game has alot of brokeness.