The King Thread

CJxxx · February 21, 2013, 9:38am

Ogre is super annoying. I try to get meter before I play King against Ogre because I can ex tomahawk/swing through his strings for some free damage. Also, any tricky setups for B+Mk? I find it really hard to setup/hit with. I end up wiffing a lot and just eating full combos, which speaks more about me as a player than it does about the move.

SynKyller · February 22, 2013, 9:30pm

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/43712/CJxxx">CJxxx</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>Ogre is super annoying. I try to get meter before I play King against Ogre because I can ex tomahawk/swing through his strings for some free damage. Also, any tricky setups for B+Mk? I find it really hard to setup/hit with. I end up wiffing a lot and just eating full combos, which speaks more about me as a player than it does about the move. </div></blockquote>I use disrespectful kick ALOT. Try to use it at max range so it can be
safe. I also use it to punish whiff crouching roundhouses from
characters, especially the shotos. Also you can charge up RASC and dash
out of it once you get the red lighting bolt so you can get the Counter
Hit for Disrespectful kick. Most people think you’re trying to build
meter, nhaw son, Im trying to get that CH so I can set you up with more
damage on my magic series into dudley coming in or trying to set you up
for my pandoraDudley.

ShADoW_NoBODy · February 23, 2013, 11:43am

If you get B+Mk CH the best thing to do with some teammates is just raw launcher then combo since it is unscaled. Get loads of damage. Such as doing CH B+mk, Launcher, Combo into Cross Art is roughly 660 damage for me if I happen to have 3 meters lying around.<div> </div><div>CH Shoulder tackle you can pandora or add a Knee then pandora. </div>

CJxxx · February 23, 2013, 3:03pm

Yeah, usually what I do is get the counter hit pandora to cody, crouching fierce -> ex zonk -> fierce -> super. Or if I have the corner, you’re gonna eat mad damage.

SynKyller · February 23, 2013, 7:46pm

had a reall good conversation with Kelvin Jeon Yesterday about King. Basically it started because he did a tier list and posted on FB (http://www.mmcafe.com/tiermaker/sfxt/index.html?tc=ya0-trjsaigxfpd04filfpk6cdgmaiilcd8qe1bzibaefp72e1gxe1c08tdzaigxcddnibig8vlucddpcdgs77k377anai5oaiaee1k48vig77ac8uc2e18zai7baic2cdbc4f8o8uc076hp4h8o76jc4h00gy00gy5lk000im00imlwe1ac76do76aecddqfpc2fpdo8ui8aik9e1dqe1gs8vile1cbai-bkg-naKelvin) and I asked him about King. One of his teams is Law/King and we just started talking about King. <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>So no to the knee lift after
launcher. What you think is a better thing to do with king after a launcher?
Ive been using C.LP > C.MK> Fierce XX RJB<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>its good damage, and good set up
aftetwwards

<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton</a>ok<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin</a>yeah eliminate all those normals

just one, i know it’s not fun or
flashy

but it gest the job done very well

since st.fierce moves him forward
too<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>ok <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>

do you know the set up after srk
punch<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton
Doutherd</a>

which one? The crossover with J.MK?
Or another one?<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin</a> so you can back up and do j.mk for
that 50/50

you can also hold jump forward after
lading the hit

n.jump and fierce

while you’re doing that, you can do
qcf punch (or ex one for gaurantee) for option select backdash

this doesnt work well against people
with dp<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>OHH I lke that<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>

if they have dp, it’s better to do
empty jump

to bait it out

but characters like jin, they cant’
do much about it

for dp, you can do n.empty jump into
KK

if they dp, you miss completely

and punish

and remember that

if they block your n.j fierce<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>yea I saw that. a king player do
that on Eduardo not to long ago. Ed’s Dudley was on a pixel and got slamed into
the corner. The king player did a KK on his wake up and Ed went for a jet
upper. Missing him and got jabbed for a KO.<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>

you have an option to go qcf kick
grab

because people are 90% likely to
crouch after they block a jump attack

yee1

!<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>

About that… I always do the Kick
Command Grab after a Jumping roundhouse or fierce because like you said, 90%
block low after a jumping attack. <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>

nice nice

so you already know ;D <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>

I also came up with to do that more
then Giant swing as a punish. Most people Crouch more against King because they
know the GS whiffs on Crouching. so I do the Tomahawk to train them to stand up
more so I can get Giant Swing them more.<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>

uhhhhh

not good with names

whats tomahawk?

and giant swing <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>

Also Both GS/Tomahawk… Tomahawk
is the QCF command grab

<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>which one? <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton</a>Giant Swing is the QCF command grab
with punch <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>

kick or punch?<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>

Tomahawk is the one with Kick

<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”> </a><a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin</a>

got it!

for me,

i don’t do command grabs at all with
king

more of footsie-style<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton </a>

Both GS/Tomahawk at the EX verisions
is FULL BODY INVUL. I found that out when I tried to EX Tomahawk a nina player
and she went into her Super and it wiffted completely <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>command grab for kills or at the
very end :x

yeah man

it’s good

good against DPs too<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”> </a><a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313”>Shelton</a>

I feel the same way but the grappler
player in me always feel like I have to put hands on them. LOL

im slowly making it where I find my
marks and grab them. his Light versions of both grabs do more damage then
Zangief and Hugos heavy grabs. SO I gotta use them from time to time <a href=“https://www.facebook.com/kelvin.jeon”>Kelvin </a>yep agreed

ShADoW_NoBODy · February 24, 2013, 12:08am

Interesting stuff. I wonder why he feels he’s so low.

NovaFRC · February 28, 2013, 3:14pm

What are King’s best options against people who like to back dash? I’ve tried EX Swing and EX Konvict Kick, neither of which have the range. I’m having a hard time pursuing people after they pressure and just backdash out.<div> </div><div>King has some trouble with Asuka, in my opinion. Her buttons are really good, she does a ton of damage, and she has a lot of options to pressure you on wake-up between lows, overheads, cross-up jumps and her command grab. I’ve been having a lot of trouble with her, because she can backdash out of a lot of her better strings.</div>

ShADoW_NoBODy · March 1, 2013, 2:36am

Ex Gs and KK actually do catch backdashes. Maybe you’re doing them slow or you’re just doing it against the longest reaching backdashes at far range.<div> </div><div>Btw, what’s everyone’s favorite things to do in neutral game? I like to use LK kk, Cr. Mk, Far. Lk A lot.</div>

NovaFRC · March 1, 2013, 11:39am

Yeah, it’s usually against a long back dash at a far range - more specifically Asuka, but I don’t have a lot of match-up knowledge yet, so I don’t know who else it doesn’t work on.<div> </div><div>In the neutral, I’m pretty patient. Far LK, cr.MK. Other than that, I try to bait jump-ins, or bait people to over commit. Once people start getting too scared to jump in, I start poking with max range HK if I want Giant Swing, or Far LK Shining Wizard. I also go for cross-up j.MK if people are close enough and have bad AAs.</div>

SynKyller · March 1, 2013, 9:55pm

ive been watching some japanese King Gameplay (well from what I can find) and Ive been emulating using crouching Mp alot in the footies game. it punishes whiffed normals and can trade with some air attacks or be an unexpecting anti-air. Also you can go into Magic Series or into C.MP > C.HP into EX KK > KL (X2 or X3). on another note. USE Jaguar step!!! I’m using Jaguar step a LOT now up close. Its a guessing game for the opponent. Most people think your going to do the High elbow drop or lariat. do a water surface kick and then the next time you do JS, they won’t know if your going high or low. Some times I even just do the JS and nothing then regular grab. Its a mind fuck move. Ive even do it on wake up if they try to DP, Grab or tick me to death and go with a punish afterwards. My take on this. GS should only be use to catch backdashes or to stop frame traps (looks over to Hwoarang, lilli and Chun). NEVER WAKEUP GS Unless you have one hell of a read. Tomahawk is use to catch people off guard (90% of the people crouch against King because they KNOW King Players are going to do GS. The only time they even stand up is when they see King do his JS.) EX Tomahawk EVERYTHING! #Combofiend JS = Hakan’s BDnC. Shit is too good not to be used.

ShADoW_NoBODy · March 2, 2013, 4:31am

<div>Yeah GS Tomahawk aren’t that good. Too situational and even then they’re so slow and can be thrown ex or not. I think EX Gs is really good in neutral when people are trying to control space with standing pokes or just standing. The main problem I have with an EX cmd grab reversal is you’re still guessing if that frame trap will have them standing or crouching at the time it hits since it’s so slow. I cannot state how much I hate how slow his command grab is even if it has decent recovery. </div><div> </div>I would like JS more if it had a backwards version like in TTT2. I don’t think it’s as good as you think because once someone learns the timing it will get beat every time. It’s not safe even when you do nothing because it has recovery. I like it vs long recovery pokes and I rarely use it outside of on wake up to bait Dps because it always gets beat.

GeeseHoward · March 2, 2013, 5:01am

I love the jaguar step, but, I dont know if at higher levels its as good. There are three options: Clothesline (Hits High), Elbow Drop (Hits Crouch block characters) and Sweep (Hits Low). Now, correct me if i’m wrong, but does Clothesline hit crouch blocking opponents? because if it doesn’t, all the other character has to do is crouch block low. If its the Clothesline, it will whiff, and then they can punish. If its Sweep they will block it. If its the Elbow Drop, they just need to wait til hes in the air, then low jab him out of it. So there is really no reason to block high, right? Cuz all they have to do is look out for the elbow and then once in the air, they can jab…<div> </div><div>The only good thing about it, again, IIRC, is if the clothesline hits high on crouchblock characters so that I can at least get a string together to keep me safe. But most of the time when I try to mix it up with the elbow drop, I have to be really early, and by then they can either roll out of the way or anti-air me.</div><div> </div><div>When do you guys use the Jaguar Step?</div><div> </div><div>Also, one thing that bugs me, not just about King, is that if your character has a long startup move, then an opponents jab will get you out of that situation…</div><div> </div><div>Any tips against crossups? I love Kings Anti Airs, but they dont seem to be as effective when people are crossing you up, only when they are right in front of you…</div><div> </div><div>And last, any tips against Juri? </div><div> </div><div>Thanks fellas</div>

ShADoW_NoBODy · March 2, 2013, 5:17am

Lariat (clothesline) is unsafe on block (-9) so it’s not really useful to use outside of going for a punish. And that’s my main problem with Jag Step. Every option is punishable on block and they can hit you out of all of them. If Lariat was safe on block or relatively safe I would be ok with it because then I could just space it right and keep pressure or something. <div style=“font-family: Arial, Verdana; font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal;”> </div><div style=“font-family: Arial, Verdana; font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal;”>Your best bet for cross ups is to backdash, Jag step, Block. St. Cl. mp sometimes but not as reliable. </div><div style=“font-family: Arial, Verdana; font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal;”> </div><div>For juri Jaguar step is your best friend against her fireballs because she has to charge them and even if she thinks she can wait and release to try and catch it you can just continue the jaguar step to go through it. However Jagstep still has recovery/start-up when you do it consecutively so if she does ex Pinwheel on wake up and you try to jagstep past it you can still be beat out. </div><div> </div><div>I would like to state while trying to find things for king I completely mindfucked myself. I did forward throw in the corner held upforward, J.HP, Land, Shoulder tackle. Sometimes it would cross up, sometimes I would rollmyself into the corner. I couldn’t get it to remain consistent outside of having it set to record/replay. Even then it wasn’t always hitting the same side.</div>

SynKyller · March 2, 2013, 8:34pm

EMP|Jeron was on facebook yesterday talking about his SFxT tier list; “My Cross Tekken version 2013 temporary tier list! Its still early for this but this is to get an idea of the tiers for 2013 as I have done them in the past. S:ChunLi, Hworang,Lili A+: Jin,Law,Nina,Kazuya,Guy,Raven,Claw A: Sagat, Rufus, Juri,Akuma,Alisa,Ken,Lei,Steve Fox,Cody,Abel B+:
Kuma,Dictator,Dudley,Elena,Cammy,JackX,Guile,King, Sakura,Dhalsim,Ibuki,Ogre,Julia,Bob,Ryu,Rolento,Zangief,Paul,Bryan,Christie
Montiero B: Marduk, Blanka, Lars, Xiaoyu,Heihachi C+ Hugo,Balrog C: Poison -ChunLi is the best character in the game. -ChunLi has no bad matchups (non favorable) -Hworang and Lili are very dominant characters -Tekken characters are better now in terms of quantity but not quality. Has trouble with strong Street Fighter zoners" In the comments people where asking him about characters so I asked him; "<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/Shel313” content=“Shelton Doutherd” data-hovercard="/ajax/hovercard/hovercard.php?id=1161632815" data-ft="{“tn”:";"}" class=“UFICommentActorName” id=".reactRoot[125].[1][2][1]{comment346015145507314_1825701}.0.[1].0.[1].0.[0].[0][0]">Shelton </a>Jeron, whats your take on King?" "<a href=“https://www.facebook.com/jeronhiro.grayson” content=“Jeron Hiro Grayson” data-hovercard="/ajax/hovercard/hovercard.php?id=100002964949329" data-ft="{“tn”:";"}" class=“UFICommentActorName” id=".reactRoot[125].[1][2][1]{comment346015145507314_1826543}.0.[1].0.[1].0.[0].[0][0]">Jeron Hiro</a> King
doesnt hhave great pokes or range but a good mixup game off of his
frame traps. Cant sit there against him and he has a high damage output.
Hes more of an assist/battery than a anchor or cleanup character. His
walkspeed and lack of range hurt him in the end otherwise he’d be a
bigger threat. Good character overall though. Highly dependent on team
synergy and hard to get him out the match in most cases however."

ShADoW_NoBODy · March 3, 2013, 1:16am

“Assist/battery than an anchor character” that right there tells me he doesn’t know much about king because King’s best spot is an anchor. <div>Also the fact that he says he doesn’t have good pokes or range because for a Tekken character he has really good range and pokes. Compared to characters like hwo who has to be in your face but is deadly because of how good he is in your face. A lot of Tekken are better for their pressure game than pokes due to sf having better pokes than pressure aside from a few special ones.</div><div>I for one love King’s pokes and think it’s one of the best things about him.</div><div> </div><div>I agree that it is hard to get him out of matches though and I say that’s his biggest weakness. He has no real reversal or get off me. But a lot of tekken characters are like that tbh.</div><div> </div><div>But to each their own I agree with a lot of that list though.</div>

tl_crow · March 3, 2013, 9:42pm

So what is it about King that beats Law?

Shouta · March 6, 2013, 7:29am

Jag Step is too unsafe to be used regularly. Aside from all the attacks being -frames on block, the step itself isn’t invincible and you can get jabbed out of it. It’s good if you’re trying to punish a poke at certain ranges but it’s really something that needs to be used sparingly to be highly effective.

On King as a point or clean up character, I think a lot of folks kind of underestimate him. The conventional footsie game isn’t his strong suit because of his normals but his Leg Screw counters basically leave only crouching attacks being a menace to him if you have good reactions. Granted, it’s not something you can wholly rely on but it’s an option and a potent one when you get the right call. Plus the j.hp on King is pretty amazing at times. Plus, once King gets the knockdown or in close, he gets a bit more freedom to run amok on folks. Reversals can be beat with counters or just not doing something stupid, leaving King to do even more damage.

Mind you, that’s not to say the assessment that he’s a better back-up character or damage dealer isn’t true, as it is really but I think King’s point fighting isn’t nearly as bad as people think.

jc349 · March 11, 2013, 10:44pm

Planning on picking up king and pairing him up with lei. Lovin all the info on here.

DarthPariah · March 16, 2013, 3:23am

so i was just messing around with throw tagging with nina and seeing if king could make it work. when i tried with king i found that throw tag is sooo easy off a rev arm slam that you just need to mash it at the grab.
this could be useful for king when you have low life and need to tag safely. this is the only time i could think it useful though.
you have like an hour to do whatever you want before the opponent gets up. you can move behind them, charge a ch, take a bathroom break or whatever.

SWAG_KING_YOLO · March 20, 2013, 4:27pm

I’ve been running King on point for about a week now. Been playing him since day 1 but always used him as an anchor, but Bison is my anchor now. I know Bison on point would probably be more beneficial and the team itself doesn’t have the best synergy but I just want to play these two characters.

Playing King on point has basically opened my eyes. I used to play him as an anchor for Kazuya but now that he’s on point I just feel that he is so much stronger. Before, when he was my anchor, I just got the knockdown after a launcher or tag cancel and you could basically play the “come at me bro” game. Always forcing that guessing game with knees and aerial counters, but in 2013 he’s just so much more godlike than he was before.

Just play a patient but aggressive game when the match starts, get in, get inside their heads, read them like a book. King is a librarian, need those reads man. My capture card should come back this week, so if anyone is even remotely interested in this character I can upload some matches.

Also @DarthPariah I use that tag shit all the time, it’s easy because it’s a hit, but you get zero benefits after it. However with Bison you can do some funny stuff. Charge the head stomp, release it so that it hits meaty or release it so you land right next to your opponent right as they wake up and get a free grab because everyone is mind fucked.

Also @Shouta, Jag Step is pretty godlike if you scare your opponents enough. After a knockdown you can walk back a bit and hit a meaty cr.MK xx lk.Convict Kick, it’s safe on block, but you’ll mostly hit it since his cr.MK range is pretty good. Also, if they start blocking it you can cancel the cr.MK into a Jag Step and go in for a free grab or st.LK xx Tomahawk. It doesn’t matter if it’s not safe. A lot of his shit isn’t safe. His rolling Elbow Rush ain’t safe but you’re still supposed to throw that out all the time. It’s about the reads man, King is a librarian, gotta read those books. King is godlike when you can get those reads in, if you can’t, he sucks. Or atleast you’ll lose about 50% of your damage.