The Jojo's Bizzare Adventure Thread!

[aqualung]

Well you could try and low jump some move with a downard angle… but thats pretty risky… This is alot of my problem online is that push blocking quick things is really tough because of the speed of the move combined with a bit of lag. It makes alot of tick throw or combo games very strong.

well put!

192’s s.dio basically just throws me over and over. I feel scrubby when i get thrown like that, so i focus pretty much on beating that, then I eat his bnb =D.

With Iggi, Ive had good success, just doing jump, hover then drop back down into his bnb while the cr dash a1 just goes underneath me, but other characters dont have a safe way to do that like Iggi.

Im really thinking abdul when i am trying to think of ways to counter the dash cr a1.

Abdul has jump, early a2, qcf a thing, but im not really super confident in timming this, or the sweet lil combo you can do if the qcf a part landed. Maybe this could beat the dash cr a1?

Edit: Dyne’s hol horse is just way to unsafe, wich is what I believe is the downfall to 90% of hol horse players. Glass is not safe if other person is half a screen away and on his feet. Hell, even qcf A is not safe unless at nearly full screen away. Black pol’s qcb super alone can beat a hol that doesnt play safely.

[FullMetalRoss]

well put!

192’s s.dio basically just throws me over and over. I feel scrubby when i get thrown like that, so i focus pretty much on beating that, then I eat his bnb =D.

With Iggi, Ive had good success, just doing jump, hover then drop back down into his bnb while the cr dash a1 just goes underneath me, but other characters dont have a safe way to do that like Iggi.

Im really thinking abdul when i am trying to think of ways to counter the dash cr a1.

Abdul has jump, early a2, qcf a thing, but im not really super confident in timming this, or the sweet lil combo you can do if the qcf a part landed. Maybe this could beat the dash cr a1?

maybe… Does anticpatory cr.a2 work… that thing is hella fast and has tons of prioity plus its sort of easy to combo after… just cr.a2, st.a2

[Xenozip]

any experince / advice?

Incidentally there isn’t any no-tech trigger in Jojo’s for normals. No idea about specials/supers. But if you’re thrown out of a normal move you can still tech.

Lord knows how many times I’ve crouched under or jumped over a laggy normal and thought “throw punish!” only to have it teched anyway.

I was thinking about researching option selects, but I got lazy.

[aqualung]

thats a damn good point. cr a2 is pretty beafy, and is a pretty key move in getting some dmg output for abdul.

Im pretty sure cr a3 (these all referring to stand off) is good if you can anticipate it, but ive seen people just do dash small jump, and be able to clear it rather easily.

cr a2 is definately good starter, and I cant remember wich way it is, but a2 can link into a2, just cant remember if its, cr a2 > dash cr a2? or dash cr a2 > a2.

either way, yeah this may be a way to stuff it, thanks for the input ross.

EDIT: Xeno, could you elaborate a bit on your first statment of that post? I think I understand what your saying, but would like a bit of clarification =D.

[Leebee_Link]

i play him properly. i can combo and set traps and i even rushdown. besides you spam mariah who is hard to get in close

oh ok

forgot one thing for besthol :

ROLLROLLROLLROLLROLL

Yeah exactly right, as far as my experience goes atleast. Qcf A pretty much stops a majority of her zoneing / turtle options. Its hard to land sockets to increase the magnatism lvl, so keeping hol in wakeup nastyness becomes a bit harder.

O yeah, and how do people stop people with a good cr dash A1, from comming in and mixing tick throws? I try to tech, but on the internet I have a hard time consistantly timming it (lag?).

Dandy J told me to push block, but push blocking a quick cr dash a1 is super hard, and if you miss the push, youll get thrown during the roll.

This has been hangin up my defense alot lately, I get so consumed trying to tech the throw that I know is comming, that I get put back on my heels a bit, I cant play very well when im not the one dictating the actions and pace.

any experince / advice?

Yeah, honestly mariah vs. hol is like the dumbest matchup ever. Maybe not worst, but certainly stupid.

You can try dash back cr. L or cr. M…? Or maybe even dash back st. H might work?

with abdul i mean

Edit: Dyne’s hol horse is just way to unsafe, wich is what I believe is the downfall to 90% of hol horse players. Glass is not safe if other person is half a screen away and on his feet. Hell, even qcf A is not safe unless at nearly full screen away. Black pol’s qcb super alone can beat a hol that doesnt play safely.

LMAO dude this is exactly what i did in our last match

omg it was too perfect you guys can check the replay for how many times i landed that super

while Dyne is pretty solid, I think you still have the best Hol, apple.

In other news, I think i’m getting back into my groove woooo!

[aqualung]

ahhhhh standing a.2. interesting.

Ill have to put this stuff into practice in a match before i know for sure, but Ill respond later and talk about this =P.

I think I understand what xenozip was saying, I just sort of misread it the first time.

EDIT: wow yeah, thats a damn good point / idea too leebee.

dash back cr a2 im completely confident could cause problems for someone being predictable and dashing in. Using a3 instead is prolly waaaaaaaay safe too and gives a bit more range. good stuff today guys.

[ShinBlanka]

Deadlyraveneo is the best hol horse i’ve played against online. And i’ve played roadapple and he is good also. I hate mirror matches, so if I pick Black Pol don’t pick him because i’m the true BLACK POL! All mirror matches are boring imo. I don’t like to play for along time because i’m an old man and I lose interest quickly after 5 matches if they aren’t close unless i’m trying to teach someone to play jojo’s. It’s good to see people playing jojo’s these days. See you guys online.

[aqualung]

ahhh yeah shin blanka.

Played you one time for like 10 matches.

Everyone has improved a great deal, its pretty cool to see improvment over such a range of players.

good to see you post in here tho dood!

[Xenozip]

EDIT: Xeno, could you elaborate a bit on your first statment of that post? I think I understand what your saying, but would like a bit of clarification =D.

Well okay I did a bit of testing.

If you whiff a very laggy normal, like Mariah A3 or R.Soul A2, and the opponent throws you at any time during that normal, you still have the potential to throw-break (tech) out of the throw, even though your move was interrupted.

In other games if you are thrown out of a move you lose your throw break potential.

In Jojo’s this applies to normals, specials, stand, and supers though.

So for example, even if you perform Mariah’s qcb+AA super and it’s blocked, you can still tech a throw if the opponent tries to throw you during the recovery (post block).

I think the only time you’re not allowed to tech is during a roll.

But this means you can kara a tech attempt during another move. Such as c.A1~c.A3, provided you were holding down+back.

If you’re thrown during the A1 while you’re inputting the :db:+A3 then you’ll tech, and if you aren’t thrown then the A1 will come out.

Also, it seems that throws are instant or 1F. Looks instant to me looking at the frames. And the tech window appears to only be 2F as well. Simultaneous throw attempts result in a throw break, and you are given 1F after the opponent’s throw to break the throw (1F after catch frame).

That would probably explain why you guys are having so much trouble teching in netplay (I personally don’t have any trouble since I play with people very close to me). It’s not really a just-frame but a 2F window is still really really tiny.

More tidbits:

You can be thrown out of jump startup, at least by normal throws. R.Soul’s vertical jump startup appears to be 5F, and he can be thrown during any of those 5F, including the last frame where he only has 1 foot near the ground and appears to already be airborne. Oddly, if you attack 1F after inputting the jump you apparently get off the ground faster and can only be thrown during the first 2F, reducing the jump startup by 3F. This suggests that walking backwards or maybe backdashing is much better than trying to jump out of a throw. But of course you’re still very vulnerable to combos regardless.

The properties of being thrown on landing is even more bizarre. There appears to be a mysterious 5F gap where you can’t be thrown, but you can be thrown for 1F before the gap. To elaborate, while you’re landing, just before touching the ground there is exactly 1F where you can be thrown, then the next 5F you can’t be thrown, then any time after those 5 you can be thrown. And these frames seem to persist as such regardless if you attack with a normal attack or not. Even if it happens to be a ground normal, you can’t be thrown during those frames. Meaning you couldn’t be thrown of of a just-frame c.A1 on landing because c.A1 is fast enough to come out before the throw inv. ends. Unless you were caught during that exact 1F before you even land.

Very strange.

[Edit]: And on wakeup it seems there is a 2 or 3F window where you can’t be thrown (but you’re fully recovered).

[MightyMar]

GGs to Filthyrich today had a real fun set (I think I lost ever game though LOL). This game is pretty fucking bad ass so I’m probably going to start picking it up.

[Gamegeezer]

GGs to Filthyrich today had a real fun set (I think I lost ever game though LOL). This game is pretty fucking bad ass so I’m probably going to start picking it up.

YAY!!! Play polnareff because you know you want to :cybot: I will teach you all the tricks if you become my apprentice ^________________^

[FullMetalRoss]

thats a damn good point. cr a2 is pretty beafy, and is a pretty key move in getting some dmg output for abdul.

Im pretty sure cr a3 (these all referring to stand off) is good if you can anticipate it, but ive seen people just do dash small jump, and be able to clear it rather easily.

cr a2 is definately good starter, and I cant remember wich way it is, but a2 can link into a2, just cant remember if its, cr a2 > dash cr a2? or dash cr a2 > a2.

either way, yeah this may be a way to stuff it, thanks for the input ross.

EDIT: Xeno, could you elaborate a bit on your first statment of that post? I think I understand what your saying, but would like a bit of clarification =D.

You can actually do cr.a2, dash cr.a1, a2 or you can do cr.a2,cr.a3, or dash cr.a2, cr.a2, a2 but thats kinda tough plus might need someone with a big hitbox… basically cr.a2 is godlike and gives you tons of advantage… of course the easiest is cr.a2, a2 xx command grab or tandem.

[FullMetalRoss]

Well okay I did a bit of testing.

If you whiff a very laggy normal, like Mariah A3 or R.Soul A2, and the opponent throws you at any time during that normal, you still have the potential to throw-break (tech) out of the throw, even though your move was interrupted.

In other games if you are thrown out of a move you lose your throw break potential.

In Jojo’s this applies to normals, specials, stand, and supers though.

So for example, even if you perform Mariah’s qcb+AA super and it’s blocked, you can still tech a throw if the opponent tries to throw you during the recovery (post block).

I think the only time you’re not allowed to tech is during a roll.

But this means you can kara a tech attempt during another move. Such as c.A1~c.A3, provided you were holding down+back.

If you’re thrown during the A1 while you’re inputting the :db:+A3 then you’ll tech, and if you aren’t thrown then the A1 will come out.

Also, it seems that throws are instant or 1F. Looks instant to me looking at the frames. And the tech window appears to only be 2F as well. Simultaneous throw attempts result in a throw break, and you are given 1F after the opponent’s throw to break the throw (1F after catch frame).

That would probably explain why you guys are having so much trouble teching in netplay (I personally don’t have any trouble since I play with people very close to me). It’s not really a just-frame but a 2F window is still really really tiny.

More tidbits:

You can be thrown out of jump startup, at least by normal throws. R.Soul’s vertical jump startup appears to be 5F, and he can be thrown during any of those 5F, including the last frame where he only has 1 foot near the ground and appears to already be airborne. Oddly, if you attack 1F after inputting the jump you apparently get off the ground faster and can only be thrown during the first 2F, reducing the jump startup by 3F. This suggests that walking backwards or maybe backdashing is much better than trying to jump out of a throw. But of course you’re still very vulnerable to combos regardless.

The properties of being thrown on landing is even more bizarre. There appears to be a mysterious 5F gap where you can’t be thrown, but you can be thrown for 1F before the gap. To elaborate, while you’re landing, just before touching the ground there is exactly 1F where you can be thrown, then the next 5F you can’t be thrown, then any time after those 5 you can be thrown. And these frames seem to persist as such regardless if you attack with a normal attack or not. Even if it happens to be a ground normal, you can’t be thrown during those frames. Meaning you couldn’t be thrown of of a just-frame c.A1 on landing because c.A1 is fast enough to come out before the throw inv. ends. Unless you were caught during that exact 1F before you even land.

Very strange.

[Edit]: And on wakeup it seems there is a 2 or 3F window where you can’t be thrown (but you’re fully recovered).

Randoommmm, its seems like much as everything else in this game, throws are simultaneously buff and crappy. Nice.

[aqualung]

wow, awesome post xeno!

that clears up a ton of things that I just couldnt explain!

really great stuff man.

ross: are you sure you can link any normal after dash cr a1? /me goes to see!

update: under no circumstances can I link any normals after a dash cr a1.

please shed some light on this =P

[FullMetalRoss]

Im pretty sure… maybe Im misremebering… I thought his dashing cr.a1 was the same as his regular cr.a1.

[Xenozip]

More throw tidbits:

You can’t throw a stand that is “disconnected” to the owner. Such as qcf+S with Avdol or Kakyoin. But certainly the stand can throw the opponent. If the opponent techs that kind of throw then your stand gets deactivated. An amusing, though maybe useless, kara that you can do with this is when your stand is disconnected, go for a throw and then kara into qcb+S, if the throw works you’ll throw and if it whiffs you’ll go into tandem.

Characters with neutral stand attacks like Mariah, S.Dio, and R.Soul can do an additional option select kara with theirs. They can input a throw attempt and then immediately cancel it into a stand attack. Such as back+A3~S, if the throw succeeds they’ll throw, and if it whiffs they’ll do the stand move instead. While that’s not particularly useful to Mariah I think S.Dio and R.Soul can get some use out of it. This is the same principal as special canceling a whiff normal attempt, but it’s made easier by the fact that you can kara into the stand attack with these characters.

It seems when you land you can’t throw the opponent for about 2F. That’s still reasonable considering you have that 5F throw invulnerability on landing, so it just requires some timing to do jump-in throws (which I’ve personally noticed anyway).

You can be thrown out of backdashes.

Also, I’m sure this was universally known but I had to confirm it myself: you can’t reversal roll through a meaty, and reversal throws lose to meaties as well.

After a roll you can’t throw or roll again for about 11F (I think it’s 11F). Which means roll->throw sucks.

You can’t normal throw during a dash, but you can instead quick cancel your dash with a neutral stand activation and then throw, such as Avdol forward dash into stand activation into throw. But there seems to be a 2F window between the activation and when you’re allowed to throw. But 2F is pretty fast anyway.

[aqualung]

nice addition xeno

ross: abdul’s dash cr a1 has alot of recovery, its nothing like dio / alessy / ice / etc

cr a1 can go into standing a2, wich i still cant do with any real consistancy, but allways feel like im improving.

[Xenozip]

I think that’s a 1F link actually. :xeye:

(c.A1 to A2 w/avdol)

[Leebee_Link]

well that’s pretty much the name of the game when it comes to links hahah

gooooo abdul!

MightyMar, good to see another chicagoland player getting in on JoJo’s goodness!

MWC JoJo’s side tourney seems a lot more possible now lol

[aqualung]

I think that’s a 1F link actually. :xeye:

(c.A1 to A2 w/avdol)

this was my suspicion ; ; so tough to do this stupid thing consistantly. It sucks its pretty much neccessary for abdul to be able to do this with great consistancy.

im more curious in what dash c.a1 can do. I have a few limited uses, but all completely unsafe if blocked and what not.