its been like that since the day they officially announced gems at NYCC, http://www.gamestop.com/ps3/street-fighter-x-tekken-special-edition/97805
Man how the fuck do generic stat bonuses equal new interesting options. Whoopee, my Chun does some extra damage. How is a feature in a game that comes out so much later have less interesting options than CvS2.
Because then you…fuck me I don’t know. People keep thinking that this is somehow going to make the game better when ultimately footsies, mixups and zoning will end up winning games. This is just throwing shit on top of it so people get excited and/or can have long discussions about on SRK instead of actually playing the game.
Like for real if Gems gave options like GC, roll, run, Advancing Guard, or Parry I’d be slightly more interested Recent system changes hurt my interest but seeing how gems are boring shit like this whts the point?
Think of it this way:
Your opponent is down to 25% life and you land ABC launcher. Your combo could do 20%, but with a gem that increases damage or increases meter, you could either get MORE damage or MORE meter to extend that combo. Instead of risking your life for another combo you could finish the round now and win. Wouldn’t you rather do that?
I can see how gems aren’t the most interesting thing they could possibly do - but they’re probably the lowest risk step forward into adding more creativity to fighting games. Unfortunately pre-order gems exist and their stat boosts are actually significantly better than regular gems - but hopefully they do take up 2 slots or something, I dunno. Regardless, if they went balls deep and tried to make some ground breaking change-the-whole-game shit they’d just get even more complaints about all the hundreds of small problems that would cause. Gems are simple, they do simple things, but they’re the safest thing Capcom could do while still adding something creative to the game.
Also, I’m sure there are people who think that getting extra damage off a combo by having a gem is somehow cheap. It’s not. It’s proper planning. You could’ve gone for a speed gem instead and fucked yourself over. It’s like anti-airing with a shoryu instead of blocking - you made the correct decision so you get rewarded.
-_-’ sigh really? your really going to go there? Listen coming from someone who loved CVS2(or any other SNK made game for that matter) I know what your talking about however what you what is something that would more less potentially break the game then what Gems actually do.
Increasing parameters generally simple, and to keep this conversation from getting complicated i’ll try to keep it that way.
CVS2 had groves right? Each Grove was based off of a particular system from a respectful Capcom/SNK game. those systems were vastly different from each other, making them unique. we all know this…Gem on the other hand increase parameters of the characters abilities, whether that is power, speed, defense or meter proficiency. What Gems don’t do is give characters extra options or in fact different options altogether, thus not drastically changing match ups like CVS2 did.
Not every gem is going to have a drastic effect on the match however they do dictate and make possible variables to change overall result of a match. example: Akuma is known for having low vitality right? Akuma having a fortitude Gem makes all the difference in a match. why? -100 damage isn’t that good. take in consideration that akuma has around 800 or so Vitality so -100 damage is like +100 vitality during the duration of that gem. Akuma is a strong character who can turn a match around(thats a given) so anything that keeps him alive is a problem for his opponent(like a vitality Gem).
Gems only seem boring/useless because the fact that we only used preset gems that most of the world are still abit clueless in what those activation condition were for each gem set. without knowing their activation conditions…is the same as them being random. only when they were activated people where trying to use the effects of the gem to their fullest.
im only saying all this because when i played at the fightclub, Defense gems saved me from losing afew rounds and i was able to turn it around and pick up wins…they make enough of a difference for me to notice…
Considering that a common complaint of SF4 is how little damage shit does and how long it takes to kill people, your defense of the gems is that it’ll make characters take less damage and longer to kill people? :looney:
That actually makes me like the game less. Which is weird because I had no intention of seeing people play it. So now I don’t even want to acknowledge that it exists.
whoever equips defense gems should do some math and compare them with vitallity and fortitude gems. if you don’t come to the conclusion that defense gems are utterly pointless and among the worst gems in the game, there is not much help for you.
Speaking of math… we’ll have to do a lot of math to find the damage values with every possible gem.
Nah, I just say go with raw damage when you are testing out your Bnbs and such. Damage is damage; I’ll use gems but practically ingore them – they’ll ‘unlock’ when we’ve met the required conditions.
Just saying I wouldn’t be worried about those details.
remember they are the sports players’ equipment as Ono put it.
to put it in simple terms yes, fortitude lv.1 would make killing a high damage character like Akuma “alittle” harder to kill…if your turned off by that idea then i don’t know what to tell you…as i explained before there are other parameters that you could boost…i just used defense as a example because it was easy for me to tell the difference in what was going on as i was playing the game.
@Zuuku, i only mentioned fortitude and vitality gems, not iron wall because the % isn’t worth it…its almost that bad when it comes to immense power as well…but at least thats damage. fortitude+life force is a surefire way to keep a point character in longer then normal…perfect for people who play the lame game.
@Rayartz, this is what i mean about % not being all that great…
Unless something changes I don’t think many people will use attack gems in the long run either. With how much people like to theorycraft these things, I can see a faction developing that focuses heavily on the efficiency of each gem slot. And in terms of efficiency, the damage gems are almost as bad as defense gems. You’d need to do 1000 damage for it to cancel out a single fortitude gem on the opponent. That damage could be dealt to separate characters on the enemy team, which is a plus, but then if you have any tags in your combo, the efficiency plummets.
Even offensive-minded characters might be inclined to go for fortitude gems instead of attack, when presented with that kind of math. The only exception might be the Pandora +30% attack gem, if Pandora ends up being widely useful.
So if I don’t touch the subject of assist gems, then fortitude, speed, and meter gems seem like the most likely popular choices, with maybe the health-regen gem or Pandora gems as outliers. Fortitude for obvious reasons, speed/meter gems because they can actually make something happen that wouldn’t happen otherwise.
Pandora-minded gems would be ideal for a high damage anchor(someone who has a fast/high damage super) because with a 55% damage boost(pandora’s 25%+30%) and speed and proficiency gems, make it more worth wild as Pandora doesn’t give you infinite meter but regenerating meter…keep in mind that 30% defense up if the opponent is in Pandora gem too as it would render the immense power gem useless but you still get the raw 25% boost.
R-D i thought the same thing about immense power vs fortitude, but i agree Fortitude, Onslaught, Proficiency, DivineSpeed, and Lifeforce maybe the gems to use in the long run. LifeForce regains 80 points for 5 seconds…nuff said on that.
the others as you said is self explanatory…
Hey rook,
I completely agree with what you said. I’m a meter whore myself so no brainer on what I’ll be using the most of; but there is that argument: That extra 40pts of damage could mean the difference between winning or losing. That is why I always say damage is damage; the goal is to deplete your opponents life bar – whatever can help you do that, then do it.
But yeah Onslaught all day for me, haha! Course I’ve got idea pairings for gems with identical activation conditions to use as well.
True enough~ but I feel like there was a reason they brought down the count from 5 to 3 Gem slots.
If it takes 2 Immense power Lv.2 Gems to give you +40% thats two slots…and as you seen from that screen cap, that was Ryu’s EX fireball doing 100 damage so 40% added to that was only 40 points of damage.
Fortitude shows its merits as it -100 damage, for only 1 slot. if you had 2 or 3 fortitude gems thats even more damage being reduced. while its true to reduce ones life bar to 0, its kinda hard when stuff gets in the way of that.
C.Gauge Gems are just as important, because it seems most EX moves are really good and usually leads to more damage.
Atlas…thats what the lab is for.
So what I’m getting from Seth is that the gems are there to enhance different playstyles that peole have. Example, a person who turtles would be more likely to use a gem(s) that activated when they have their specials blocked a certain number of times, or block a certain number of moves themselves, while a person who utilizes rushdown heavily woud want to use gems that activated when they make a certain number of hits, or possibly when they get hit a certain number of times.
So there’s a point to it, and it creates some differences, but whether or not those are interesting ways to enhance the game is up to your opinion.
shrug
Speed gems will probably be the best… but if there isnt any system gem changes then its pointless and a wasted mechanic
I’m with meter gems and autoblock.
They only speed your character walk speed, not the speed of the attacks. So the speed gem is lols.
U_U this game… I dont even know what to say