@conebone:
cr.HP is the better link after the Tiger Knees for Sunflower - does more DMG. Good find.
Just messed around with Fuzzy Guard… when you hit a j.MK crossup or ANY divekick meaty after knockdown, the opponent is standing. With the correct timing you only have to look out for the hit, rather than standing/crouching.
Poverty Option Select: EX Divekick auto-corrects into EX Divine Step, when opponent rolls. But he can still block it.
In the corner, j.MK is very ambigious. If you do it early, it will hit front, late it will cross up. Take advantage of fuzzy guard for standing opponent or just go into super/launcher, if you win the round with that.
When I record the EX Divekick/EX Divine Step option select, it doesn’t work (EX Divekick comes out 100% the time)
After you land a knockdown with LK Sunflower Dance, you can go through your opponent with MK Feisty Rabbit and land a meaty Divekick, meaty s.LP-… or even f.HK Overhead from the other side. Perfect in the corner: Your opponent can only roll back to the corner.
After f.LK-LK Target Combo, you can land the f.MK-MP Target Combo and link into s.MP xx LK Angel Knee…
You can jump out of f.LK-LK, but can’t mash jabs into it.
After f.MK-MP Target, you can also link into s.LP-f.MP-s.MK Target Combo - but make sure you don’t whiff your LK Angel Knee, because of the pushback. LK Sunflower Dance still connects.
The first hit of dominating heel needs to be whiffed for the 2nd part to hit, which then can be combo’d into
Her F.HK is an overhead which then can be combo’d into Left right or Bedtime.
Her J.Mk is a cross up
Her Angel Knee whiffs on crouching opponents and some large characters
Her Divekick is unsafe on block
It is not advisable to use Angel Knee as a wake up, you’re better off rolling
Lots of mix up opportunities using Feisty Rabbit (LK - Sweep, HK - Overhead, Forgot what MK does)
All tekken target combos or chains can be special cancelable (Left Right or Bedtime)
For her Tag in combo, You want to do
Angel Knee - c.MK - LK Sunflower Dance
Her wall-bounces are EX Dendrobium and her Rabbit Thorn (Feisty Rabbit + HK)
when you do j.MP - j.HP and land just before the opponent do either a Super Art or a
c.HK
or
[?] c.MK - sunflower dance (untested)
or LP Dendrobium
(j.MP - j.HP acts like ryu’s j.mp, her j.HP hits twice so use this jumping target combo when you can predict an opponent jumping in)
A good combo using all 3 meter is
Rabbit Thorn xx EX Rabbit Thorn xx j.MP - J.HP xx Super
(Rabbit Thorn Wall Bounces so when she’s coming back down do another EX Rabbit Thorn and when she wall bounces Jump cancel into the rest.)
When in pandora mode her EX Rabbit Thorn can go into a c.MK and Loop again into an EX Rabbit Thorn and c.MK (until pandora runs out?)
You’ll want to use c.MK when your opponent is coming down from the air (if high enough) and cancel it into a LK Sunflower Dance as its stronger than doing a c.HK alone
On standing opponents a good bnb as stated above
F.HK, s.LP - f.MP - s.MK xx LK Angel Knee, LK Angel Knee, c.MK xx LK Sunflower Dance
Her Adante is a good anti-air and seems to beat out a lot of stuff
Her Divine Step isn’t really used much but the EX version can track onto your opponent (I don’t know if Divine Step can be used as an air throw)
Her Counter blocks mid and high normals and EX Counter can block low’s in addition
She build’s meter quickly so you want to use it often
Building Meter Gems on her isn’t always viable but gems are dependant on your play style
She does have low health so you might want to consider one vitality gem
Speed Gems do not increase the speed of normals, only jump, fall and movement speed
Which position works best for Lili? I currently have her as my backup with Poison on point. Though I’m thinking about switching the order as best switch cancel with Poison is her EX rekka and I’ll like better options than that.
Hmmmm. Sunflower lance definitely whiffs on crouching heihachi and ogre. This could be a problem if this or angel knee both whiff crouches. We might be stuck with dendribium some matches.
I found this while just trying the lp mp d.lp xx sunflower combo.
Don’t know if this is stated elsewhere but f.mk xx mp > mp > c.mk xx sunflower lance works and seems to push opponents far enough that it won’t whiff
In my opinion, Lili is the character you are looking to tag in a combo and finish the round after a hard knockdown. She has some kind of vortex, but problems getting in without EX Meter.
Lili’s definitely a 2nd position character. She builds meter nicely but she needs at least a little bit to get going, and also to extend her combos. She also really needs to be close to the opponent. Her normals are BAD at footsies range. She has good jumping normals and Feisty Rabbit goes through fireballs, but footsies range is a problem for her.
Someone in my scene got their hands on a few copies of the game a couple days early, and I got to fool around with it for a bit. I have a few questions for the people who actually own it though.
Combos are nice and all, but has anyone gone through her pressure/block strings? I saw the cr.LK xx LK Sunflower Lance string, but there has to be other solid things. I know her f.HK is an overhead and linkable into st.LP, but anything else? How invincible is Feisty Rabbit during blockstrings? What about its followups? I know her low (LK) followup seemed to be safe when I was messing around with it, but I didn’t get to try the overhead (MK) followup too much, and when I did, it would usually hit. Anything with charge canceling?
Any information on her counter? From what I could tell, the EX version gets beaten by throws as well as crossups. How fast is its startup? Is it completely invincible until it’s active?
Is there any practical way to land the HK (wall bounce) followup to Feisty Rabbit? One of the combos in trial mode does quite a bit of damage with it, but AFAIK, you can’t combo into it. The only way I can think of landing it is by pre-emptively doing it when you think the opponent is going to throw a fireball, but I was never able to land it successfully. Would be pretty big if there was a practical use for it.
Any AA Andante combos? What about followups for Dominating Heel?
Her counters are quick enough that you can react. As far as I can tell, when she’s in her counter animation startup, she’s countering most moves in the game. It’s the end of it when she’s posing is when she is vulnerable. She can’t counter Rufus’ Galactic Tornado, his super, Akuma’s supers and I’m sure there are more.
How would Juri work as a partner for Lili (either first or second position)? Both characters are my mains in their respective games but I’m worried that they wouldn’t work well together.
s LP links to cr HP, but it’s difficult. I think this is an extremely, extremely important link though. If I can get this down, then i’ll probably play lili.
omg thank you so much. that info alone makes her so much better. it may not be for everyone but when link the st.LP into cr.HP i plink MP and LP so if i mess up one plink the other will come through
Got to play some Lili early, she’s easily my favorite character in the game. As far as putting her first or second, I’d say she really benefits from being second. I was playing her on first and I had the hardest time simply because I’d take two Zangief grabs (which are stupid good in this game) and I’d be done for.
Damn PRESSURE! I saw a nice Juri playing last night. felt bad for the other guy. But Lili has some crazy pressure game and mixups.
Is that link 1 Frame or seem like it??
She has really good Tag in Combos and juggles. I say she should be second easily.
Excellent Advice!
I disagree. I think Asukas is way better. Frr one you dont have to anticipate if it will be a low mid or high move. Asukas counters them all. Lili’s Counter does seem alot faster though. I havent tested if it works on jump ins though. I doubt it
s LP to cr HP feels pretty difficult to me, I might estimate 1 f, but my friend says it looks 2 f. I dunno yet, didn’t get to try plinking (haven’t learned plinking because I never played SF4, just mvc3 lolol)
Her normals arent bad at footsies. cr.MK can outpoke RYU’s cr.MK which speaks for itself.
I’m also in love with f+MK and f+LK has a much longer hitbox than what it looks like.
Lili has great wakeup reversal options (EX counter/ knee), solid mixup, pretty good normals…
Something that should be noted, EX feisty rabbit isnt really that good at countering fireballs. Actually its no good at all, you can bait Lili into twirling right into a 3 frame reversal so she doesnt even get to enforce a mixup oppourtunity off whiffed fireballs unless its close range. EX Angel Knee and EX Sunflower Lance both have projectile invincibility and are both way better options. EX knee even shuts down Akuma’s air fireball pressure blockstrings, its almost like Rog’s headbutt in the way it just hops over the fireball.
And regular jumping command throw isnt completely useless. You can use it at mid to close range to bait out SRK’s, and she will flip right over them. I’ve also used it when I have been pushed full screen by projectiles. So you can use it as a trump card to get in once in a blue moon, but its real use is baiting out anti-airs since people are constantly going to be weary of her EX headstomp. I also like to jump and then divekick down to make them think I’m going to head stomp them, this tactic almost has a bootleg Bison devil’s reverse shenanigans effect to it. When Lili jumps people seem to throw out random SRKS.
But I’m not really feeling her anti-air options if you dont have meter. df+HK has shit range, cr.HP is too slow with not enough priority and MK looks like it should anti-air but doesnt. Thats like her biggest downfall I think.
Also her j.LK, MK and j.MP,HP are inconsistent based on the range. Small mis-steps but important enough to take into consideration.
Also, all the divekick’s can be linked into combo not just the EX.