Watch this vid
[media=vimeo]31100268[/media]
Iraq Veterans Against the War
I really hope people will wake up and realize what they already know. War is bad. War is wrong.
If you can find money to kill people, you can find money to help people.
Câmon, seriously? Advertisements? Whatever you want to do with your money in this country, you can do. You can buy food, you can buy a house, you can buy a car, or you can save it all up and do whatever you want it with.
And you know perfectly well that was response to the RBE model where somebody else decides all that for you. I was speaking about the freedom to choose, wherein capitalism gives you that choice and the RBE model does not. Specific effects of that choice make no difference on the fact that, yes, you freely remain to spend how you want.
Look, in response to cigar as well. You have $20. I know you have it somewhere, in your pocket, in your bank account, in your car, somewhere. You can do whatever you want with it. You can acquire any resource or good for the value of $20. In an RBE model, you could not. Somebody else would choose what, and how much of it you could have. You like video games? Too bad. Some scientists said they are bad for you so you donât get any.
Working for free? Ok, you could work with the freedom to choose what you want, or work for an allocated amount of pre-determined resources that somebody else decides whether you can have or not. One is slavery/socialism, the other is not. That choice, that freedom, thatâs why everybody comes to america
Lolwut.
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The very idea of âmoney doesnât existâ goes beyond him. His thoughts make perfect sense when you think that way. âIf thereâs no money, then I canât do anything with this money!â
â18 mayors had a conference about what to do with Occupy protestors.â
[media=youtube]NIRhGIUvuWQ[/media]
Also in a lot of cities protestors got evicted from their occupations, including Zucotti Park in NY (OWS). There are lawyerâs guilds that are working towards restraining orders and legal actions.
Nov. 17th is two months since the Occupy protests begun in NY, so expect a lot of demonstrations to happen.
You canât help everyone though.
He has a point though, freedom is pretty cool.
Yeah⌠I remember what freedom was likeâŚ
Do people really believe that if the rich had less, everybody would be better off?
i mean, what in the fuck goes through these peoples head when they sputter shit like this.
Also being in the Los Angeles area, I have to wonder how many lively hoodâs these people are disrupting and putting at risk by occupying streets and keeping people from working. What exactly is that doing for their cause.
My cousin lives in Denver, and Denver alone had to pull 6 million dollars out of its ass to pay for damages and the chaos these occupy wall street people for the past month. Whoâs do you think is paying for that???
The longer this sort of behavior continues, the less empathetic the masses will become with them.
Real active actions must be taken and the passive protesting needs to stop.
Itâs not about how much the 1% has, itâs more of what they have to do in order to sustain it. they want unlimited growth, which is impossible. Theyâll keep on trying to maintain it though, on the backs of the middle-class and the poor.
THATâS the problem. Not just that theyâre rich & that the middle classes are poor, but the very fact that they actually turn to the middle class and poor and everyone else to give them a free pass when theyâre down and shit hits the fan. Then when itâs given to them - not willingly, I might add - they return nothing.
If the rich had less, that would achieve nothing. But if they were forced to adopt realistic and fair methods to sustain it, then weâd be heading in the right direction.
I understand that is the problem, however, a lot from these occupy people donât think that nor say that. They think that by taking from the rich they can make things better. That by the rich having less, there will be more for everybody, which is a lie. They are exactly like the wall street. they want this sort of life style which isnât sustainable and impossible, which will of course the weight of such burden will be strapped on the backs of me and you.
The thing is, the richâs money, REALLY ISNâT THEIR OWN.
Down the line (please feel free to research them) their fortunes were made on the backs of those they exploited.
This time was taking it to whole new level, with them taking their new riches straight from our pockets.
Our taxes, based on our labor and economic input were demanded and given them by our elected officials.
Given them to cover their own fraud, theft, and avarice - not to help the country or its people.
If you believe that they think of themselves as citizens of this country, beholden to it and its laws, as are the 99%, then you ate grievously mistaken.
They have raped and pillage this country.
And have seemingly convinced a large portion of its poor populace (thanks in no small part to their owning the media and the very sound and airwaves themselves upon which their lies are disseminated as âthe newsâ) that they the poor are somehow to blame.
When they are done sucking the marrow from its bones, they will move on to greener pastures.
May the greener pastures be bathed red in the blood of bankers.
And something needs to be done, these people need to be tried for theft, ransom, and treason, and then punished severely.
I just feel that this OWS was a good start. they just need to clean up their act.
Have you ever seen the documentary âThe One Percentâ? Itâs fascinating, itâs by a member of the Johnson family of the Johnson&Johnson company. Itâs on youtube.
We have used trickle down economics since the Reagan Era, and all it has done is create a larger disparity between the upper class and the lower/middle class. Statistics show that on average workers work more for less, in comparison to the way that the cost of living has risen. And yet earnings of CEOs, presidents and other higher-ups have increased greatly.
The upper class owns a large portion of the capital and means of production, and are always trying to increase their wealth to ensure stability of their families for many generations. Many of them use loopholes and other methods to pay less taxes than they should according to tax laws.
idk man. At first I didnât want to judge people based on their socioeconomic status, but the more Iâve learned and thought about things Iâve realized that the struggle we are seeing is class warfare. The upper class want one thing, the lower/middle class want another, and meanwhile the crooks are getting away with everything.
The common problem the lower/middle class shares with the upper class (the ones that donât benefit from it) is that we are both subject to the corruption of the system. The problem is that if we were to fix some things (i.e. overturning Citizens United v. FEC decision, more regulations and accountability for market speculation), the elite would lose a lot of their influence in the government, which might not make some of them very happy.
It might even make them resistant to a change like thatâŚ
A very simplistic graphical presentation of financial distribution and related subjects. Itâs pretty alright, good for people who donât understand very well.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/video/2011/nov/16/99-v-1-occupy-data-animation?fb=native
WHERE THE FUCK IS THE MONEY?!?:mad:
^Dat sig.
the current economic situation is horrible, and a result of unregulated cancerous growth. rather than growth generating at the top and then trickling down.
It behaves like the arteries an obese man. The wealth gets stuck at the top, and then implodes on itself causing a shit storm that these assholes at the top wonât take responsibility for. (It doesnât help that we the people have encouraged and allowed this behavior)
Many of those issues, like
hey weâll let go 80,000 thousand workers, and outsource those jobs, and increase my pay as a bonus.
Is the result of deregulation and the false, outdated, and moronic belief in the invisible hand.
But, YOU, I, and mostly everybody in the OWS movement are still adding to the problem. Why do you continuously buy Chinese? Why do you continuously want to pay less money for what you want? YOu want jobs??, You must be willing to pay more, give up on your stupid ridiculous unearned and undeserved public pensions. YOu must be willing to sacrifice and work a job you donât want to work. You must accept more government involvement in some places, and must accept decreased government presence in other places.
We can get laws to pass, but its all in vain, if the fundemental problem (people), donât change for the better
Making the rich pay 74% of their income wonât help, and would only make things worse. Taking what the rich own wonât make things better, it will make things worse.
Now, donât think im defending those treasonous assholeâs who keep shitting on my constitution and for what it really stands for.
These people need to stop using the institutions of a perpetual money makers they are so hell bent on preserving. They shouldnât be allowed to speculate on markets like food, oil, raw materials, because those markets only bow down to the principal of supply and demand, not of speculation.
Those assholeâs need to step up and complete their civic duties as citizens. You or anybody else for that matter should not be able to negotiate their social contracts and obligations based on how much money or property one owns. If they donât want to, then they cannot and should not be allowed to participate in society, and should be treated like we treat those who break the social contract. Jail or death.
Class warfare has existed since the people decided that they deserve more and the rich donât. It has always been class warfare.
The rich will not allow for and will not stand for the destabilization of their empire and security for the sake of you or me. They will either again ruse us into believing the people actually changed things and endless game of charades will continue to rule supreme.
Or the right people will finally stand up, once again, and lead the masses to the right change.
Every empire has its moment of class warfare, it is now our turn to go through the same phase. Either things change for the better and the right people with the right ideas win, or the mob mentality wins and everybody losses, or the rich win, and then everybody who was bitching about unfairness and inequality will understand and know what it is to be miserable. Any power, whether it be benevolent or malevolent does not want to give up power and is resistance to change.
I really want this movement to do something for the better, but I refuse to stand behind a movement which believes in the lies it assumes to be true. A clear concise message must come from the people of OWS, and I feel that they need to evolve.
/rant
tl;dr
class warfare biggest issue since 70âs. legislature wonât change anything unless the people themselves change.
in the internets. That money doesnât exist and is an abstact value which gives credibility to countries and firms.
Friedman-ian economics is bullshit. Itâs kind of funny that you agree with trickle down, and but not the financial deregulation that also occurred during the Reagan era.
Trickle down hasnât worked, and it wonât work. It will always benefit the elite disproportionately to the middle/lower class. And once the elite owns even more of the capital and means of production, then society will become even more similar to feudalism once again. Weâll be working on their metaphorical farms just making enough for sustenance, and all thanks to the âfreedomâ that libertarians hold so dear. History is repeating itself, but weâre missing it.
This situation seems familiar⌠The tax burden being harder on certain underprivileged individuals than others (percentage wise). We try to use representation to help us, but it has failed (due to Congressâ displayed impotence). We have tried to make these problems known, but we have been ignored, slandered, and violently opposed. Where have I seen this before?
Oh yeah, the events leading to the American Revolution.
Iâm not much of a consumer yet, but I get what youâre saying. And thereâs things we can do. We can buy local, we can buy american made. We can use our monetary vote to support clean energy companies. We can buy more gas efficient cars, drive less, carpool, buy hybrid cars.
Personally, when I start my own business, Iâm going to use a cooperative business model and Iâm going to help my local community.
Be creative homie, thereâs lots of stuff we can do. We donât have to just over consume constantly just because weâre bombarded with advertisements 24/7, or just because we see everyone else doing it. If you value your freedom so much, use your freedom of thought.
Maybe for starters they can start paying what theyâre supposed to? Seriously, google how much corporations actually pay for their income tax. You probably already know.
One word: Loopholes.
Of course not :rolleyes:
The revolution isnât some kind of fantasy or entertainment. Either youâre for the idea of change, or youâre not. You canât just be like, âEh, I donât feel like organizing and working, but Iâm down for a coup. Sounds like fun.â
If thatâs the case youâre missing the pointâŚ