YEs but you are telling me KiT had the TOP TOP players in the US there? Maybe in the South/Southwest and one from New York.
Again, I don’t know the Tekken scene as well as you, but we don’t have Cali players come out here, nor do we go there for Tekken tourneys, nor does anyone from here go to EVO for Tekken, that is the comparison I am trying to make.
Basically we have an idea where some players here stand in top level comp, so you can measure against that, but Majin has never been to EVO, and I don’t know of any of the players that went on the MLG stuff from here sans you and maybe some Knox/Bristol players?
I mean, do we know if NAPS would have done well?
From the outsider’s pint of view unfortunately EVO is going to be the judgment on a lot of this unless the “bigger” Tekken tournaments are out there…
I know what you are saying about the higher level of comp at bigger tournaments. Super Turbo ended up that way for awhile. 24 man tournaments were brutal, but again, communities are different. You see 18 man SBO ST tourney and you see 1,900 man SSF4 tourney, what is more impressive?
World Series of Poker…getting to the final table is hard but what do people care about? Not the top 8 at one table in a special event, they care about the 228372378723 people on Texas Hold Em.
I mean, I am not hating on Majin at all, I know he’s crazy good at Tekken and other games…but you can’t say how “good” someone is until he plays against the best at bigger tourneys on a big stage…let me re-emphasize, no hating, but no one knows, he could own up or get worked, you never know with wild EVO brackets…he’s a solid player but what is he? Top 5 in the US? Do we know that for sure? It’s just guessing at that point…
Other thing is, with MORE players you have MORE blood in the game. When Guilty Gear had only the handful of top players playing it was the same logic. Scene grew, and those guys died off because more blood = more comp…can’t really say if Majin or Naps or Anakin or KOR or whoever would be top still if there were as many people playing Tekken as there are SF and that’s a fact.
Look at what has been happening…Filipino Champ, Juicebox Abel, Vangief, all new blood going nuts right now…
and also, it’s important to understand getting into the Tekken scene is a bit intimidating. The way the scene conducts itself with it you have to have a bit of thicker skin than most…it’s not exactly welcoming and I can tell you many players do feel like that…
Another thing that does not bode well…if a player likes Tekken more that’s great, but don’t justify Tekken being more difficult or talk crap about SF…another thing that doesn’t go well, SF players can’t talk crap about Tekken because they don’t know anything about it, but Tekken players can talk crap about SF…very hard to get new blood in the scene when that happens…
I would LOVE for us to have a Tekken scene. Damned if Cody has not tried many many many many times to get people to play Tekken, but the comic store in Murfreesboro had something go on there so no more Tekken there and people just aren’t interested in it over here. I could throw a tourney but as Cody said before, he’d just be playing against himself and that is unfortunate.
I got word that big Isaac (Raekwon), Darius (SolidPlay) and a few other peeps of the Birmingham crew will be stopping by this Saturday. Just spreading the word. I’ll be there d(.___.)b
Well, since there’s a wall of text aimed at me, I guess I get to type one back lol.
Yes…
Fab is considered the #1 most successful player in USA T6 overall, based on long-running tourney statistics. Majin beat him badly at KiT.
GM is considered #2 on the same statistics. Majin beat him badly at KiT.
Crow is #3 and was there.
Anakin is #7 and won the MLG grand finals and was there.
Pokchop is #8, was there, and walks away from Majin in the middle of MMs.
Clint is top 10 in the south and was there. Majin beat him.
Slips is top in St. Louis and was there.
WayGamble is 2nd best Law player after tie between JustFrameJames and Rip. He was there.
DanielPhoenix is best Hwoarang player and was there.
Jio is arguably #1 Ling.
I’m #1 Kazuya and in race for #1 Lars.
There were a ton of other “best player of this character” examples, but I’m not going to exhaust the list.
KiT, for Tekken, was HUGE. There were 81 players for T6 and about 40 for SF4.
The only people missing were Cali–the only ones of which who really matter are probably Mr. Naps, Rip, and JustFrameJames. The only of these he’s fought in tourney was Mr. Naps at one MLG with 0 Bryan experience. Yes, he lost, and that’s not an excuse. But he wouldn’t lose a 2nd time, and I would put $ on it.
That’s true, they don’t come to TN. But what big Cali names did Jacob Ford beat? So, I think this statement is without merit, as well.
Also, Anakin, Clint, and Pokchop beat Cali Tekken players AT MLG and are from ATL. Majin beats all of ATL, sans Anakin, and I have faith that he could beat Anakin with practice.
What high level players from diff places throughout the U.S. has anyone from TN beaten in SF4? My argument is that TN is so closed-off that I don’t see that we know where ANYone stands.
Naps did beat Majin at MLG. But Naps also lost to GM at MLG… Pokchop beat Naps in teams and Nin from Korea beat Naps. GM beat Nin… And Majin has beaten everyone in that last except Mr. Naps. So who’s to say that Majin isn’t better than all of them, Naps isn’t better than all of them, or Nin isn’t the best? You can’t.
Maybe from an outsider’s, sure, but we’re talking real tournaments here. Everyone said Evo 2010 Tekken was horrible–even the Koreans complained about monitor lag, and one of them WON. Evo 2010 Tekken is irrelevant. Every MLG was of higher quality and had more dense competition, and that’s what the scene is basing its current viewpoints on. And yes, Cali was at every single MLG–they only won 1 of 'em. (JustFrameJames at D.C., no Koreans in attendance.)
18 REAL ST players vs probably 1700 scrubs and 200 REAL SSF players? Again, I don’t see that you can make a comparison. I don’t see either as really impressive. I only consider the big names at tournaments–not raw number of shitty players. What’s more impressive: beating Justin Wong in tournament, or beating 100 SF4 players that no one’s ever heard of?
…What? We’re talking tournament standings, as in a “top 8” or “top 32”–you said it yourself by saying Jacob got top 100, but I guess we’ll talk poker out of the blue. The final table IS pretty much all people care about. Who made it to the final table are the only ones who get talked about and remembered. Of course, people will talk about who “knocked out” another big player, but that lasts about a day and is forgotten. Sure, you have your long-term “top money makers” that go down in the hall of fame just for that and are very respected, but for any given tournament people only remember the final table. That being said, top players are knocked out by new ones all the time, and you almost never see back-to-back final table finishers in 2 years of the WSOP these days. All that’s remembered is who got that bracelet. Comparing a fighting game scene to a poker scene makes as little sense as comparing Majin to Jacob Ford, if that’s what you’re trying to say?
And when did Jacob Ford do this, and did he win? My whole response was that the comparison cannot be made, not that one person is better than the other. And you’re proving that same point with that statement above. ^^^ Also, Majin HAS played on stage and beaten top names. MLG. And he’s won 2 majors, both of which had many of the country’s biggest names.
…
Everything I’m saying here is to point out that comparing one scene’s players to another scene’s players makes 0 sense. They are 2 very different things. Not a Majin vs J. Ford, or Tekken vs Street Fighter, or a scene vs scene. It just makes no sense to compare.
I went to KiT last year… Granted only for Blazblue which isn’t there this year. I actually don’t even give a shit, I’m going for SSF4 this time. (man if myself from a year ago heard that he’d be WTFing pretty damn hard right now)
On an unrelated note: A bunch of ******* on the gamefaqs Marvel 3 boards keep bitching about Viper and Chun Li being in the game. I’m going to use an all SF team just to spite them. INSULTING MY VIPER, LITTLE GFAQS BITCHES, GOD
But seriously, my point is still with more players you have a better pool. You can’t know for sure if players don’t overtake the Tekken players because there just aren’t enough players playing the game.
Take 3rd Strike for example…at one point we thought we had an amazing groups of players but once the game became “played” often, the top 10 completely changed and a lot of that had to do with NEW players coming into the scene.
Tekken online is the sole reason it is not played as much, that I agree, but I mean again, the Majin vs Jacob Ford is being misconstrued. Regardless of who he beat or who he didn’t beat, the fighting game community in the US is all about Street Fighter and that’s the bottom line.
Back in the day I was one of the top 2 or 3 Mortal Kombat II players in the country. Not even arguably, I was and I am pretty certain I still am because I did play it for a bit on the rebirth when it came out online…what does that mean though? Does anyone in TN care? What about Super Turbo? Does anyone care or play that game with me here knowing full well we have a player who has performed well and won majors at it?
That’s the point I am trying to make, it can go back and forth about who is what and so on, but all anyone cares about right now is SSF4 and it might be unfortunate and monopolizing but it is what it is…personally all these other games took away the talent pool FROM Street Fighter back in the day, and that’s why that series was dead, but don’t worry, eventually that WILL happen again, history will repeat itself and Tekken will be bigger again and MVC3 is going to gobble up some people but that’s a whole new crowd of players…
[quote
Everything I’m saying here is to point out that comparing one scene’s players to another scene’s players makes 0 sense. They are 2 very different things. Not a Majin vs J. Ford, or Tekken vs Street Fighter, or a scene vs scene. It just makes no sense to compare.[/quote]
You’re right, but you DO have a lot of argument about Tekken as a better fighting game than Street Fighter. You compare X to Y, so it’s the same thing…we respect Tekken but they are just two completely different fighters…
BigOpinion: Yes, some are thicker skinned than others…I am an outsider here but some people like to talk smack, some don’t. When someone talks smack to me I don’t understand it because it’s not like I am competing or trying to prove anything…I just want people to play and get better shittalking does not get a “rise” out of everyone to play better.
I mean, you know how many people come into the arcade and shit talk?
Cody, what did you do to the Asian guy that played Tekken and said he could beat you? You destroyed him and then he QUIT playing out in TN period until he moved…that was HO YEAHHHH but another person out of the scene…
I mean, not everyone responds well, that guy dished it out, but could not take in return. I think unless you are ready for repercussions, shit talking can get you in trouble, but razzing is not as bad…
@ DreamTR: I would honestly love to play ST or any MK game with you. I would really like to learn how to get better at any of those games. I only know a handful of people who play ST in our state and i would really like to be better at the game. Right now i play with Marsgatti, Krost, and Corrosion from the east.
I play classic. I am still very noob in the game. Mars has been teaching me and says that i am doing pretty well i just need to play with high level player and get my ass kicked to get better. Like Mars told me that you are an ST legend and that you could school me in everything ST and then some.
Well okay so some asian kid couldn’t back his shit up, that doesn’t mean that talking shit is going to chase people out of the community left and right. That kind of passive-aggressive resistance to shit-talking makes it sound like it’s something worth taking seriously. He probably didn’t leave because he couldn’t back his talk up, but because he probably felt like he was getting run right out of Nashville because people actually took it seriously. Nobody money matches or slings game in Nashville because the top knows they’re worlds better than the bottom, and the bottom gets run out of town by the top.
IMO Nashville’s better players are starting to hit walls because they don’t see the point in trying to help others get better. Everybody wants the scene to get bigger and blow up because everybody knows that makes for more diverse and better competition, but nobody actually wants to get their hands dirty and do it themselves, and the result is you have nobody coming to tournaments because the same people are content to train by themselves in practice mode, win tournaments (or even casuals! fuck!), and disappear.
Part of it is life responsibilities and simply not having the time to sink nightly into practice, sure. I’ll be the first to admit that plenty of real life shit gets in the way of me improving my own game. But Wootsick is exactly right, like you said Jason. You get better by snowballing with people you train with. You learn their characters, their matchups, their individual playstyles, and what to look for in general competition. That works really well. But there are too few people in Nashville actually willing to eat that humble pie, shelve their winning-first attitudes and return to planet Earth long enough to give new people the same experience they benefited from before.
I’ve got nothing but love for Nashville and there are plenty of humble players that I’m not gonna even try to name for fear of leaving others out. That said, I don’t see why it surprises anyone that tourney attendance started to dwindle after a while. Yeah, Nashville needs new blood. But Nashville’s current group is also really resistant to wide-open casuals and bringing new people into the scene because there are too many people content to just beat the fuck out of their close-knit community or their little clique and sit on those small victories. We have people that continue to prove themselves locally and at a few out-of-arcade events, but if that’s all they’re happy to accomplish, or they don’t want anybody to take that from them, of course the scene is gonna start getting stale.
What. The core of any fighting game community is finding a game a handful of people actively want to play together. It could be Street Fighter or Tekken or Melty Blood or Project Justice anything. If there’s a handful of people actually willing to play casuals and get better with each other and play with each other and new people often, that’s your fighting game community. The Fighting Game Community in Nashville is all about Street Fighter because that’s the only game the majority is willing to casually play, and will probably remain that way until people get out of their basements and play something else with somebody else.
Not to mention, if other games were actually supported instead of overlooked, there would be a wider variety of tournaments GG could hold. Having a Tekken 6 BR cab isn’t going to magically create a scene for Tekken if “Tekken isn’t as popular as Street Fighter” is put on repeat every time it gets mentioned.
Big Opinion what I meant by SF being the “bottom line” is that is all anyone cares about in the US. That is why I noted my ST and MK stuff and Cody was noting Majin’s Tekken stuff. Good players in these games, but communities do not exist here for them, that is all I meant. I don’t mean STREET FIGHTER IS ALL YOU SHOULD PLAY OMG…far from it in fact…the more fighting games you play the better you can understand them as a whole…