Ah come on. Why so serious?
I can see where Eternal is coming from, there is a hint of suspense and hype about the dev logs, its interesting. Its also is (you have to admit) funny to read some of the posts from both sides. I would** hate** for Street Fighter to become a yearly thing, but I see where hes coming from
Yang got nerfed. Awesome, served him right with his +4 (on gaurd) jab yet 3 seperate 3 frame startup normals that are special cancelable too. He and Yun had it coming. They were far too good in this game. They were overpowered to the point of nearly being broken. Yun and Yang were not good characters, they were amazingly good characters compared to the rest of the cast. Unless they had buffed everyone up to the standard of the twins (and in the process** actually** breaking the game) nerfs were coming.
You cant buff Dhalsim enough to deal with AE Yun without making him stupidly overpowered against another handfull of characters and the process continues again and again. Bringing the op bullshit down a level makes sense.
If they went overboard, well I guess we have to wait and see. But I agree with Eternal… its not boring.
So illogical. Everybody who gets buffed is going to be top tier. Everybody who got nerfed will completely disappear from competitive use. That’s the way it’s always been, and we all know it’s been proven over and over again to be true. Remember when Super came out? Dudley was top tier, Ken replaced Ryu, Guile was the most-played character? I precisely remember all of those things happening, just as everyone’s first reactions predicted.
[i’m not serious at all. that is actually the general tone of posters in this thread. people in this thread are hypocrites, they don’t care for overall balance ( just look at the cody mainers hopping around citing him as top tier ), they just want to either nerf match ups that they personally struggle with or completely nerf characters to the ground while providing buffs for their respective main regardless of tier placing ( we had ken players in this thread asking for yun nerfs while buffing ken…5th best character according to most people ).
and who didn’t think yun & yang were gonna get hit? we all saw this coming. i personally don’t care if yang or yun got hit hard or not, i just know i’ll more than likely play someone else once patch hit.
For a guy who “doesn’t care” you’ve been pretty vocal about your opinions and overly hostile to those whom disagree with those opinions.
If you DON’T care and act like that, than you are in serious need of therapy and most likely should be restrained lest you are a threat to yourself and others when it comes to things you DO care about.
this constant neutering of anything remotely good is fucking annoying. Especially when its a character you invested 2.5 years of work in, and it goes all to fucking smoke because some fucking asswipe at Capcom thought it would be a good idea to remove semi-viable tools for competition and replace them with less than sub par pieces of shit.
Maybe I should ask Killer Jiggly to ask buffs for my character. For some odd reason, It seems everything he likes, gets fixed up a bit. May be coincidence.
I’m guessing you play Fei since that is the only character that has been in since Vanilla that has had any sort of “major” nerfs. Because if you play Yun/Yang then you couldn’t have put in 2.5years since AE only came out June for consoles.
No, im pissed off because my character got robed in AE agian, and isn’t getting anything of value in AE v.2. The only “buff”, its getting is pushback on Sky High Claw. Like LOL capcom, way to drop the fucking ball again, who the fuck uses that move?
It pisses me off to no end, that people here are saying shit like
Yo, Yang still Legit, Fei still Legit, Yun still legit, as if it worked that way. it doesn’t people.
1 single nerf made my character go from about solid to lower high to fucking low tier again. How do you think a plethora of fucking nerfs is going to pan out for these characters? C’mon, dont be so obtuse.
Think about it,
if Sagat got a single hit st.lp that is cancalble again, do you know how fucking good that would make him again? People complained and moaned about “THE DOOMSDAY COMBO”, as if it was the issue, when it was st.lk.
One simple change has a huge impact in a game as watered down as this one. What makes you think multiple ones won’t have an even bigger impact?
which is what SF4 has been since it came out.
example
them cody players who are downplaying his buffs, and telling everybody to STFU about thier characters nerfs.
People don’t want balance in the sense you’re thinking. they want “buff my character but nerf everybody else, or the characters I have a hard time fighting and make it so I can win with no effort.”
In super Vega was low mid to begin with. The Cody players downplaying his buffs is true, but the thing you need to do that you aren’t is looking at OTHER characters changes and how they relate to yours. You simply can’t look at your character in a vacuum like you did for the Super - AE change.
Many of Vega’s best matchups were buffed in AE making his overall matchups more difficult. Not to mention that the general metagame shifted from a more defensive game (where Vega’s long range and fast pokes can shine.) to a heavily rush down oriented gameplay (where Vega’s lack of solid reversals and the fact he can lose his claw while blocking makes his overall game weaker.)
The changes for a character are often less important than the changes to the rest of the cast. Makoto got major buffs in AE from super, but she certainly wouldn’t have gone from F tier to low A if it wasn’t for the fact that many of her worst matchups were nerfed (Guile/Honda/Cammy/Bison/Balrog) she probably would have only jumped to low-mid B with her changes if everyone else stayed the same.
Vega still needs help and the lack of buffs from the Alpha build of 2012 is somewhat insulting, but you need to look at the nerfs to Fei/Yun/Yang in the form of: Can they still basically play the same? How has their matchups changed? How will the meta shift around their changes?
Ultimately the fact is that for Yun/Fei they basically play the exact same but less safely, and while the meta will shift almost no one has gained tools that affect the Yun/Fei match up heavily. Yang will have to change things and will ultimately have the hardest transition of the 3 S tiers, however his tool set is simply too strong for the changes to drop below low A/B++ without a major mistake on Capcoms part (something so drastic that location tests would pick it up.)
I really don’t believe it became more rushdown oriented if so why did they nerf a lot of characters offense tools, and the only real rushdown characters in AE were Rufus (nerfed), Cammy, Yun, Ken, Viper, Akuma & Seth If anything there is more turtling in this game than there was in Super. Oh yeah and more mashing and button pressing too.
All it is capcom hates charge characters.
Edit: You could argue Fei but most players outside of Mago didn’t play him as a rushdown character.
You forgot Yang, Sakura, and Ibuki and to a lesser extent Makoto (though she plays more like Fei in terms of less “purely rushdown” more responsive rush down where you don’t constantly put pressure on but instead try and fish for an opening and then put a ton of pressure on at once.
Yang is pretty much rushdown. He is only slightly less so than Yun really. If anything the Yang rushdown is worse than Akuma or Viper who the rush down is more about setting up a knockdown for the mixups. Yang has all sorts of frame traps, block strings, and the dive kick pressure.
when was the last time i was vocal about things? oh i know, my kneejerk response to ae changes? and that was was like 8 days ago? other than that, i’ve just been fishing in juri/ken forums. i just took an interest to teeth post so i responded.
I admit you took a few days off. But I’d hardly say that talking about it off and over for the better part of a week after the announcements constitutes “knee jerk”
Your sense of time is very strange. 1 week being vocal about your feelings on the Yang nerfs = short enough time to be considered a “knee jerk” spur of the moment reaction. 1 week not talking about at all about Yang (because frankly, he really hasn’t even been a topic of much discussion anyway) is treated as though it was “ages” ago and “why you gotta keep bringing up the past?”
I would say wait till AE12 arrives before you drop a character based on a list of changes. Theres a huge difference between theory fighting and actually playing and figuring out the changes. Yangs playstyle is still going to be the same, your going to have the same tools only some wont be as safe. Not being safe doesnt automatically mean terrible and unusable, it just means you need to use them with a little more thought and planning.
I hope that AE 2012 turns out the way AE should have, like super but with 4 more characters.
I dont think the game itself promotes turtle play, but I noticed a huge spike in downback warriors. I think with Yang/Yun and Fei being so strong people would shut them out with a very defensive approach and this carried over into other matchups when they seen it can work. As a Guy player nothing is more infuriating than fighting a downback warrior who dispite getting overheaded, thrown, and everything else, still holds downback like a trooper untill they can attempt a srk fadc or similar.
I can see your point and agree that turtling has become more popular since AE arrived, but I dont think its a bad as you make out, most of the cast can punish turtles pretty well.
Charge characters I shouldnt mention as I will be biased against them. They are a nightmare for Guy due to the fact they are ducking (charging) automatically shuts down 70% of his offense. Plus Bison and Balrog are boring as feck, seriously the amount of Bisons I’ve faced lately is silly high, and they ALL play the exact same way regardless of skill.
oh no, i’m saying yang will be terrible daonino. he’ll be viable but some of those changes i just can’t rock with. like j.mk missing 80% of time now due to nerf, or his st.short being 5 frames now. and ex command grab with less range and lost of throw inv ( this is the big killer nerf vs t hawk and geif. those match ups are going to be…ugh ). i’m sure some people will stick with him. hell, i’m going to still play him as an 3rd or so because i like the character. but i think if i want to work hard for a good payout, i’ll just play ken over yang in new ae.