lol Makoto
Where is Akuma? Or did he gain new bad match ups?
just yun afaik. maybe this new evil ryu.
and for some reason, viper beats akuma now.
Yun and Yang are the new bad match ups. A couple of his previous match ups got harder. Especially at the top.
Gief- no runaway air hurricane kick. He only has to guard against 1 way out of the corner now instead of 2. Plus spd got buffed. Which now makes the corner the equivalent of hell.
Makoto- new priority on her dp beats all of his mix up options except demon flip palm and cross up air fb/maybe. Plus she’s a tank
Fei- for obvious reasons
change gief with akuma and i agree. Gief/Viper are immediately after
Interesting. Viper/Akuma matchup was always sort of balanced, the hard way: rounds are usually loopsided. Viper being completely susceptible to the vortex, akuma’s health unable to sustain Viper’s ability to provoke openings in his defense and building momentum from them.
About the respective AE changes. Viper: better U2 (lol). Akuma : lost the escape tatsu, new mp dp, better U2 (not the ultra of choice in this matchup I think).
I’d say it’s still balanced.
I’m scared to pressure makoto on wakeup in ae, if she guesses right on one wakeup she wins the round even though her reversals aren’t that great. She’s dumber than Abel was in super.
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I played at Safari tonight. Maybe my observations don’t matter much because I’m outclassed by the players there but…
I don’t see how Yun isn’t going to be 3s chun levels of dumb in this game. He just has so much stupid stuff and seems pretty easy on the execution. The biggest thing is there doesn’t seem to be any consistent way to anti air him. He can jump up and down all day and you can’t risk poking because you’ll die if he divekicks. You can trade normals with divekicks for a little bit of damage each time, and then the 4th time Yun empty jumps towards you and you eat a massive combo. Or he just changes the divekick timing to beat your normal.
At 10pm Mago and Daigo showed up, and I thought, alright lets see how mago deals with this. But I didn’t see him having any great option for the divekicks either. Daigo beat him pretty convincingly over the night I would say. fwiw Daigo is now like 15,000 BP ahead of Mago in the rankings.
Anyway, I could be missing something, and maybe Mago was getting unlucky somehow, but right now I’m just not seeing it.
i thought you could beat them out with jabs without needing to worry about timing or whiffing something with a lot of recovery.
no longer the case?
Standing jab did seem like the best option… but you just get no damage out of it. I’m not sure of all the ins and outs, but it just seems to me that it’s not a good enough punish. If you keep doing standing jabs, then he can get in on you. For example I think he can do a short dive and then do whatever after you whiff your jab. If he jumps forward and you whiff a jab too early expecting a dive kick, I don’t remember if he can outright punish you, but anyway, he gets in.
pretty much.
Offtopic: What do you guys think of the access to big damage in this game?
Ontopic: At least fuerte doesn’t have scary damage, unlike some other characters. You know the ones…
Offtopic: Is Sagat’s Tiger Knee safer in arcade edition?
Lk knee is apparently vanilla quality again, other versions basically the same as in super.
i kinda want to revisit the whole fei top tier argument again.
could yun possibly be a better character?
or is fei still the best, but just isnt as “fun” as yun in the sense that he dosent have as many winning matches?
assuming that more players gravitate towards the most powerful characters (outside the ever popular ken, ryu, akuma), why isnt fei being played more given his S tier status
I’d venture that it’s because Yun is more explosive while Fei is more mellow. You know how it is. When played correctly, Fei takes only 150-300 damage off at a time, with the occasional lucky/mashed CW combo that leads to more. He has few mix-ups actually; his game is much more linear and revolves more around zoning/trapping the opponent in the corner. Rushing in with Fei isn’t optimal since it is counter-intuitive to that plan.
Yun on the other hand, can mix people up all day and has more damage opportunities when played as a rush-down character. Fast meter-build and 50% Super juggles/1-meter > Ultra combos make him very attractive. There’s that element where “if I’m on offense, I’m in control of the match.” Fei, although capable of minimizing risks on defense, still has to take them–he still has to play the waiting game quite a bit. I think that makes him seem less in control, and less “fun” to play in the eyes of others. Of course, you won’t ever catch me saying that.
Still, the top players (minus Nemo) believe that Fei is the better character due to that balance.
Fei’s close range pokes are too damn good.
Nemo gives his thoughts on the top ten characters in the arcade edition (AE) of Super Street Fighter IV.
*[What’s your] AE Tier List?
Nemo: If you want to [be] playing this game Yun, Yang, Makoto. Using other characters wouldn’t be fun in this game.
People who want to win, pick Fei Long. People who want to irritate others, pick Adon.
Using advantageous characters against this 5 strong characters. In order:
- Yun
- Fei Long
- Yang
- Makoto
- Adon
- Ken
- Sagat
- Akuma
- C. Viper
- Zangief*
Miscellaneous Information:
-
he exclusively uses Yang now
-
he has quit using Chun Li, calls her “a boring character”
-
he claims that Zangief and T.Hawk are Yang’s mismatches
Source: Click here.
I think Yun is way stronger than Fei from what I’ve seen. Yun can get in whenever he wants even without Ex- it seems hp lunge is easy to make safe not even at max range as Ive seen Yun do it to a blocking opponent a million times then do a random dragon kick that beats the other players jab/short. So he can get in anytime he wants then you get to play “guess what yun will you” since he can beat every single defensive option. Oh and if you attack him you get to play “guess if Yun will reversal” and if Yes “guess which reversal yun will use” (command grab/dragon kick) Sure some characters can probably back dash and punish either but it will be a shitty punish compared to what you should be able to do. Its also easy for him to connect his ultras.
They say his health is his weak point but its probably like 950 or 900 at worst which is worth being able to press a couple of buttons and throw out some specials randomly and win. They even made his hk relatively safe due to the distance so I guess they didn’t want his “low” health to actually count against him.
He makes Vanilla sagat look medicore. I think if you were to take Zangief from Sf4 or Ssf4 (don’t know much about AE zangief) and give him Rufus’s dive kick thatd be comparable to AE Yun.
So basically imo Yun is far and away the top tier. You will be seeing mostly Yun in the finals of every tournament.
I haven’t seen anything from Yun that is legitimately stupid other than his EX lunge, and possiby the way-too-low recovery on his up kicks. His genei-jin is really not that good, his damage is kind of low, his divekick is jab-beatable and his command grab can just be backdashed out of if you’re that worried about him using it in blockstrings. It’s got a lot of recovery too so you’ll probably be able to sweep the recovery after backdashing.
I know he’s probably the best character in the game, but I’m not buying that he’s anywhere near vanilla Sagat level who was legitimately preposterous.
He’ll blow up to 2 Dudley combos just like everyone else.