Rhyllis is right, it is not possible. Theoretically it should work if a move has enough blockstun but U2 is currently not fast enough for that. In AE U2 is reportedly really fast though, so that’s something to ponder about when it will come to the consoles.
You’ve been doing awesome work testing things. I wish we had a good arcade down here. 
Way back when the TC was first revealed, I tried to do some combo scaling predictions based on the same combos being done in SSF4 (if they were actually possible). I’m not sure if I even posted them, because I was worried my estimates may have been too optimistic - I assumed the target combo would do standard damage. With the pictures you took though, I tried making some life bar comparisons.
- TC xx HK Gekiro (Less damage than expected)
- s.MP, TC xx HK Gekiro
- j.HP, s.MP, TC xx LK Gekiro (More damage than expected)
Ok, it’s cell phone shots vs. direct screenshots, not exactly a perfect comparison. However, they’re close enough that you can tell the life doesn’t seem to match. My assumption is that the TC does less damage than both hits would individually (in Super), BUT the s.MP does more damage again. It would hardly be surprising if the s.HP by itself did less damage on its first hit and more on its second hit, but I think the scaling makes more sense if the TC’s s.MK does reduced damage. Either way, regaining some of the old s.MP damage would be really nice.
That would be a great thing to test, if you can. Just try smacking the CPU with 5 or 10 separate close s.MPs and take a picture of it. Counterhits are fine too, if you can manage to keep count of them.
I don’t think I could make an accurate guess at meter gains based on screenshots, and videos are only slightly better. It would be easy to test meter gains on whiff (if you had a willing partner for 10 seconds), but they could change on hit too.
Also, I don’t think HK/EX vs. LK gekiro will make a big difference. With all the extra scaling, it works out to a damage difference of less than 10 points, unless they changed those too.
yes thats EXACTLY what im asking. Exactly what im imagining
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How about i just do a naked TC and shoot a photo of that?
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When I test these things, I just look to see that the number of hits matches up (so I know I didn’t drop a combo). I did these combos on CPU, so I hadn’t really checked if the s.mp was a CH. Maybe some of my damage looks heavy because of that first CH. I’ll take a photo of a naked S.mp. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if they messed with the damage distribution of S.Hp, moving more damage to the 2nd hit.
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Yeah, I think the best thing for looking at meter gain is looking at recorded matches. I need someone to record more of my matches. Lol, I got a 20 win streak about two nights back and they were almost all really difficult matches.
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HK Gekiro seems to whiff on a LOT of the cast when used with the B&B. I think they actually gave us a reason to use MK now, because i think it hits much more often than HK. EX Gekiro does do more damage, but when used in the B&B it gets scaled to shit… so we’re talking probably about 10~15 additional damage for a meter bar. Not worth it, especially since supers are so good.
Added note: +6 from S.mp isn’t enough advantage to jump (after switching styles) and connect with Crane U2, even in blockstring. I’m positive it isn’t that fast and that it does still have start-up. You might catch someone crouch-teching or pressing buttons, but anyone who tries to press buttons during S.mp frame traps deserves U2. It’s not viable.
Thanks for the encouragement, and please let me know if there is any specific thing or METHOD of testing something you’d like me to try. I finally got my Christmas shopping done! So I’ll be at the arcade a lot next week. SecretChar needs to bring his damn camcorder.
-Van
I can’t believe I forgot this: Cross-up Ogas gimmicks are still in the game. I was doing it very easily when back throwing a Adon out of the corner (which is easy with his new rise speed), and the one on Ryu still works. All the opponents told me my Ogas are hitting cross-up when I set them up, so that’s good. There were only like three characters I tested it on, but they seem to still be there. Yay!
How could instant air U2 ever work given that there’s an ultra animation? Who would ever block low?
Also putting a character in high or low blockstun has no effect on how they can block, no one would ever be able to block follow ups to jump-ins if that were true.
They might try to duck the ultra if you found some wacky reliable setup for a crossup U2. However, I don’t think it’s very likely to work in the first place. Between landing frames, pre-jump frames, waiting for the minimum height, and then the ultra startup, I really doubt you can have a high enough frame advantage for it to hit as a fuzzy guard overhead.
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Sure, that would work. However, you would have to land it multiple times since it would be too small to judge by itself.
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I don’t think a single counter hit on the first hit of the combo would make that big of a difference, actually. Still, it always helps to know for certain.
Testing meter gains can be time consuming and even involve a little math if you want to be thorough, but it could also be really simple and quick if you just want to test something specific. Basically, you could just count what you need to get 1 bar. I’ll try to keep it simple.
1 EX bar = 250 meter
1 whiffed Hands = 10 meter in Super, 30 meter in Vanilla (s.MK xx :sad: loops)
1 whiffed Gekiro = 20 meter in Super, 30 meter in Vanilla.
Completed Gekiro = 0 bonus meter in Super, 20 bonus meter in Vanilla.
So if you started a match and had to whiff 13 Gekiros or 25 hands to gain a bar, it’s unchanged. You could easily eyeball it with half that, as long as the meter started totally empty.
Looking at the videos again though, I think it’s pretty safe to say that the specials’ meter gains are all really low. You could confirm it if you want, and then it would be possible to determine the meter gain on hit, but I think that’s all unnecessary. Any real meter boosts will come from the extra hits of the TC, and reliably comboing into a Gekiro at every opportunity.
What if you train your opponent to tech. You can do a frame trap of sorts, and on one occasion tiger knee the Ultra motion jumping back. If you see the throw whiff, push the button, if you see anything whiff, push the button. Another set up is using a move that leaves you in a position where if your opponent does a move and you do one, he will win, but you have enough time to jump back. I do this with Vega’s Cosmic Heel, where cr.mk would lose Cosmic Heel would win because of it moved my hit box back for the first few frames as if i was jumping. Of course this is safer with Cosmic Heel, and you need reactions for this, and doing this you stop all momentum When you jump back. But hey everybody likes to push buttons no matter how good they are, every now and then.
edit: @mynsk
Opponents would crouch tech on Gen because he has a cr.lk, that now leads to nice damage and a favorable position? IDK its all speculation though right now.
There are actually some simple image analysis tools we could use to quantify some of this stuff if we get decent still shots.
For example, using a scientific freeware program called ImageJ I can tell you that Yeb’s gif example for:
- s.MP, TC xx HK Gekiro
shows ~28.8% of a full bar of damage in the AE shot (ie 288 damage if that is on a 1000 health character).
Note- I did this quickly and not all that carefully so I don’t vouch for my own accuracy on that number, this is more an example of what we could figure out if we have decent stills taken under known conditions.
That’s impressive. I tried to estimate the damage based on scaling and match it in training mode. My exact estimate was 273 damage… and Cammy has 950 health. That’s really impressive actually, and I imagine it was a lot simpler than everything I went through.
just noticed this was yeb talking really… get outta here. you betrayed us! all these… ryus and kens! and guiles! where was our sensei! out gettin drunk with brothel whores! LOOK AT OUR DOJO. YOU ARE NOT OUR MASTER NOWWWW
YOU ARE NOT OUR MASTERRRRR cries and turns his back
Don’t be an asshole. If you want to flame, keep it out of an AE Changes update thread.
oh shut up van if he has a sense of humor he knows its a joke. stop being a dick in the ass.
back to changes. has anyone confirmed any changes on roll safety now on block vs dp. ive seen conflicting reports that nothing has changed and also been told its safe on block from dp now (but not spd)
Yeb represented gen well back in vanilla… Maybe some footage from yeb in ssf4 ae?
He already said he had no access to a decent arcade.
Thanks!
Anyway, these are the steps I took if anyone wants to do this sort of thing for themselves:
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get your still shot (I just used the print screen key copied to a bitmap image in MS Paint)
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open that file in ImageJ (ImageJ is an opensource program downloadable from ImageJ at no cost; my copy is about 2 years old but probably the interface hasn’t changed too much recently)
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use the zoom-in tool in ImageJ (looks like a magnifying glass) to magnify the bar you want to measure so that it is reasonably large enough for you to accurately work with)
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click the “straight line selections” button on the ImageJ control panel (fifth button in from the left for my version)
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use your mouse to drag a straight line as accurately as you can across the full length of the bar you want to measure (health in this case, could just as easily be super meter) For an image that was screen captured from an arcade cabinet you want this to be perfectly horizontal, otherwise just eyeball it
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with that line still on the image, open the “Analyze” menu on the ImageJ control panel and select “Set Scale” This opens up a new window.
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In this new window change “Known Distance” to 1.00. Leave everything else alone (well, you can make the units whatever you want). Click “OK”.
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Going back to the image you are working with, now trace the length you want to measure. To get the most accurate result, this should be the longer of either filled bar or empty bar (for example: if more than half of total life is left measure filled bar, if less measure empty)
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With that line still on the image, press Control M (or select Measure under the Analyze menu). This opens a window labeled “Results”. The number on the far right of that table is the length you’ve measured in term of a full length of bar (so 71.2% percent of a full bar will show up as 0.712 for example).
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From there, figuring out what you want to know is just simple math.
Protip: you can use Control D to mark your line on the image to show what you’ve measured, use the text feature to label your measurements, crop out the useless parts of the image, and save the now modified file.
Typed out it might seem like a lot, but it is pretty simple and I was trying to be thorough. Don’t be too upset if the actual eventually published numbers end up being a little off from what you’ve measured, the ability to do this with absolute accuracy really depends on the quality of the images (and a certain amount of trust that the meters never lie 
).
There is probably a way to do all that if Photoshop too, if anyone is good with that.
[media=youtube]18HNhqplmhw&feature=player_embedded#[/media]!
Some Gen action in the above video. After the dude FADC’s (versus chun-li) into TC and WTF kicks he built half (maybe even a little more) meter. Nice 
Merry Christmas to all
finally a good gen footage that actually put those TCs to work thanks man…anyone know who that gen is?
Last time I played him on LIVE, he was using Adon. And before that, Cody. I pretty sure he’s moved on.
I was messing around in AE today and got some good news for our piano gens. You can buffer the hands in the target combo the same way you could the 2nd mk hands loop in vanilla.
Basically you piano hp, mp, lp, lp+mk, hp. The hp and mk will count as the TC so once you hit hp again you get hands. It’s super simple. If you buffered it this way in vanilla then you will do it 100% of the time 1st try.