At that range I just jump over his pokes with j.hk. I don’t think he can do much about it.
The more and more I play against Balrog, the less I seem to think of it as a truly bad match up. I would say it is only slightly in his favor, because he can be so brain dead with his pokes. But Standing/forward FP can beat rush punches clean, and Rog’s wake up game is honestly worse than Dudley’s . So, once you score a knockdown, you can make up any lost ground pretty easily. You just cannot be careless and need to turtle more. I find I win this match up mostly by getting in a few single pokes, and just trying to score one big combo on wake up and then sitting back.
I have been finding turtling to be an unfortunate requirement in a lot of matches, and I only say unfortunate because turtling is boring not because it is ineffective. If you can gain a life lead, having them come to you just makes all these problematic matches much easier.
The only characters that I think truly have an actual 6/4 advantage are Bison, Chun, and Honda. T Hawk is arguably close but it isn’t all that hard to zone him out either, and you can duck through his Standing FK poke and punish on reaction pretty easily. Everyone else pretty much really feels 5/5 to me so far. Against matches like Guy/C viper/ibuki/akuma/Fuerte, they can certainly mix you up, but I think they are dealing with similar fears in the match. Once Dudley catches up to them he takes off massive chunks of their hp. What a lot of people seem to be considering difficulties, I have just been considering intentional designs. Dudley can hit his super or ultra out of any level of hit. He can do it from crouching, standing, overhead, or jump ins, and he can do it from any point on the stage and with a minimum to complete absence of meter. If these characters could not keep him out, Dudley would simply be S tier. A few characters have moves that are just about too good at keeping him out though. Scissor kicks for instance, and any one of Chun’s buttons, or Honda’s headbutts without Rolling Thunder at the ready.
I don’t include Dhalsim on the list of bad match ups because, I main Dhalsim, and fighting Dudley in super feels like fighting Gief in vanilla. It can be a complete coin toss 5/5 match up. Sim can potentially keep Dudley out forever, and Dudley can potentially destroy Sim completely for making one mistake. Especially because you can catch Sim’s limbs with cross counters, or even beat out his standing FP from across the screen with Dudley’s standing RH (which can be buffered into EX MBG).
I guess I can’t comment on Rose like some people are talking about because I am not sure I have faced a truly good Rose yet. But what at first felt like lopsided matches against Dudley’s favor, now just feel like matches that are not fun to play because the effective tactics are more boring than I would have hoped. Anyway, sorry for the wall of text.
I have to agree with your assessment. Dudley is a god up close. Like you said if he could get in as good and was as safe as say Boxer he’d be broken. 350-450 with one bar and no jumpin. The smartest thing they did was make cr mk slow and not give it too much range. I’d just add that a GOOD Rose feels like Chun with better defense and wakeup options. Her 2nd ultra is like a get out of jail free card. Its like you work to finally get in and get a knockdown you do a little damage then she gets ultra and it starts all the way back over again. Its just a draining matchup. I haven’t been able to figure it out yet.
i found this today, timming is a bit strict but its doable
[media=youtube]baAue8HT318[/media]
no need to block and free punish!
There is no way dudley only has 4 negative matchups I assure you that.
In fact, I think dictator/dudley is 5/5. But you cannot seriously think boxer, ryu, akuma, cody, abel, rose are even (and then, chun and honda) , and imo ill say ken , guile and ibuki have advantage also but still need to work more on that matchups.
It’s obviously intentional design that Dudley gets zoned easily, and is completely free on wake up.
That doesn’t make it any less of a real issue. Dudley loses the fights he loses because of that design. He doesn’t just get a pass for it, if you realize it’s intentional.
how are you fighting so many balrogs? i cant find any online =(
That is exactly what I am saying. No arguments there. I just don’t think that his design is as big a problem as a lot of people seem to think it is because of how good Dudley’s strengths are. Just seeing his faults obviously doesn’t fix the problem though, as you say. But, I think this character is more well equipped in a lot of these match ups than most seem to think.
And to Sharin:
I don’t think Dudley only has 4 negative match ups. I just think he only has 4 truly horrible match ups. All the people that you listed in your post I think only have a marginal edge on Dudley or are actually pretty even. Except earlier I said I had no real Rose match up experience so I cannot comment there. But, I don’t really think Cody is a particularly tough match up. It is no cake walk, but It doesn’t feel anywhere as bad as Chun or Bison.
Anyway, that is just my take on him so far. Call me a fool, or whatever, that is just how I see it.
I can’t comment on Cody or Ibuki but the rest of those match ups outside of Rose and Chun feel even. All of them you can get in on and punish or bait. Even Boxer. I just think we need more experience against good people in these match ups.
Duds is good on wake-up if he takes that risk and tries to hit them. Anyone with a dp or solid wake-up options in general doesn’t have to subject themselves to Duds nonsense. Now Duds is takin a risk. All that work to put someone in a position where nothing is even guaranteed and he himself is horrible on wake-up so if he gets knocked down instead then it’s basically good game peace out.
Talking about baiting and such and such. That’s the human element. You are outplaying your opponent. That’s not the match-up. That’s two humans fighting one another. When I say Rog’s buttons outclasses Duds as does his rushdown and his spacing game there is nothing intangible about that. You can see it, measure it, test it.
i think cody is a pretty even matchup.
The only button advantage I see for for Rog is cr hk. St fierce has the same properties as rogs standing hk. With the step fierce being comboable on counter hit and added range. Jab is even. I agree that mid range poke game is better for rog because of crouch hk. But to say outclassed in rushdown. I can’t agree with.
But all of Rog’s button’s don’t outclass Dudleys. Standing FP rules over everything in that match up. The only deciding factor that gives Rog the advantage in this match up is how far his pokes reach. But that can be worked around. I’d also agree that Rog’s rushdown wins. But that just means Dudley has to turtle more in this match up, which I don’t think is an ineffective strategy at all. However, I do agree, when you add everything up on paper, Rog wins hands down. In an actual match though, Dudley is far from helpless.
The match isn’t rape. 6/4 Rog.
My apologies if this has been addressed before and I just missed it.
One of the biggest problems I have now is against Ryu. My Ryu opponents pretty much stop throwing fireballs from anywhere within ducking/Rolling Thunder range, so those aren’t really options. My biggest obstacle in this matchup is c.mk, oftentimes buffered into fireball. It just seems to stop many if not most of Dudley’s options for getting in. I sometimes try to stay outside of c.mk range, have it whiff, then do f.fp to advance but that’s not the greatest option, and if I use it too much it becomes predictable and then easily baited/punished. Jumping of course isn’t an option.
Ken/Akuma also are similar, but both usually like to do other things aside from c.mk that Dudley can do things about (like step kick/air fireball), but once Ryu figures out how good c.mk is, he falls back on it and I haven’t figured out a really good way around it yet.
you can counter sweep his cr.mk with cr.mk its hard but its there
1st of all you can back dash out of almost every single wake up pressure option that Dudley has. His wake up pressure is non-existent. Even if you do an unsafe MGB on wake up, it will counter hit, they flip back and allow any member of the cast to EASILY punish.
this mai like to use c.mp if you space it at the proper place it can kinda snuff it out before it gets there. c.mk also works from further distances, but im not really a fan of that move. my 3s roots had me terrified of this match as i have nightmares of roundhouse just stuffing any thought that would pop out of my head, but this match still feels kinda 4.5/5.5 at worst.
are you option selecting? you can also meaty with f+hp that move is hella active and its meaty properties can let u combo into other shit if it hits late enough
also his midscreen wakeup isnt the best, its his corner wakeup where he is strongest.
besides backdash option selects…
What are his back dash option selects? Meaty F+HP is very unsafe but yes, I believe you can combo on counter hit.