I agreee with 99% of it, as Adon’s IAJK is extremely difficult to pull off constantly.
CH is easy to counter. After the 5 active frames theres like 15 frames of lag. He is free for those 15 frames, or you could just lvl 2 FA him, for a free combo. That nerf was unjustified.
Spent the evening last night playing AE.
As far as I can tell, Vega is basically the same character, really all the complaining in this thread is a little over the top. We’re talking very small changes that you can get used to fairly quickly.
U2 is slower, its small, but its there. Still the Ultra of choice IMO, although I don’t think using it as a poke whiff punish is a good idea anymore 
I didn’t get an oppertunity to try the new combos. I’ve never used RCF in my general gameplan, and I don’t know where to fit it in
Unless theres something I’m missing, CH nerf is not anything to worry about. Still has the same functionality. I didn’t get punished for using it at all, its still a great move.
I’m going to have to work out what all the hype is about this c.mk, I didn’t get that much out of it, but I wasn’t focused on using it I guess. I’m going to try some of the suggested frame traps this evening and see if I have any more luck.
ALSO, Honda got hit by the nerf stick bad. I mean like…reallly, really bad. This match up is so much easier. The Honda I played couldn’t stop my jumpins without EX meter, and his damage is…just not scary anymore. If this was a problem character for you, the match got much easier.
Blanka’s stupid balls are easier to deal with (slide!), but the Blankas in my area never really used them as a pressure tool. There are two really good Blankas in my arcade who raped me senseless, so while he’s worse, hes certainly not free. His river slide being safer seems to be an out and out lie, I punished that move everytime.
I have a feeling that Vega might end up being an interesting match up against the twins. They do HUGE damage, but its really possible to keep them out. I haven’t worked out how to deal with Yangs shadow dash yet, though, that move is amazing. Yun’s damage output is…scary. I saw him down a Zangief in like 10 seconds with a couple of good guess.
Speaking of 'gief, his new hand is weird. I’m not sure how to deal with it yet. Honestly, backflip might be a really good option at this stage.
Guiles pretty nerfed as well. The damage output and meter are really noticeable. SH does no damage. He’s still really good, hes just not beast anymore.
Going back tonight, anyone want me to try anything?
Test cr.mk,cr.mp,exFBA pleaseeeee
Those characters aren’t Vega.
There are moves like Hadoken in the game, but that doesn’t mean that Balrog should have one.
Maybe Vega should have a move with the same advantage as step kick, but it would be for a reason other than “Abel (or whoever) has one.”
Hmmm Vega’s worst match ups from before:
- Abel
- Honda
- Cammy/Rufus
- Chun Li
- (for intermediate players only) Dictator
- Boxer
- Who am I missing?
Abel - nerfed, though not sure
Honda - nerfed hard
Cammy - nerfed
Rufus - not sure, but I think nerfed.
Chun Li - nerfed, but not enough to actually notice
Boxer - not sure
On the flip, Yun and Yang may be bad match ups. Fei Long could get nasty, still don’t know.
Rose is probably easier.
Seth… meh… not sure
Dee Jay probably will be harder.
Viper is the same.
Sakura will probably be harder
Hakan will probably be harder
Dan will probably harder
T-Hawk will still probably be harder.
Gief - not sure… sure the improved SPD sucks, but with psychic EX green hands not giving him a knockdown and okie, it may be easier.
Gouken - probably about the same
Blanka - about the same, maybe easier
Akuma - probably similar
Adon - Probably similar
Guy - Probably harder
hmmm… For all we know Vega may be stronger simply by default.
Let me know if you disagree with any of these match ups, and what you think about the match ups I’m leaving out.
Other noticeables:
Guile: nerfed
Ibuki - neckbreaker nerf, close normals buffed
I would have put Guile on that list but yeah, pretty much like the way Vega’s looking relative to the rest of the cast.
OK the reason being, it was fine as is. 14 frames of hello you can now start focusing, mash DP, or neutral jump. But let me be serious with you. It complemented his kara-throw game very well. It gave him a weak mix up that lead to a good outcome if you managed to land it. In a game dominated by mix ups. And now to be dominated by even more “mix up” bullshit, thanks to the addition and betterment of “mix up” characters.
cr.mk though, should set up plenty of shit up
LOL, vega is the same. cant see the cr.mk hype, i dont blame you cr.mp seems like a good button. he changed a lot, for the better or the worse is yet to be seen. I already have ideas on where I want to take him. Little changes like CH being -3 on block, its a big change, and if you used it as an offensive tool put two and two. Im going to be a straight out ass right here. Stop using cr.mp as your default button.
@JDH
-Seth could run a train on you. Badly. His playstyle really raped characters like Vega. With the loss of nj.hp though I cant see Seth zoning you and getting you in a position where he can land the hammer.
-Sakura is a defensive beast, but I think it was slight advantage to her. Buffing her normals and adding stun means more shennanigins that force you to block more allowing her to build meter and mix you up and hurt you better.
-Ibuki, i think is going to be harder with better frame traps and normals when up close. Playing Alex’s Ibuki when AE drops is going to be a pain in the ass.
Hmm we’ll see.
But I like cr.mp
this CH being -3 on block is only if you use it like, at the closest possible distance I imagine. I have not been punished for using this move, most people just try to throw it, which is easily techable. I imagine if you based the majority of your game around this move, this would be a pretty huge deal, but it wasn’t my go to move.
I’m going to try and work in cr.mk. It’s really long, and this additional start up speed could be a real bonus.
Hmmm Sakura may turn into to being a shitty match up yet. I’ve had a lot of luck with nj.roundhouse in this match up.
I’m sure everything will be fine. I can’t wait - Philadelphia, the closest city to me, is getting AE in an arcade I used to like going to before Super (University Pinball).
I thought it was 7-3 in Vanilla favor Sak, Tatsu did to when Sasaki asked him.
Destin and I believe Sasaki said 6-4
and iirc Joz said 5-5 most likely mistaken
In Super it was much more bearable, and it was a slight advantage Sakura because of damage.
My question is though, where is Vega going to land given that they gave
Adon better normals
Blanka better normals
Cammy better normals
Cody better normals 3f cr.lk
Dee Jay better normals
Dudley better command and regular normals
Gouken better normals
Guy better everything
hakan better everything
Ibuki better normals
Juri better normals
Ken better normals
Makoto better everything
Yun and Yang who look like they can take you out fast
where is Vega going to be in the tier list, or, how good of a character is he still compared to everyone else.
I always thought it to be 6-4 Claw’s favor, me and my friend (one of the best Sak’s in FLA) play constantly and I continuously get 4-5 game win streaks on him. Although he does use U2 because of habit and AA.
A lot of the characters you named that are getting better normals currently have such an assy set of normals that better normals still won’t let them match Vega’s speed and range. I mean, I’m not so worried about Blanka’s better normals. Not Cammy’s so much either, unless some of her improved normals have range and priority (like chun’s normals). Not fearing Dee Jay’s buffs either. Cody’s 3 framer is definitely going to cause us some heart ache but if we play him at the right distance maybe we can minimalize that, too. Ibuki only scares me if she gets really good frame traps. Now Hakan, Juri, Ken, Makoto… that could be a problem.
The Abel MU is going to get ALOT better, although its probably either going to still be in his favor or equal.
- Breathless was nerfed so hard so already the MU has gotten that much better and both ultras do less damage.
- He got nerfed stuff in general, like less damage on his tornado throw.
- We got buffed backdash which is HUGE for this MU, since OS step kick always took out like 400 dmg.
Buffed backdash is really making alot of matches easier, you have no idea. Dive kick characters such as Cammy will be easier cause of the backdash buff, and she lost instant meterless cannon strike. Catching people on the first non invincible frame happens alot, but when they are grounded on that frame it really sucks cause it leads to a ton of damage. Now Vega is going to be reset everytime on his first noninvincable frame till frame 19 so its going to be awesome. If his forward dash got buffed then escaping is going to be even easier and more effective.
The only thing (besides obviously how much better the other characters have gotten) that truly makes Vega’s MUs more difficult is depending on how much you relied on U2, since its going to be useless as an AA and made it even harder to combo into. Probably the only thing its going to be useful for now that U1 can’t do, is for avoiding chip kills.
I know I am going to be using U1 now because I am guaranteed to hit the other player if they are in the air when I hit the wall, unlike U2 where I have to hope that they were high enough and attacking. If they fix U1 hitbox then that’s all I would need.
@pedo- Yea, Ibuki got so buffed. What sucks is that she does 20 less dmg on her kunai combos and on neckbreaker. But her buffs more than account for that nerf. I still believe its going to be 5-5 MU vs Vega though. Vega’s offense is very effective against her, and Ibuki’s offense sucks… until she knocks you down, then its the other way around completely.
@JDH- Ibuki is going to be scarier for sure, because now her main frame traps are two framers which means no grabbing her mid block string. I also forsee Makoto, and juri becoming worse MUs defensively.
I think he will be worse in the tier list, not that I care much about the rankings, but its still disappointing.
Lets take a look at the latest japanese tier list at eventhubs (which seems a bit off to me, but the tendencies are about right [Viper low tier? I doubt that…]) and I’ll refer to the colors used for seperating the tiers (I’m writing this from the top of my head…)
Almost all characters below Vega recieved major buffs with the exception of maybe Gen, Fuerte, Cody and Viper (whose definitly higher IMO).
The mid tier chars (red) recieved mostly buffs or stayed the same, exept Blanka and maybe Rose (U2 nerf)
The high tiers (green) stayed the same or recieved small nerfs, but I think not that much that they will drop significantly, I think Cammy will be more annoying with the normal buff even without ICS, Seth has to be seen, almost a new char…
The top tiers got nerfed, but exept for Honda not too heavy, I think Chun and Bison will stay on the top, Guile dropping from top to high, Honda possibly to mid?
And Yun and Yang will be on the same level of matchup like Cammy, Abel and Rufus or even worse…
So yeah, I think a lot of characters will potentially shoot ahead and not many dropping behind Vega.
cr.MK buff is nice but not a game changer, the flaws are still there and with the U2 change it will be much harder go get out of pressure situations (which is already hard enough, since its so easy to safe jump, but the U2 startup in Tatsu’s Match vs. Warakh made me almost cry, where he activated when Guile was in the appex of his jump and pressing a button, but could still block 
)
I just want to understand why they nerfed CH and U2, where he’s not even close to OP and the only character without any I-Frames on his specials. Maybe they just dont want him to be viable after the ST disaster, but he already plays nothing like ST, they made sure of this with the huge recovery on walldives and the small Izuna grab range…
And about Chun: I hope her crouching hitbox got fixed, its so retarded, EX FBA Combos are missing so often, where even crouching Blankas getting hit. Not even Viper FFF Combos (with 2x cr.HP) are working…
My thoughts exactly. Even if he didn’t recieve all those nerfs and only just the buffs would he be high tier? Probably. S tier? No where near. So he’d be mid to high at best…what exactly is wrong with this?
And yeh the hitbox which was supposed to be fixed in Super still really hasnt with some characters like chun.
its very common to read that chun its so good, so top and yet nobody had won any major (ricky doesnt count, he play chun just for gief), just like vega, chun have some big problems, and SBK its not always the answer, its more like a gamble… rufus, cammy, viper, guile and gouki are her worst match ups (specially gouki is just retarded) and those characters are very common on tourneys which is why vega hasnt won any major too, very similar weaknesses imo…
What do you mean ricky doesnt count? You need a random to win with Chun to validate that she is a top character? Keep in mind that top tier in this game does not mean S tier or OMFGWTFSOEASYMODE character. You also forget that Vega deals damage to a strong opponent when he manages to open up his opponent. Chun Li does not have to do that. The more i think about it, the more I realize Cosmic Heel was Vega’s random factor. Chun has ton of that shit. What does Vega have now?
They nerf Vega because scrubs and new players think he is cheap. It’s really quite simple.