I think its funny that people that doesnt even play Akuma come in our forum to feed on the tears, thats really annoying…
Also i read this today: “Is that all the updates for those fighters or are there more changes to come for them? — C0r33
Seth Killian: I think the SSFIV AE 2012 live location tests may have some surprises still in store.”
So maybe we are the lucky ones and they secretely buffed something we dont knw about yet, i refuse to give up hope just wait for our Demon King Tokido to post something on Twitter
I think it’s to early to decide on the switch, but I liked what you stressed: characters were buffed AND changed. People are happy they got both stronger AND have something more to look for in this game. We… don’t.
It’s damn true that not only they nerf’d us, but could’ve at least given back something to make up for that, even the smallest change to look for (I don’t even consider that horrible damage boost on Armageddon worth mentioning). Look at Makoto: sure they nerfed her health and her damage output slowly, but she’s still there, ready to kill you in a couple moves. And they gave her a cancellable target combo people were asking for, and a couple buffs for her normals.
Instead, nothing. We’ll just be forced to experiment a bunch of new safejump setups, try to come up with some third world shenanigans to make up for the loss of crossup tactics, change the timing for all the corner stuffs, research new unblockables and whatever.
I… love you.
But you know, people will still think Akuma is a heavy stunner (I still meet people who’re like “why you not using HP Shakunetsu in combos” “wtf YOU FGSJSKJDSDS” <-- my reaction), his teleport is impossible to beat (when it’s no more than a mere noob killer), his vortex pressure is so braindead easy it’s autopiloted, with zero risks involved (if you fail you are either a retard or a scrub) and impossible to escape, he got a walkspeed so high it’s retarded (quoting from italian boards here) and so on.
I really hope something will change because of Killian’s Twit, though I’m not really expecting anything.
Two frames is going to be extremely difficult to pick visually. I was kinda hoping this (awful) Akuma would just plain go for a setup so we could see the full extent of the change.
Wish it was vs Fei, seeing the new forward throw vs Gief won’t help us much because his lariat is 4f and x2dashes safejump doesn’t work against it anyway.
Yeah, didn’t really expect to see that being 2 frames.
I don’t think the guy was awful, more like he wanted to test stuff - like when he wanted to throw, he knew of the nerf, that Gief moron was just teching. Still I really thought stun would’ve worn down, but last combo alone dealt like 125+200+160 stun, so it makes sense I guess.
Random stuff:
Fei seems really to have slightly less pushback; FADC to CW seems pointless on those characters it doesn’t get 3 hit. Why do I have this dejavu?
Yang’s b&b now does crap damage. -10 off every cr.LK and -20 off the final hit of the rekka, he lost like 25 % of the b&b damage.
Couldn’t really figure out Yun’s height restriction, feels like Yang’s? You could see the recovery though. Palm still builds okay meter, I’m glad.
Yuns height restriction still seems lower than yangs. I really feel bad for yang players because capcom seriously went overboard with this shit. His damage wasn’t that amazing to begin with and when i tried him out, you can’t go crazy with him like you can with yun.
Yun will have a harder time now with wakeup pressure due to the increased recovery on upkicks and higher height restrictions on divekick. I don’t know exactly but it seems like it will be insanely hard to do crossup divekicks after his standard bnb into upkicks. I think many players will opt to end combos with lunge now. He still looks solid otherwise.
Ibuki…I’ll give you that. Seth and Viper? Are you joking?
Sure there is - it’s called blocking.
Only the scrub mentality believes you need to always do something.
Sure it is. Other characters can mix up like Akuma, even better. That means the characters in question with weak defense are also weak to the other vortex characters. If the concern was to help them against wake up vortex more than Akuma would be nerfed.
Since nobody else was it’s a good bet the underlying concern had nothing to do with defending against a wake up vortex.
Akuma’s focus is mediocre at best. His normals are sub par, the weakest of the 3 original shotos. Lowest stamina and lowest stun and very average at best damage output and below average stun output.
He already has built in handicaps to offset his options.
Actually they would be right. Balance is best achieved through improvement, by making more character viable instead of a rotating door of characters who aren’t viable.
Just because it’s hard doesn’t mean it isn’t the best solution.
You improve the existing tools. It ends when you have made every character viable.
You mean the one where his best matchup is 6/4, his worst is 4/6 and he has a majority 5/5 matchups?
So no the “statistics” don’t suggest otherwise. In fact they suggest that he is one of if not the most balanced character in this series.
no. im not saying that they are bad charcaters, but them having strong mixups is justifiable by them having a bunch of garbage slow normals, or seths walk speed. IE. fundamentals
akuma has strong mixups as well as a strong fundamental ground game
I don’t know why people who don’t play Akuma are posting in here just to antagonize. Find something better to do. The majority of you likely still be free to Akuma anyway because the fact of the matter is you’re probably not very good.
It’s amazing that a character who is only top tier on paper got nerfed so hard. There’s barely any Grandmaster Akumas in Japan and only 2 akumas in the WORLD are really making any serious noise. Yet Viper stays the same LOL…
I wanna see what Tokido has to say about the location test. I can definitely see the lag on the throw in that match vs Gief.
Seth and Viper have good fundamentals and good options overall. Just because some of their strengths aren’t the same as Akuma’s doesn’t mean they don’t have as many or are as strong.
Actually Akuma’s ground game is only as strong as the player due to his small hit boxes and low active frames. Even though his normals may seem similar to Ken or Ryu they are measurably inferior.
Dude I have forgotten more about fundamentals that you have ever known. If you actually knew what you were talking about this ridiculous fundamentals argument wouldn’t even have surfaced.
Fundamentals amounts to more than just good walk speed.
thanks for stating the obvious with that last line, but i’ll ignore your rather poor attempt to draw me into an argument and just explain what i mean
its the basic ability to do things that arent bullshit. seth and viper are full of bullshit. its all tricks, shenanigans, mixups, smoke and mirrors. things that are more player reliant.
fundamentals would be things like zoning ability, normals, anti air. these things are quantifiable character available tools. a perfect example of a fundamental character would be fei long, or ryu. no gimmicks, just basic streetfighter 101. in sf4’s engine, a 3 frame crouching short could also be associated with fundamentals because of the way crouch tech and throws work
with that being said, youre going to make the case that viper and seth have good normals, or zoning ability? i’ll concede the anti air, because they both at least have options, even if viper’s is weak. i dont think viper has much of anything faster than 6 frames with any real range to go with her fast movement. and seth, while having a few solid normals cant really move around to make effective use of them on any characters outside of zangief. theyre both also well below average at zoning, and their best crouch tech OS options are 5 frames.
so if they are weak in 3 of the 4 fundamental aspects of the game, how can you make that argument?
contrast that with akuma, who has 3 and 4 frame OS options, the best movement in the game, above average AA and zoning, and some of the games best ranged normals, and its not even close. akuma has very strong fundamentals to match his bullshit, viper, seth and ibuki, do not
By ID01’s logic, It’s always a 50/50 after you a blocked Akuma’s DP FADC, while it’s really not. The probability of an Akuma player going for another DP is NOT 50/50. It is indeed a situation where you must choose for either blocking or teching, but the probability of a DP is much lower, because Akuma’s DP is especially punishable on whiff. We will only use it as a mixup, but NOT 50% of the time. \
Same for the Demon Flip mixups. After the throw was nerfed, it became a VERY risky option to use, but it held the greatest reward because the opponent would get grabbed standing or crouching. At least we had Palm to force the opponent to stand up and be safe at the same time.
In this case, the probability of an Akuma player going for throw is again lower than the palm. It’s not a 50/50. The throw is a mixup option, but not the obvious choice.
I’m just here to tell you that I didn’t said any of those thing. Some other jerks bought up the 50/50 argument. I didn’t even say any of Akuma moves is any of the percentage. I said under specific situation for characters with no 4frame reversal, it is at least a 70/30 against vortex mix up.
Hey great to know you have to call someone a jerk because you couldn’t actually come up with a decent point.
I brought up the fact that people act like anyone can pick Akuma up and turn his vortex into a guessing game when really that isn’t the case. It takes a lot of practice and the ability to read an opponent to make the vortex deadly. I was making the point that calling it a 50/50 is misleading because in the end the player controls the mix up not the game engine. So it is less about randomness and more about trying to figure out the other guy’s pattern.
Something most people can’t do so they complain about it instead.
just wait for our Demon King Tokido to post something on Twitter 