somebody said that cl HK -> crMP is possible now
It seems his crouching medium kick recovers super fast.
Look at this vid: [media=youtube]ySOTSwSMteA[/media]
Skip to 1:55 and behold his uber fast recovery:D if he did this same move on ssf4 console, then he would eat a combo, but now he can block whiffed cr medium kick. Many of you know this already, but i see this as a nerf and a buff…
PS: i think a 7 year old is playing this ryu:D
I main Ryu and have been waiting for Yun my favourite SF character for a long time so ppl are gonna get super salty with me! Cant wait! lol
Has anything changed with the invincibility frames on the Shoryukens? Not much trading going on in the videos so far? I hope they are all still 3 frames though. It would be amazing if MP Shoryu had 5 frames of invincibility. Can someone test it against Akuma’s DPs?
Good use of Close HK in this video at about 30 seconds
[media=youtube]On3bxutXOew[/media]
It stuffed something that Gouken was trying to do? Would it have been a crouch tech?
i think tatsu isnt linking after a cl.HK, otherwise any of Ryu´s normals would too.
my 2 cents about chars. effectiveness in SF4 serie:
About fireballers beeing hystory in AE, its just that SF4 is a game where the close up game is much more powerfull than playing from a distance, and some of the guys with fireball aint that good at close range in SF4. Akuma will still be good to go for tournaments, Im sure.
SF4 looks a lot more like SF3 than SF2, but i think it took some time for people to learn the game properly, and maybe the Sagat’s factor influenced too.
In the early days of SF4 you rarely did see somebody acting between a unproperly performed c.mk xx hadoken block string. In the final days of SF4 and the early days of SSF4, it was rare to see someone that dont punish a c.mk xx hadoken block string done from the wrong distance. The people were just learning the game.
In the early days of SF4 you would see no one using Feilong or Cammy and applying their close ranged game. All you would see at the time was people doing something very basic with Rufus, Abel and Viper (the last one didnt spread too much fear, maybe coz she doesnt made it into many finals, i guess it were due her bad matchups). What changed on Fei or Cammy from Vanilla to Super in order to make theirs close ranged game so efective? I dont play with Cammy, but I played with Feilong since Vanilla (not a char for tourneys but I spent like 15% of my game time with him) and I dont even know what changed on him from Vanilla to Super, it seemed identical to me.
I was alredy worried at the time, with that closed range effectiveness. At a given day I did read that Ono and the SF team was a bit upset with the way the throw was working in the Vanilla and that they were thiking about tweaking it somehow for the Super. That made me happy at the time. Then the Super came out and the throw system was exactly the same. I guess they just noticed that any tweaking on it would to change the entire game system completly, they would have to rebalance it all, almost from zero, then they decided to give up on modifying that.
Afterall, the process of the chars with “just ok” or worse close ranged games beeing not competitive is something that didnt start with AE, neither with Super. It just got worse with them.
At least SF3 was cool in a way due the parry system, that was fun.
Well something that needs tested for Ryu’s game is whether or not the reduced active frames on cr.MK have made cr.MK, FB an interruptible block string.
SSF4 Ken’s cr.MK is 4 frames startup and 4 frames active and 13 frames of blockstun .His Hadoken is 13+1.
Not a tight block string
SSF4 Akuma’s cr.MK is 5 frames startup and 3 frames active and -2 on block His Hadoken is 14. Again you can Shoryu before the FB
SSF4 Ryu’s?cr.MK is 5 frames startup and 5 frames active and 13 frames of blockstun. Hadoken is 12+1. Tight block string.
If his cr.MK is now 3 active frames then as long as the blockstun is still 13 it will still work. Is this right?
the recover frames of a move dont matter when you are canceling it. When the move get canceled, it ceases instantly and the new move begins. Nothing is going to change about the c.mk xx hadoken string, at least not due the c.mk tweaking.
Anyone know if it’s corner only?
at the end of the video i link into c mp:
[media=youtube]F8BPsdF61y4&feature=related[/media]
from the look of it, it may be corner only
here you can see c.mk put to good use. It functionally same way and the duration is shorter. I just can not see how this is a nerf.
And yes it will work on block strings. you are canceling out the recovery frames so it would matter how like it takes.
SSF4AE c.mk > any version prior.
after the canceled c.mk, do the hadoken reachs the opponent in less frames than it did before? i cant see how thats happening with a c.mk with the same startup and the same block stun as before. I really cant understand how it can be.
Lets say you canceled the move at its first active frame (5f). How is the outcome different on AE than it would be on Super by only a change onto the c.mk’s final active frames, that will not even to exist coz you canceled the c.mk on its first active frame?
You know, Id love if that come to be true, but if they only changed what they said they would change, I dont think that it can happen at all.
damn it just made a long post and lost it all.
For the guy above me. I am not sure what you mean. Everything looks like it functions the same way. but just a shorter duration and what I mean shorter duration I just mean on wiff which is what counts i guaess because you would be cancelling it into something else anyways if it connected or blocked.
I will just summ things up.
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A match on the fron page shows dp trading and ryu staying grounded. The one with zangief.
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A guy on the front page tweeted that cl.hk, s.mp xx hado works.
i think i got your way of thinking. You think that the c.mk only gets canceled after the last of the active frames, dont matter which active frame hit the opponent, right?
Even if you hit the opponent with the first active frame, according to your assumption, the c.mk only gets cancelled after the last active frame, that was the 10th frame of the move (5f from the startup + 5 active frames). Once in AE the active frames got reduced to 4 or 3 (?), according to your hipoteses it now gets canceled at the 9th or 8th frame. Did i get it right?
I think that the cancelling dont happen that way, I suspect the move gets canceled as soon as you imput the hadoken command. But Id never read it anywhere, its just a suposition based on my experience.
Id like to find a more reliable font, because I had never heard about how exactly the cancelment process happens in SF4.
It definitely doesn’t work that way (only starting the hadoken after the active frames are finished.)
Most moves in SF4 don’t have high active frames/low recovery but it’s obvious with the ones that do.
Take Makoto s.MP xx MP hayate. s.MP has 5 startup, 7 active, 7 recovery, and is +5 on hit. MP hayate has 16 startup. The only way that combo can possibly work is if the cancel starts during the active frames.
So no, less active frames on cr.MK cannot possibly be a buff to cr.MK xx hadoken unless they added more recovery to the move than they took out of the active, and kept the advantage the same.
On the other hand, if the move is faster overall (took away active, didn’t add recovery) but the advantage didn’t change, then it’s harder to whiff punish, but cr.MK xx Hadoken becomes worse.
cr.MK xx FB doesnt become worse. If the hitstun is the same then nothing should change as far as canceling into the fireball. I dont think the FB has to be cancelled during the active frames, you can cancel into FB even if you hit on the last active frame. I believe there is a short window to cancel after the MK connects regardless of which frame it hit on.
What Im concernered about is did the reach become affected by the change. It seems to me the cr.MK had a hitbox that moved forward after becoming active unlike the cr Roundhouse whose hitbox just appeared/disappeared in place. Thats why Ryu can always combo into sweep as long as hes in reach but with MK he cant combo into from max distance. With less active frames the reach could be affected.
Also Im wondering what affect less active frames have on walk forward, cr.MK xx FB. With less frames you would have to input the fireball faster causing input leniency to mess you up. If so well that means they just made Ryu’s footsies worse. He would have to pause longer to counter whiff after walking forward, making his cr.Mk “slower” than the 5 frames it actually is.
I dont know whether its a buff or a nerf, buuuttt if they did it to help his recovery so not to get punished, then maybe they shouldve, i dunno, adjusted his recovery frames? Its either Capcom using their ass backwards logic again or they are using their nerf bat again.
I dunno maybe its nothing significant but the ish looks fast
well, nobody was talking about if c.mk became worse or better, it was just about the c.mk xx hadoken block string. Somebody affirmed something I found hard to be true (less time between the c.mk cancelment and the hadoken coming out) and we had a little talk about that.
Thanks for the vid and info man. You guys are lucky!
Frank
The distance C.mk reaches out is the same. It’s just faster, and less active frames. Which means you can’t whore it out. You have to stick it out intelligently or you’ll miss your opportunity.
And that shit about walk forward cmk fireball is incorrect. It works the exact same. If you pause before you press c.mk— then your wasting time. Practice pressing the button slightly later. You’ll usually get a fireball. Cancelling on the last active frame should net you that.
Blockstun is the same, C.MK is the same. The only time somebody broke the block string was when it was at max distance, which was unsafe since vanilla.
You pretty much have to do more work is what it all comes down to. It’s like SRK-- the timing became more lenient. Is it still unsafe to jump at Ryu? Hell yes… but the Ryu player has to execute the uppercut properly or else he loses the trade.
Just adjust your timing, and don’t throw C.MK out like an idiot and you’ll be fine.
Huh? The part where I talked about cr.Mk xx FB was in response to Arc-Rail saying it would get worse. The rest of my post was ME talking about whether cr.MK has become better or worse.
well If the hitbox moves forward the longer it is active then that means the range should be affected to any change to the active frames. How much depends on the change. Like I said it could be an insignificant amount.
Thats something I already practice. What I was talking about is whether or not did the change have any affect on that scenario. Specifically whiff punishing. In super, its a tight window between getting an srk(doing it too soon), combo’ing into ex FB, and the ex FB not combo’ing since the whiff punish will be @ max range. No I dont currently pause before the MK I pause after. Now with the change I was speculating if less active frames has any effect on that input window thus either causing the need for the pre-pause. I never said whether that was the case now, just speculating.
Because less active frames at that range (because the hitbox starts out of range and moves forward) means you must input your paused fireball sooner than before(how much sooner). So that you will either get a srk, or you wait the proper time to avoid the srk but then your fireball wont combo. But you say it the same, either way I’ll find out myself soon.
edit: NVM For some reason I was thinking MK range was dependant on active frames but thinking about it some more they prob are not intertwined. There is no reason for the range to be dependant on active frames 
If anything it should reach max range faster