Cool, so I should slide under his Condor Dives instead of using an AA and poke him to death?
You have to be very on point with your AA against T. Hawk. Always pay attention to his jump arc. He can do an early low-angle Condor Dive into a command grab or do a high dive to beat out cr. HP or an early ST. If your reactions are good, you can almost always hit him during the recovery of his low-angle Condor Dive with cr. MP xx Spiral. Watch out when he has meter or U1 stocked though since he can grab you if you’re slow by even a few frames.
Always delay your AA until the last possible moment to see if he’s going to dive or just use a normal jumping attack. EX ST is actually useful in this matchup. Either delay it like you would for an SRK or do it the moment you see the opponent go airborne. If you do it when Hawk is at the height of his jump, ST will lose to Condor Dive. Assuming your opponent does not have perfect safe-jump timing, EX ST will catch Hawk out of any of his jumping normals.
Slide will help you dodge high-angle Condor Dive and reset the situation but it’s risky at close range where can do a normal jump-in and command grab you if you’re still in recovery. Play cautiously.
I prefer to go with U1 in this manage to punish poorly-spaced Condor Dives. if your opponent isn’t dive-happy though, you can run U2 and still have Soul Piede to punish poorly spaced dives.
This is not a matchup where you want to throw out Soul Spark unless it’s on T. Hawk’s wakeup and you’re outside of EX Condor Spire range since he can always jump and dive at your face. If you’re confident in your fireball game, EX Spark is good AA if he commits to a forward jump from far range.
Jump-back LK is a good instant overhead in this matchup, especially after jump-in fierce. It’ll beat his command grabs (obviously) and even EX Condor Tomahawk Buster if timed properly. Will lose to U2 though.
cl. MK is not as useful in this matchup as it would be against other grapplers since T. Hawk has EX Tomahawk Buster. I don’t recommend taking too many risks in this matchup, particularly if your opponent is inclined to mash on wake up.
st. HK is a great poke in this matchup but if he jumps it, you’ll be forced to block at best and perhaps eat a combo at worst. Don’t whiff it. Also, take note that it will whiff against Hawk’s cr. MK. Stick to st. MK at close range since it will hit his cr. MK and if you whiff it, you can cr. HP in time.
Overall, just play smart and play patiently. You’re going to be winning this matchup by wearing Hawk doing via fireball chip, instant overheads, pokes and AA, not by going in and mixing him up. The option’s there, of course, but do play smart.
I appreciate all of the helpful advise and breaking down each aspect of the match-up. I’d say trying to mix him up, not properly AA’ing and a lack of patience is what has got me killed most of the time.
No problem. T. Hawk can be a horribly frustrating matchup. I would know. 'Tis matchup knowledge earned at the price of numerous quarters and gallons of salty tears of rage. Many a round I have played flawlessly until I fuck up one AA and eat a big fat Mexican/Native-American ass to the face for the lose. Fuck that shit. xD
Ah, Objection/Jordyn?
I play against his Thawk all the time and I’ve known him for a few years now. Just stay at the range where his st.HK and cr.MK whiffs and harass with towards HK/standing HK. Don’t backdash when he jumps and just react to whatever he’s doing with U1/soul throw. Don’t ever jump at him when he has meter, and be wary of ex condor dive whiff into SPD/U1. His go to frame trap will always be st.HK to catch your jump back and his SPD mixups are always obvious lol.
Also, do not be scared to mash ex spiral on him early on. Doesn’t matter if he blocks and punishes it. it means he’s not gonna press buttons against you later in the set, and you’re free to get in a few back throws. Great thing about grapplers is that they never tech 
I think that’s what is name was. Also, every time I did ANY version of Rose’s drill or dropped a combo I’d got scooped up like Fritos. I didn’t really jump at him at all during our match and condor dive was the main thing that got me killed.
If you want to guess with drill, just make sure it’s revesal ex one. Anti airing THawk is tough. I suggest going into training mode and have the THawk dummy do all sorts of jumps and delays with condor dive so you know when to anti air with cr.fierce or soul throw.
Drill blockstrings are a nono against grapplers, just poke with MP or cancel that into ex fireball to push him back.
Actually; you have to play each grappler differently because they all have different properties lol.
There are no Zangiefs in my state, so that doesn’t apply to me
I have Aquasilk, his Zangief is a pain to go up against. Whenever I get the chance, I’ll update the first post with the T.Hawk match-up.
Playing against a good Zangief is a nightmare for me. You can zone him but one mistake, one bad spaced poke => SP. I just got defeated in the last tournament I entered by Zangief 
Sometimes even my far sHK has been grabbed! Anyway, I don’t think it’s an uneven matchup, it’s just hard to know when and where you have to push the buttons.
That’s the one thing I hate about the match-up. You can zone Zangief pretty well for the majority of the match, but as soon as he gets one SPD, it’s all guessing from there. You can lose pretty much your whole life just on wrong guesses. I love using F+HK for far AA’s, and whiffed Lariats.
but wake up EX ST can stop his loop / make him miss his OS EX GH no ? in addition with EX ST, it will beat his cross up lk thingy (the one he hits you with his knees) since it has 8 frame startup. Just watch out to not abuse of it when he jumps because he could just be baiting for this and do a delayed headbutt which will beat your EX ST
Do you mind if I do a detailed write-up first before adding that info? I’ve had more time to play against a local T. Hawk today and I want to get a more comprehensive take on the matchup before anything is committed to the opening post for all to see.
Please do, by all means
My take on the T. Hawk matchup
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Rose v. T. Hawk
4.5 – 5.5
Overview
Like with all grappler matchups, Rose wins against T. Hawk by keeping him and whittling down his health with pokes, AA and fireballs. Unlike other grappler matchups however, T. Hawk has some unique and tricky tools to get in with. Fortunately, Rose has all the tools to counter T. Hawk with but they require the player to know exactly what situations to use them in and the reactions to successfully react to the situations. As usual, the risk-reward ratio is skewed against Rose. She cannot safely mixup Hawk. She can keep Hawk out the whole round and then lose to a single hard knockdown and a series of good guesses on Hawk’s part. This matchup is generally a grind and requires you to be on point the entire time.
Preferred Ultra
Both Ultras have their merit in this matchup. U1 is a fantastic punish for unsafe Condor Dives. U2 is great for providing that (slightly) safe pressure that Rose sorely lacks against grapplers. If your opponent cannot properly space his dives or mashes on Tomahawk Buster or Mexican Typhoon, use U1 to punish his recklessness. If your opponent plays safely however, U2 is more helpful and can help you pressure T. Hawk after knockdowns. Keep in mind though he can always throw you if you get too close and your orbs rotate away.
The Fireball Game
T. Hawk has the unique ability with Condor Dive to punish fireballs without having to be within jumping range. This ability compounded with Rose’s extremely slow fireball recovery makes throwing Soul Spark incredibly dangerous and unrewarding. A successfully thrown fireball will typically grant you a negligible amount of meter, a little ground and miniscule chip. A poorly spaced fireball equals 120 damage (or 150 if T. Hawk burns meter) to the dome plus knockdown. Do not bother throwing fireballs unless you are nearly a full screen distance away where it is safe and you have nothing else to do. At midscreen Rose has way safer options to keep T. Hawk out. Please refrain from shooting yourself in the face.
The Poking Game
Unfortunately I have not played any Hawks with good footsies so my knowledge in this area is sadly limited. What I do know is T. Hawk actually has decent far-reaching pokes though he can’t get much damage off of them. Unlike Zangief, Hawk cannot o-s his pokes into specials. They are still good though. St. MK will whiff-punish Rose’s slide, st. HK will punish attempts to jump after a knockdown, and cr. MK reaches a fair distance and goes under Rose’s st. HK.
Rose can more than match Hawk’s pokes however. St. MK will beat cr. MK. Rose can beat st. MK by simply not sliding (not that she has much reason to get in T. Hawk’s grill to begin with) and staying out of its range. Hawk’s st. HK does good damage but you can avoid it by crouching and not jumping recklessly. With a decent amount of anticipation and good spacing, you can whiff punish it with cr. HK. Ultimately, if Hawk is at a life deficit, he cannot stand around and poke at you all day; he needs to go in.
Anti-Airing T. Hawk
This is where the match gets tricky. T. Hawk has one option extra than most characters with his Condor Dive. You have to be very on point with your AA against T. Hawk. Always pay attention to his jump arc. A well-timed cr. HP will beat his other jump-ins but will lose to Condor Dive.
T. Hawk can do an early low-angle Condor Dive into a command grab or do a high dive to beat out cr. HP or an early ST. Always delay your AA until the last possible moment to see if he’s going to dive or just use a normal jumping attack, then respond as appropriate.
ST is actually useful in this matchup. Either delay it like you would for an SRK so it catches T. Hawk in the middle of his Condor Dive or do it the moment you see the opponent go airborne. Note that ST will lose (even the EX version) if your opponent dives immediately after his jump.
Slide will help you dodge high-angle Condor Dive and reset the situation but it’s risky at close range where can do a normal jump-in and command grab you if you’re still in recovery. Play cautiously.
Beating Condor Spire
Only EX Condor Spire is safe on block at -3. The rest of the versions are -7, -8, and -10 on block respectively. You can anticipate Condor Spire and neutral jump to punish though if you guess wrong, Hawk *can *Condor Dive behind you and command throw you. A safer and more reliable option is to use cr. MK xx MK Spiral o-s. If cr. MK whiffs nothing comes out but if hits a Condor Spire, you’ll get the MK Spiral punish.
T. Hawk will usually throw out Condor Spire to maybe gain a bit of meter and ground from full screen and use it to catch backdashes up close. The main version of Condor Spire you want to watch out for is the EX version which has a bit of startup invincibility and goes through projectiles. You can’t punish it in most cases but you can bait it and get Hawk to waste meter.
Punishing Condor Dive
First you need to learn how to recognize unsafe Condor Dives. Once you learn that, punishing them is pretty easy. Soul Piede (forward HK) and st. HK are reliable and damaging punishes. If you want to fish for cr. MP xx MK Spiral, slide will put you into that range. Reversal U1 will punish unsafe Condor Dives hard.
Pressuring T. Hawk
The first rule about pressuring grapplers is that you should not do it unless you really need to squeeze out that life lead. The second rule about pressuring grapplers is that you should not do it unless you really need to squeeze out that life lead. Basically do not take unnecessary risks.
Unfortunately, cl. MK is not as useful in this matchup as it would be against other grapplers since T. Hawk has EX Tomahawk Buster. If your opponent is inclined to mash that on wakeup, just stand slightly outside of his command throw range and whiff a normal to try and bait out his DP. If you notice he likes to mash the command throw instead, use cl. MK to punish that but only if you’re confident you can land the 1f link follow-up combo. You’ll eat dirt if you can’t.
Jump-back LK is a ridiculously good instant overhead in this matchup, especially after a hard knockdown. A safe-jump fierce followed by instant overhead j. LK will beat his command grabs (obviously) and reversal EX Tomahawk Buster. You can do it after a techable knockdown that puts you directly next to T. Hawk. Keep in mind this will lose to U2.
I do think it is possible though for T. Hawk to EX Condor Spire and throw you after the instant j. LK however. I haven’t seen anyone do that but be on the look out. It should be possible.
Other than instant overhead j. LK, safe-jumped j. HP->cr. HP xx EX Spark should beat mashing if you’re willing to burn the meter.
Getting out of T. Hawk Pressure
This is the nasty bit. T. Hawk has some damaging punishes for escape attempts, all of which result in knockdown. Thankfully, they all require a decent amount of guesswork. Condor Dive, Condor Spire, and close-ranged cr. HK will eat your backdashes for breakfast. st. HK and Tomahawk Buster will beat jump attempts.
T. Hawk has a great safe-jump off LP Tomahawk Buster. Pay attention to what the fuck he does and respond appropriately. If you try and backdash, Hawk will simply do another jump upon landing and catch you in your recovery. He can cross you up with his body splash or he can choose not to. Cross up splash will rape if you try to reversal EX ST out but EX Spiral will get you out safe. If you EX Spiral against non-crossup Splash, you will get your face planted in the ground or in the worst case eat a fat Mexican/Native American butt to the face. Thankfully if your opponent fails at life and can’t time his non-crossup safe jump properly, you can just EX ST him for free.
There is no guaranteed way out of proper grappler mixups. All I can say is pay attention to your opponent’s habits, do not freak out and mash buttons, and keep your head on your shoulders instead of facerolling your stick/pad/keyboard.
Dealing with T. Hawk Gimmicks
Yes, this gets its own section because as we all know (or should know) by now, T stands for “troll”, not “Tony”, “Thunder” or whatever shit people made up.
The “instant” Condor Dive into command grab should be the most common T. Hawk shenanigan. I’ve tried to punish it with cr. MP xx MK Spiral and I usually end up eating dirt and looking like a right fool. Neutral jump it if you know your opponent’s going for the throw or if you’ve got bollocks crafted in the fires of Mount Doom, throw Hawk instead.
Crossup Condor Dive is a bit trickier to deal with. All I can say is go into training mode as T. Hawk with the dummy set as Rose and figure out the range and setups for the crossup. Get a friend to block for you or try and eyeball if it’s a crossup or not by yourself.
T. Hawk also has his cr. LP dash in U1 and cl. MP into U1. Most people can’t do that however but be alert and don’t be afraid to hold up if you get the feeling your opponent wants to make you eat ‘dat T. Hawk ass. In desperate situations for your opponent, always recognize his most damaging option and anticipate and counter it.
Concluding Tips
· Do not take unnecessary risks
· Make T. Hawk come to you and kill him poke by poke, AA by AA, punish by punish
· Don’t freak out the moment you get knocked down - keep a clear head, don’t follow your first impulse, and pay attention to what your opponent is doing
· Don’t drop combos – you’ll eat a command throw for it
· Be on point with your AA. Winning this matchup consistently requires Rose to transform into a complete No-Fly Zone
· Get your spacing and footsies game down. Once you shut T. Hawk out of the sky, he’s going to have to commit to the ground game, which is what Rose excels at.
· Risk-reward of most wakeup exchanges is seldom, if ever, in Rose’s favor. You can win one round with a good guess but don’t expect it to pay off consistently
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Thank you for typing up a very detailed match-up, this will help a lot. I encourage more people in the Rose community to do this. Even if you’re not entirely confident in your match-up knowledge, as a team, we can pitch in and make corrections.
Couple questions about this matchup-
What do you guys recommend after a blocked EX condor spire? Jump back lk? Seems like RPS at this point between his SRK, SPD, standing HK.
What do you try to punish with if hawk is just doing short spires at range to get in? I have no problem reacting to a whiffed early dive, but can’t seem to get used to the spire.
It wasn’t mentioned, but I feel like focus forward dash->SPD works for him also since his forward dash isn’t completely awful like gief. Something to look out for if you are just throwing out big pokes.
Anyone know how to deal with the Juri matchup? Got blown up 10 straight matches by one of the local Juris. Matchup feels ridiculously hard. Can’t reversal against her frame traps because EX Spiral is ass, can’t slide or I’ll eat dive kicks, can’t throw sparks or I’ll eat dive kicks, can’t cross her up after Spiral knockdown because of her ridiculously low forward dash, can’t mix up her up properly because I have to guess between EX Pinwheel or Kasatushi. Am I missing out on something or is this matchup really that bad?
I think the Juri matchup is in Rose’s favor, actually. IIRC, EX pinwheel is throwable on wakeup, and so is her parry, so if your opponent is getting saucy with their wakeup options, just throw them. They have nothing that will beat a throw on their wakeup. Have you tried option selecting an EX spiral or something after the crossup? IIRC, you can option select Rose’s j.mk. Rose beats Juri for free in the footsies war, and she shuts down her zoning with reflects. You only have to really worry once Juri has you in the corner, which I would just not tech unless I saw a really obvious throw coming. Also be wary of whether or not she has fireballs charged. Juri’s low fireball is her LK one, so they can’t tech if they’re storing a fireball.
I have never, ever had my slide punished by a dive kick by a Juri, though. Are they doing that on reaction or are they just dive kicking hoping to catch something?