181

I’m not sure since I don’t play SF3…but…

can you pick Gill in the arcade to play as? If not, then that’s why you can’t use him in a tournament.

182

Yeah, im not sure about arcade, that is why I said console. :karate:

Ok different example, certain CvS2 characters arent allowed to be used, and I am pretty sure their available on both versions, arcade and console.

183

Actually no dick riding, just an agreement on what he said. I’m a nobody in the halo 2 community and I admit that, but I’m actually trying to be someone…and winning a tournament with MLG rules in both FFA and doubles is a good start, even if it was local it was a pretty big tournament.

184

Ok I’m off of work now and I have time to go into the details that I so reluctanly avoided.

I honestly don’t know where to start. I guess I’l go into facts before I get into my own opinion.

To go in order from statment to statment… thanks Weeks for the props on my sig (it’s a true story) lol

Now on with the ridiculously long post I so wanted to avoid typing…

I’m sorry If I came off as rude. I was trying to make a clear and neutral point as I was leaving work.

ParryAll, I know nothing about you or your take on proffessional gameing, but in your responses you see to be mis-informed or misunderstanding something that your have read or witnessed some time here in the recent past.

The reason why it was even brought up is because MLG is the reason why bungie incorporated the updats that included the BR start.

For a long time many members of the MLG community have been trying to get Bungie to incorporate a BR start system to better balance matchmaking gametypes. It wasn’t until sometime recently that Bungie finaly saw the reasons to do so. I’m not sure if you are familiar with the MLG vs Bungie saga that was going on for a long time. It happend when the supporters for bungies current game settings challenged the requests of the supporters of the MLG settings. This is a passage taken from the article I posted earlier:

*MLG had already built up a reputation as the premier format for competitive console gaming, so when the first people who became frustrated with the imbalanced Matchmaking settings began looking for alternatives, they soon discovered MLG settings. In turn, they also found that MLG settings squelched most of the gripes that they were having with the game in general. Over time, the word spread and MLG became established as the authority on balanced competitive play. It was actually quite a phenomenon. By this point, just about anyone who frequently plays Halo 2 on XBL has at least heard of MLG and its professional game settings.

…And so a grassroots revolution was born – and along with it, the great “MLG vs. Bungie” myth. This “rivalry” couldn?t be any more misunderstood. Bungie and MLG get along just fine, and we have a mutual respect for each other’s views and goals. They make games for the gaming public, we have built a national league for the competitive-minded, and we both support each other. The player communities that have built up around Bungie and MLG are actually the ones who do all the fighting and disagreeing, which neither company can be held responsible for. People who disagree over things they are passionate about are going to argue, and things have gotten out of hand and out of proportion. However, I think things will quiet down very soon between the fan camps as Bungie introduces its Team Hardcore playlist. *

This passage clarifies the reason why some people accept MLG settings and why some people just want to keep it how it originally was.

All the patches Bungie released were influenced by the feedback they have gotten from the general Halo public. Of course Bungie cannot satisfy both sides so they are making the best decisions they can in order to make both sides happy.

Now Bungie understands the reasons why MLG settings were made and they created the new update. The Hardcore update.

This issues and discussion has long since been dissolved and further discussion is unnecisarry.

The Radar issue has been discussed as well. Check this article.

That article goes into great detail on why Radar is on/off.

Certainly the makers have reasons for setting the games the way they are, but they have proven open to change (Bungie?s weekly Humpday Challenges often include non-radar games, for example).

If you were a dedicated Halo 1 player, you would know that the general competetive Halo 1 settings had no radar. This is just another step MLG took in bringing Halo 2 as close to Halo 1 feel as MLG could.

Actually MLG is accepted by those players that want to take the game much more seriously than XBL. MLG is not a online game community. It is a National Tournament community that was given the oppertunity and ability to practice and scrimmage to get ready for easch MLG event via XBL.

I stated this before in this thread. While players and friends happend to get into custom games where their budies were practicing for events they would ask… “what is MLG”… because of this the term MLG spread really fast. MLG’s settings are for tournaments. It just so happens that the people who played the settings and liked them wanted them to be standard for all online H2 gaming. Thats impossible… but it doesn’t matter because these settings will remain the settings of MLG’s events wether online or off.

MLG’s events are LAN events not online, even thought we do have an online tournament system running.

The players that people see as the best are the players that have placed high and won tournaments and events repeatedly. Bungie doesn’t hold tounraments, but MLG does and so do other organizations… and if you look closely at the names… you may recoginze some of the same names through out the list of top placers.

This is where I think you are mis informed.

If you didn’t know… StK/TDT or whoever you may recognize all become known players because of MLG’s events. This was back in the Halo 1 days where the so called “imaginary” world/rules that are being incormporated in MLG’s H2 settings come from.

The fake players you see are the real Ogres 1 and 2, WalshyakaHotshy the first person do beat TDT Darkman twice to become known as the best FFA player, and Saiyan.

I’m sure you didn’t know but the Ogres are members of the MLG community forums. They have been for quite some time. Zyos, TDT, all the known players of the Halo community all are original members of the MLG forums. Being a moderator, I see/chat with them alot on the forums. We have all seen them play. I’ve met them on many occassions. I’ve been around them and other well known players since the second major Halo 1 tounraments [AGP]. Have I seen them play? I LAN’ed with Walshy, Ogre1, Zyos, and other players you probably wouldn’t know not too long ago at MLG Houston. You know the Ogres (and the billion others) montages you watched? They were originally posted on the www.MLGPro.com forums. I remember when Ogre 1 first posted that 41-0 video of him playing KOTH. The topic went on for 60+ pages.

I’m not sure of a good legit way to prove their membership if you want proof, hell, I’m not even sure why I’m going out of my way to post this crap, but sometimes the misinformed need to be informed. Join the forums and you’ll see them posting quite often now (they use to share 1 account, but the admins had them create seperate accounts so they would know which one they are talking to on the forums)… they use to not post often at all really.

The other guys in the “funny part” are mods and admins of the MLG community. Pooper is a good friend of [MLG]Clap - one of the founders of MLG. Dolbex is the webmaster of MLG’s website, he also helps with pro player interviews and is in charge of site updates. Synide is an administrator - pretty much runs the forum and Dyslexia is the master mind behind most oof the articles I posted and you see on the site.

They ALL have played with the Ogres and whoever else you want to mention on many occasions.

Actually I have a link to one of the many interviews that they have done with them:
http://www.mlgpro.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=657
http://www.mlgpro.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=764
http://www.mlgpro.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=599

…and you said the ogres would play you with regular SMG start?

Taken from the interview:
in refference to the first H2 downloadable patch

*Walshy: It?s like they merged Halo 1 a little more into this game, so a lot of those people who had extremely good pistols in Halo 1-you start seeing them come out a lot more, like Doug (Strangepurple).
Ogre 2: I haven?t actually played with him yet, but everyone I?ve talked to said he?s amazing. And he told me that he hasn?t gotten second place yet in a game. But that?s Doug.

MLG: So there may be a return of Strangepurple to the MLG Halo scene?

Walshy: I see a lot more of the players getting into it again. I saw Gintron playing a bit more. You start seeing some of that individual skill get back into it again, and it?s pretty awesome.

MLG: So you think it takes some of the randomness out of your shots now, like Halo 1?

Walshy: Yeah, it doesn?t give you the automatic kill when you get the first shot or two. The person you?re shooting can turn around and do a lot more damage or even kill you now.

MLG: What kind of stuff about competitive play still bothers you that didn?t get fixed totally with the patch?

Walshy: That?s a good question… I don?t think they should have changed the dual wields so much in all honesty.

Ogre 2: No one will use them now. Because the battle rifle is better now and the dual wields are weaker, so one?s gonna be using those. They should?ve just left the dual wields and made the BR stronger or something like that.*

As I said… you may not be fully enlightened on what you’re talking about, so I went as easy as I could to clarify things for you.
If you need to find me or you need proof of anything I said… join www.MLGPro.com and I will prove EVERY word I said in this post there.
I’ve been around the MLG community for a LONG time. The people there no me and they can also help clear up any misconceptions you have about MLG.

Actully I’m not like that. You havn’t seen me call anyone names in this whole discussion. I wasn’t refering to you as inexperienced because I can’t judge you without knowing you. I was talking about the differences betwenn a serious competetive player and a casual player who hasn’t experienced high level play… and I don’t call people n00bs because theres no point. The word has no meaning anymore. You hear it so much and it’s been used up IMO.
Anyway, I don’t sing praises to pro’s I like. I don’t even have a favorite pro. I consider myself in the same boat they are, serious competitors. The pros in the Halo community have done alot more than I have. I’m just trying to get like them.

To sum things up again.
MLG ran Halo 1 tournaments since it was first released. When Halo 2 hit, the gameplay was generally accepted by the MLG community as severly unbalanced and map control was alot easier than it was in Halo 1. So many of the top players in the nation and most of the MLG community started to disapprove of Halo 2 as a tournament title, mainly because it lacked the feel and gameplay and strategy stlye that was needed to succeed in Halo 1.
So in order to maintain MLG’s commpetetive tournament player base, MLG created rules, game types and match settings that would give their player base the closest feeling they had when they attended the old MLG Halo 1 tournaments.
Through custom games and xbox live communication, MLG’s game types have spread and been missunderstood.

185

Actually I have played in CvS2 tournaments and the only characters not allowed are Shin Akuma and God Rugal, available on console but not available in arcade play.

Regardless, this issue is kinda moot because whether I shall or not MLG is probably here to stay

186

banning gill is like banning sniper rifle/rockets,very terriable comparsions of ur part! :wtf:

anyway AZnhadoken has started the newest SRK clan and if u wanna join talk to him!

187

MLG is garbage, no matter how many “pro’s” support it. And Weeks is right, it is here to stay.

So I just have to accept the fact that the MLG community doesn’t feel they need to ever increase their skill in Halo 2, just MLG.

And you said so in your post, Chiefy, that MLG is trying to bring Halo 2 as close to Halo 1 as possible.

That, right there, is the single biggest mistake anyone could ever make. I don’t want to play Halo 1, and anyone who DOES needs to stop playing Halo 2, and go get Halo 1, since they obviously don’t have it, and start playing on XBox Connect. I’m not into Halo 2 so I can play Halo 1, I’m into Halo 2 so I can EXPERIENCE SOMETHING DIFFERENT.

So, Chief, all you’ve done with your extensive proof is prove;
A) MLG players lack talent, so they bitch and whine to get their way.
B) People don’t want Halo 2, they want Halo 1, so they try to change H2 into H1. Which is retarded.
C) MLG supports ignorance, and stands for stupidity, but when anyone questions it, then that person is lost, doesn’t know what he’s talking about, and obviously isn’t into competitive gaming.

I’d love to come and kick some piss-poor MLG ass, but I lack the funds and the team. Cop out? Well, the people I’m talkin shit on will think of it like that, but I don’t see anyone going out of THEIR way to come play me, and I’ve only had two invites from your friends, Chiefy. Neither of whom invited me to a game when I got online and accepted their friend invites.

188

Tournament play is based around the arcade release. Gill is not selectable in the Arcade game, hence he is not used in tournaments. In fact many people refuse to play tournaments on the console versions of 3rd Strike, even though they are nearly arcade perfect.

However, even if Gill were selectable in the arcade version via some wierd code, he would not be allowed in tournaments anyway. Similar to how Akuma is not allowed in Super Turbo tournaments. Doing a code to unlock a secret character who is ludicrisly more powerful than the rest of the cast would be like entering a code in an FPS that enabled god mode or unlimited ammo or something, which even though it’s “in the game”, wouldn’t be allowed for obvious reasons.

-reserved space- …I’m gonna read through Cheif’s and everyone elses comments when I get time, right now I have to go to class.

189

This quote shuts up 90% of your post immidiately.

…as for the rest of it.

You have your opinions of MLG and you are entitled to that. The recognized proffesional players of the MLG community that “lack talent” are the reasons why BR start was incorportated. When Halo first hit online, did you witness how quickly StK rose to the #1 spot on the leader boards? Second was St8 Rippin and the rest were all the other well known/respected teams on the MLG community. Rumble Pit consisted of Zyos, Sad Panda, Ogres, Walshy, and many more top players from MLG’s community. It was like this until al the cheating started. Do you know why they excelled so quickly? It wasn’t because they didn’t have talent, it was because they were using the same play style and techniques they used in Halo 1. Teamwork, Map dominance and Map Generalship.

These are the same players that dominated almost every event MLG holds. These are the same players that the majority of serious Halo players listen to and watch for advice and skill techniques. These are the same players that nearly quit the Halo 2 when they realized how newb’ed down it was. These are the players who first realized how unbalance bungies matchmaking settings were. This is why almost noone took MM/Levels seriously in the MLG community.

In order to maintain a tournament sceneMLG needs tournament level players. Halo 1 events is how MLG became known. Halo 2 nearly killed the competetive tounrmanet scene for Halo. Why would players want to travel to events when they can stay at home and play online? How could MLG get the serious players off their ass and out to their events? One answer…

By giving them what they want.

MLG struggled for months thinking of ways to continue the events they hold with Halo 2. They studied every game setting possible in search of ways to balance the game. They took advice from the pro’s that attended and dominated their events and everyone from the MLG community to make Halo 2 the most balanced/tournament worthy game possible. Calculating every situation and strategy that could be exploited.

For example 1: In the situation when you spawn in with an SMG, and your team has map control with all the range weapons. How can we give each respawner a fighting chance. In H1 everyone had a Pistol. So if you spawned and were immidiatly being shot, if you had the skill you could turn around and TSK (three shot kill) your opponent for a sudden turn of events. That kind of move takes skill. If the member spawned with and AR (assault rifle) there was no chance of winning that situation. Same in H2, if you spawn with an SMG and your opponent is peppering you with BR fire, There is no way in hell you will kill that person, especially if he/she is an experienced Halo player.

For example 2: Many of you may remember the severe map unbalances of maps like Zanzibar and Burial Mounds. If one team gor ahold of both snipers on Burial Mounds all they had to do was camp the Alien Sniper spawn point with both snipers in the back by the rocks and two BR holders mid range who called out and pepper fired anyone who came within range for the snipers to fight. There was plenty of BR ammo and the member who went to grab rockets or a plasma pistol was easily covered with snipers ready to take down anyone whe even thought of shooting him. And the fact the the weapons spawn times in H2 were so specific that when a power weapon like Snipe or rockets was picked up it wouldn’t respawn unless the gun was dropped or deleted from the map for 30 seconds (on most maps). That made TS on burial mounds %100 broken. The only variable was the skill level of the team holding the power weapons.

Example 2B: The same facts were true if a team had the lead and got control of both snipers on Zanzibar, but it was even worse. Before the update, the BR range for precision fire was drastically short because the bullets from the 3sb (3 shot burst) spread too much to hit a long range target precisicely. This drastically increased the number of shots it took to kill a long range opposer. Even if you got a BR, can you imagine trying to hit someone who was located in the sea with a sniper and a warthog with infinte rocket fire (since the vehicles were convienetly locketed out there. Plenty of BR ammo on the Sea wall and a rocket coube be see comming from a mile away to be dodged. General strategy? Get a hold of both snipes and go to the ocean. This still holds true today and is the reason why Zanzibar is NEVER played in MLG gametypes.

Top pros even found a way to dominate Blood Gulch… sorry Coagulation (too much H1). Before the update there was 1… you hear me? 1 rocket laucher on the entier map. If you can tell me a sure fire way to take down a banshee who is piloted by the guy holding the rocket laucher that won’t respawn until he drops it with an SMG as your spawning weapon of choice… I’d worship you for life. God forbid the team have both snipers. GGPO. Even if the other team had both snipers, do you know how hard it is to destroy a vehicle with a sniper or even a BR. It takes almost twice the Ammo the gun holds. Don’t even try counting sniper shots. When one team controled rockets, they control the vehicles.

These were all originally found and posted by MLG’s top players and pros on MLGPro.com in order to find a sure fire way to make MLG tournaments more balanceed. All these situations and many more like this were takin into account.

The first events that were held we for the sole purpose of testing the settings they found in an actual event. The first two events were ok but needed tweaking. Today some gametype settings are still being tweaked, but MLG’s goal has been acomplished, filling each event with hundreds of serious competitors.

I seriously doubt that MLG would care if Bungie used their settings or not. The reasons why the implent was even intended was because it became appearant that MLG’s settings were advertised and being accepted as a more balanced game set and the casual players wanted to play these settings without wait in custom game lobbys and or attending an MLG event that was out of their region. So MLG players started advertiseing for an MLG playlist in matchmaking settings. The result again, was Team Harcore. The Title MLG settings would be misleading since MLG and Bungie have almost no ties to each other. Just the players of the same game.

I understand from your arguments that you believe that true proof of skill is being able to take back map control when you spawn in with a single SMG. To each his own, but in the MLG community having to do so in a serious match with thousands of dollars on the line is nothing but a severe handicap for the lesser. You can’t tell me you feel comfortable facing a very good opponent when he has a BR and you spwan in mid-range to him with an SMG. Yeah, you can run for cover but what kind of offense does that give you? Especilly when they have the better positioning and control of all the main weapons for the map.

Anyway whatever. I’m tired of writting books to try to clear your mind of the thoughts that MLG is for n00bs. You know that the players that succeed are players that understand what weapons are needed to win and the players that fail are the ones that don’t care or understand simple facts that BR doesn’t win every situation. MLG players understand amd follow the same creeds non-MLG players do. It’s just MLG puts more focus on balancing these situations instead of constantly winning them.

This is my last explanation of this. Everything else I say will be about you’re match with true MLG players.

190

can some1 give me a other links to halo1 and 2 tourny vids?
thx!

191

Dan, go to www.halo2forum.com and go to the video section. They have lots of vids, including professional gameplay.

192

Chief, let me get a few things straight … I want to get this argument as clear and concise as possible but I need to know a few things…

About the very best Halo 2 players in the world: do they only play MLG rules (no radar, etc.), or only play regular rules (radar), or do they accell at both?

Are there any major tournaments outside of MLG ones?

Before I respond to some of the things you’ve said, I want you to think about this:

   Many oldschool, top level, tournament winning Street Fighter 2 players shun Street Fighter 3. Why?  Because parrying removes a very basic element to the game.  This element was fireball traps, and many players who dominated every version of Street Fighter up until this point could not compete in SF3 at a competitive level.  This was clear by how badly Japan used to own the United States in this game (and to an extent still does).  **Many felt that Fireballs, fireball traps, and the like were "what made Street Fighter, Street Fighter"**.  Does this situation sound familiar?  


   To make a long story short, new players emerged, and old school players either evolved their skills to adjusted to the different gameplay, or died off, or just don't play SF3.  **Or some Still Play SF2**, because they prefer that game to SF3.  Hmm...


   Now, the latest re-iteration of Street Fighter 3 has an advanced option menu called System Direction.  This allows you to mess with the game settings on a very deep level.  In fact, **one could actually change the game rules and make SF3 very very close to SF2, gameplay wise (like taking out parries, etc.), **if one were so inclined.  Now are you seeing what I'm getting at yet?  


   Now let's think for a moment.  Let's pretend Street Fighter is as big as Halo 2.  A bunch of people on message forums start bitching and complaining that Parry is unfair, that parry takes away what makes "street fighter, street fighter".  In fact, many of these players who complain are world renowned Street Fighter 2 champions **(note: this is all true.  In fact, debates go on TO THIS DAY, by anti-parry, SF2 purists, many of whom are former world champions... )**.  These people banned together and started playing Halo 2...-*cough* excuse me, Street Fighter 3-... by their own, group determined  Street Fighter 2ish rules.


   All of a sudden, you would have people playing 2 different games.  Could you imagine how retarded this would be?  Top Japanese players would never travel over because the United States decided it was going to play a different game with different rules.  It would be totally different game with a totally changed Top Tier, unsafe moves would become safe, tactics would be completely changed ... it would be rediculous. 


   Apparently though, according to you, this practice is widely accepted in the Halo 2 community.  And, well, then, if so, I think the whole Halo 2 community is retarded.  Now quote that, take it out of context, and call me an idiot, which is probably what someone will do.  My point stands, if you want to take a game seriously on a tournament level, it doesn't matter what top level players, what who says what, the bottom line is everyone needs to be playing the same game or it's all fucking irrelevant.  End.
193

Woah…err yeah I’m currently mike-less thanks to my folks…

194

I want to add one more thing.

So yes there are “Cheap” and “abusable” tactics in Halo 2 that perhaps even the developers didn’t forsee. There are some imbalances, etc. Well, you don’t confine your mind to a preset rules IE “I don’t throw in Street Fighter because it’s cheap”. No. HELL no. Fuck no. If you want to be a top level player, you throw, you kara throw, you abuse the hell out of the best moves and characters. That’s how you win, that’s what makes you a top level player. And if you want to compete, start abusing the same tactics, you figure out ways around them, then you figure out the ways around the ways around, and you evolve your game. You take it to the next level. You don’t bitch at the game and then change the rules. You man up.

It has been this way for every competive game. Let’s ban Magneto, Sentinel, and Storm from Marvel, they are cheap and the whole cast doesn’t stand a chance against them. Halo 2 may be just as cheap and unbalanced as MVC2., but people play it and all abuse the same “cheap” tactics and win tournaments. Justin Wong dominating Marvel like he does is no fluke, even though that game is unbalanced as hell.

If you don’t like the way MVC2 is played, if you prefered MVC1 (which some do and it plays WAYYY different), then by all means go play Marvel 1.

195

Rush, your arguments are dulled by your confidence. Times change. Do you know about BR combos like BxR? Because I find it funny how you said you can beat a BR with a SMG any day.

edit:

Ascension. Take both snipers, position yourself so that the enemy team always respawns at banshee platform/rocket platform. SMG start btw since that’s what you guys prefer. You will keep respawning there while you get sniped/BR’ed. The least you can TRY is hide out till some moron comes by and you kill him and take his weapon. That won’t happen. There’s no way around that, going for the overshield won’t help.

Stop trying to make halo similar to street fighter, cuz it ain’t. In street fighter/fighting games, each character has their own advantage/disadvantages, giving them a tier. If you’re an elite/spartan spawning in the situation i just described, you don’t have a c.FP to stuff sniper shots, or the ability to roll cancel through bullets. The two games are not similar. There is no way out of the situation I described above. You simply lose. With a BR start, you can at least shoot the snipers to toggle them out of their scope and make your way to some cover, and work from there to gain map control.

What will you do in that situation with a SMG, Rush? Since you did say you are good enough to gain map control with a SMG.

196

BxR will rape almost any weapon upclose. If you think the n00b combo is cheap, than try fighting somebody upclose that knows how to use BXR, it is impossible(press B to melee them, cancel with the X button and shoot with the R. It only works with a full clip).

197

Okay.

The pro players and whoever plays MLG doesn’t only play Radar off. Default Halo play has always been radar on. It wasn’t until people started getting serious that radar was decided to be off for tournament play.

The articel I posted in a previous post makes a clear explanation to why (most) standard MLG gametypes require radar off… and the history behind the decison.

As for if they accell at both? I think th article touches this as well, but from my view point. It is generally undrstood that radar on makes matches somewhat easier to play and also increases camping which in turn slows down gameplay. Of course theres really nothing wrong with that, it’s just a question of what takes more skill? Camping knowing who’s comming around the corner? or Camping with no idea of what to expect. It can be understood that a good radar off player would be just as good if not better with radar on.

Yes… VGL and AGP(who recently stopped tournaments) to name a few. All of them mimic MLG’s game settings in some way shape or form.

If you’ve heard of WCG. They hold Halo tounaments for the WORLD not Nation. World. They had the idea of running their H2 events with default settings. Their events are usually 1v1. They announced one of the gametypes. It was 1v1 collossus and Zyos (who is a member for the american team) said, “really? Then I’ll just dual wield and camp in a corner to force a tie”. If you think about it, it’s literally the smartest thing a true winner could do in that kind of setting.

…now they are implementing MLG’s settings to an extent or not even holding H2 this year.

To an extent this is EXACTLY what happend at the release of Halo 2 except the fact the the game has settings that can be adjusted as a player sees fit. MLG used these options to try to balance the game for their tournament events.

This is possible to an extent , but wouldn’t be wise to do if it was possible, in 3S. When 3S hit people get use to the game as an arcade title. Anything different to the slightest degree would not be accepted as the same game… and wouldn’t be taken seriously i.e. the DC version of the game with it’s slightly faster frame rate.

Halo and Halo 2 were released straight to console, standard settings for the games play aren’t really standard since the game gives options for litterally everything.

The changes in H2’s gameplay were intened to balance the game. Not to satisfy players prefferences. Settings like radar on and the equivelent are lesser issues. If the majority of the MLG community wanted MLG to start doing their events with radar on, it probably wouldn’t be a problem. The main issue for MLG’s changes are gameplay balances that involve map control and power weapon issues.

If 3S was ported to console only, this argument would be valid, but since the standards for the game were determinded by the developers when the arcade release hit, the standard way for the game to be played is generally accepted as the arcade version/settings.

Standard gameplay for 3S is the Arcade version. No more no less. If the game was unbalanced and unplayable to begin with, then maybe altering settings and whatever would seem feasable.

Standard gameplay for H2 is whatever makes the standard unbalanced gameplay balanced.

Even so, two different genre’s with two different backgrouds for what is accepted and what is not.

I follow this creed to every extent. Saying “no throwing in street fighter” makes me laugh. Throws do not make street fighter unbalanced. Neither does Kara throwing, AHVBx3 whatever. But if a character could kill you in one hit that would be broken and unbalanced. Since that charachter can’t be toned down with options, what do you do? Ban that character from tournaments. There are banned techniques in MLG events. The list is longer than I imagine, but it’s nothing that goes along the lines of taking away the use of certain guns or removing power weapons on the map. It’s glitchs like getting on top of maps and using infinite ammo glitchs (and much more). MvC2 bans all sorts of glitches (Gambit, Juggs, to name a few). And characters have been banned from many tournaments for games across the board. For what purpose? Balanceing the game.

The reasons behind the changes and rules SRK enforces are not different from the reasons behind MLG’s. SRK uses rules that follow the guidelines to match the Arcade versin of their titles. MLG’s rules are set to ensure players are competing on the farest grounds possible.

This is true but the General play style of MvC2 is the Arcade version. If Mag Sent and Storm were console only charachters I can assure you they would be banned from tournaments. Again, Halo and Halo 2 were given to the community as console releases with options for what ever they wanted change. If Halo 2 was an Arcade release and followed the same creed that SRK follow’s, the game wouldn’t be taken seriously by proffesional Halo 1 players and there would probably be no tourny scene. Even if it was released to console later (assuming it was an Arcade release first) and people balanced the game to make it playable with customizable settings, it would have more success than 3S since the game started out unplayable and was made playable. This kind of thing would be considered unbeliveably gay for fighting games at SRK, hell, possibly even at MLG. Could you imagine someone trying to make a broken fighting game playable? It wouldn’t work and it would be hard as hell.

3S and MvC2 started out playable not broken and unbalanced like Halo 2. Think about it. In fighting games (MvC2) included there are counter characters. In Halo 2 there are powerful guns that don’t respawn unless dropped buy the holder, that means if he doesn’t die the other team will not see a sniper,rocket laucher the whole match. That is broken. Theres no real counter to that game design glitch but at least you can give everone some kind of chance. BR start.

I don’t know how else to explain. I can say i undrstand your stand point though, it’s just that the situation and reasoning is still slightly different for both sides. I think the misunderstandings comes in when deciding the reason behind the rules and reasons behind the changes.

Finally! Someone esle who knows what they’re talking about.

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Hey there’s a new matchmaking game type called “Team Hardcore” it’s like Slayer/Skirmish stuff but with no radar OMFG!

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It’s basically Match Making MLG setting style.

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Eih…maybe. Except that you also start with a pistol in the skirmish-type games. Dunno if it’s MLG style or not cause I’ve only played 3 games of it.