I can’t say for certain on the techincal aspect of your question
but I do know last night fighting a team of Juri/Ryu the fella was very dive kick happy and in the scenario you mentioned I was able to punish him every time.
even when he mash tagged Ryu in knowing he’d be punished – I was able to hit both Ryu and Juri.
Because he was a fellow Juri I also felt bad, so I tried to show him ways dive kicks and kasatushi could be used (he used kasatushi waaaaay to much)
I hope he learned a few things…
okay. I know its normally negative but was curious if it changes the frame data if it’s the tk one. I go for a jump in or neutral attack to confirm, but was curious if it was dropped how much of a punish is juri open to.
When done close to the ground maybe it’s -5 I’m not sure. But there’s one big difference though: you have 0 pushback on block. Pre-patch, Juri’s dive kicks would push the opponent away from their jab/short range so you would be safe. Now you end up right next to them so you eat a full cross-rush combo guaranteed.
So, I didn’t realize that Juri could still do the whole Dash-under thing from SF4 if she hits with cr.lk off a crumple stun. Not sure if that’s a well-known thing because I haven’t seen it in use, and honestly can’t find too many worthwhile crumples that she can use this on since it costs meter. Only one I’ve hd some success and see some slight benefit to this with is Julia/Juri (off Julia’s super-obvious SSE), to get Juri in if needed and dash under for the confusion.
Will play with it some more and see what happens when I get it off during a match (eventually). Again, if that’s like super-well known, day one stuff that has been found useless, I apologize - I literally just started messing with it Tuesday when I picked Julia back up.
News to me man, I’m in desperate need of some new Juri tech no matter how big or small it may be.
early on she was my ace in the whole, but now my Chun tech is growing by leaps and bounds leaving my Juri in the dust.
she’s gotta have something we are missing - I refuse to believe we’ve exhausted her abilities already.
I hear yah man, definitely agreed. I’m going to keep looking for things to see what else I can figure out.
I actually forgot that she can do a re-stand as well until I watched UltraDavid’s second restand vid yesterday lol. Only problem with it now though is that because of the increased recovery on MK pinwheel (used for the re-stand), it feels like she recovers after the opponent does, which kinda’ sucks. O__O
I might be wrong on that though, just visually looked like it. Will be doing more lab work this weekend, think I may just record it with this Dazzle, quality be damned lol.
Speaking of dash under, remember that tech Kail came up with on day 1: cr.mp (AA) xx CADC dash under.
If cr.hp’s hitbox is nerfed to the point of being unreliable this might be what we’ll need to do vs jump happy players. Even though this doesn’t guarantee that you’ll get a combo, the dash is very ambiguous because you can hold Senpusha for a tick before dash canceling and it will either cross-up or not depending on the timing.
You can also cr.mp xx EX CADC to store a counter hit. This way they not only have to guess which side you’ll end up on but they also have to guess if you’ll hit low or overhead.
According to LouieBH (he’s playing 2013 at the local test in the UK), the AA stuff seems fine. Apparently the hitbox nerf was slight and really made to get rid of the cr.HP j.c j.HP loop on Hugo. Think he’s going to do more checking on it on Monday as well, but things sound good so far.
I might be on later tonight (like 9:30pm MST), so that’s cool with me. Honestly need more matches against Bison, I have no idea how to handle that matchup, I feel like I’m missing some simple idea/knowledge (same as in SF4) that would make it much easier.
Also, had to go back and verify that I wasn’t talking out of my ass, lol… but just in case it’s needed, here’s Louie’s post. Of course we really really can’t know for sure until we play it ourselves, but sounds good so far for the spider. <3
Alright, so I’ve doen digging here and there. Fuhajins. L Fuhajin shots will bet out every SS in the game except for bobs ex SS which has armor. Steve’s ducking will beat it after the 2013 comes out but that’s not a big deal. Funny thing is Fuhajin can beat out all SS’s (kaz’s mist step will be beaten in 2013 thanks to the nerf). Fuhajin also beats out all counters except for Juri’s. Now some people say J.hp is an ambigous cross-up…well you’re half right. Thing is even if you manage to cros-up someone up with it’s not actually a cross-up at all. Opponents can still block in the original direction without worry of being x-up by it.
Bare that in mind. Now her Kasatushi. Man this move is so useful and so powerful it’s not even funny. Actually it is. The thing about this counter is that, it doesn’t go by what’s +/- on block, since your ignoring blockstun. What you need to focus on when using Kasatushi is recovery frames. From the data I gathered anything that has a recovery of 24 or more is a free combo basically for you and there is nothing your opponent can do about it. So say for example Jin use’s swaying willow against you. Normally you block it you suffer chip daamge and cannot punish it. Since it’s a -3 and Juri doesn’t have any 3f moves. HOWEVER…if you dodge it then it automatically becomes -6 on block. basically giving you a free punish for Jin’s mistake. Also take note of things that are active for a long time. Say something has a recovery of 17 but is active for 9 frames. Take away the first active frame you’re left with 8. Now…what’s 17+8? 25…free combo right there ladies and gentleman.
Now the last thing is spacing. Some attacks cause characters to move forward. Get to know which moves move charcters forward therefore limiting your chances of failure. I’ll throw up a video in the near future to demostrate.
Kasatushi is wonderful, this is true… so long as your opponent wasn’t baiting it. Great move and very useful… but needs to be used sparingly because of how easy it is to blow up.
That’s the beauty though. If it’s a jab or certain Mp/mk’s then people will try to outdo you. That’s where it shines. Since you can cancel into itself or attacks. IE, CA,SA’s, ex senpusha etc etc.
If it’s not baited out of course. It’s just like any counter move or moves like the shoryuken. Same principle. You bait it out opponent gets a punish. The only difference is if the shoryuken has meter then they could switch (though 2013 is making this much mroe unsafe now so…) Hey good things come with a risk.
Looking forward to the vid, and now I’ll be trying to think of some ideas myself as well. Generally I’ve been using counter to get away and not to punish because I HATE pressure, lol.
An interesting facet of kasatushi in this game is that it’s active on frame 1… and in most cases you can kasatushi back to back to avoid punish attempts while launching one of your own. Great for mind games.
