Why mk? Is it a spacing issue? I never really used one version of her super over another. I am unaware of the differences aside from how far they travel
Mk is fastest. 
Oh… I thought they were all the same. Thanks
Lk and hk are 1+1 and mk is 1+0, I believe.
not quite
her super is 1+1 all versions
thing is the slowdown on the mk version makes some stuff punishable at -1 because how the game rounds the numbers. Ill try to find the post explaining this quirk
Whoop, sorry I think you’re right. Conflicting sources!
So would you say its better to always use mk as a punish?
I use hk sometimes, like to chip someone for instance. But in combos, 99% of the time it’s mk.
depends
if pointblank then yes MK 10/10
but lets say fireball HK is better due range (same goes for far fierce link)
dash super to chip LK as this version has 2f invul instead of 1 (mk/hk)
lk super is prefered to use against blockstrings too. You dont want to trade with a light lol
The general wisdom is this:
LK - Invulnerability (LK has 3f invulnerability, the others have 2)
MK - Speed (for certain one-frame punishes)
HK - Distance
i count it as 2f idk why
im dumb
It really isn’t a bad matchup. A few things I need to mention based on what you posted so anyone struggling can approach it with a different mindset/more comfortably.
-Force her to choose whether she wants to risk using an EX Spiral on wakeup or to avoid getting thrown (throw her right out of it to remind her that it’s not a 100% panic button). You can also still punish it on block (Bnb starting with cr. lk or reversal EX Legs etc), so baiting is plenty legit. She has to burn 3 bars if she wants to remain relatively safe.
-Cr. mp up close is only 4f and it’s -3 on block. You can beat it pretty easily with cr. light attacks. The only time it really should be stuffing you is after you get hit by something or after a well spaced Spiral on block… then it’s a frame trap. Two things you can do to take advantage of that: EX SBK because fuck frame traps or if you have super you can block and punish it for free with reversal LK super (use LK version for the extra invincibility frames in case she cancels it into spiral so you don’t get a trade).
From a little farther, you can just whiff punish it or challenge it with some HP FBs or cr. mks.
-Her Fireballs are slow but she has the worst FB recovery in the game for throwing them. Practice delaying your HSU a bit to get past them. It will still hit her, I promise. This is also good to know for when you want to ultra her. You have plenty of time to wait and punish. It’s also not necessary at all to dash ultra any FB in this game (I just take a large step forward while buffering to get the distance and it saves me some frames too). Dash Ultra is still legit and gives the most distance, but I never do it because I don’t have to. People should be comfortable in knowing they don’t need to commit to a dash to punish FBs, but they can still choose to.
-Slides 80% of the time aren’t at an advantage for her when you block them. At the best spacing it’s +1 and at point blank it’s -6. Doing a cr. LP/LK after blocking a slide is almost always going to be in your favor. I don’t even think EX Soul Spiral afterward is quick enough to tag you most of the time and if you block that… free punish.
-Her normals aren’t better than yours. They’re about equal overall and you will have to think about the ranges when you choose to apply yours. It’s common knowledge that Chun’s better mid-range pokes are st. MP and sweep, but they’re both 7f startup and that’s why you may need to switch it up when you’re in Rose’s MP/MK range because she’s slightly faster in that area. This is where your cr. MK, st. HP and light attacks will come in handy more. If to want to use st. MP and sweep again you have to step outside of that range. This is where she’ll start doing st. MK, st. HK and slide more often but you can outspace those and also whiff punish (your cr. MP becomes more useful from this range as well).
In the case of Rose’s st. HK, I’d actually block it and let it push me out because Chun’s max range poking game is a bit better than hers. You can also super punish most of her mid to far range normals on block. Only her cr. mk is totally safe. Her sweep has bad recovery and is easy to Ultra punish. Spiral is also a “poke” for her, but they have to be spaced properly or you’ll be able to punish.
-Reflect is a double-edged sword for her and I actually think Chun Li is one of the best characters for dealing with it for a few reasons: You have a slow fireball (you even have one that dissapates early to bait a far range reflect), You have extremely good walk-speed and you have Ultra 1/Hasanshu. Combined these can actually hurt Rose for reflecting more than it can help her. If you’re going to throw a fireball from a range where she can easily reflect, you pretty much always want to do it from the range where you will recover before she gets to actually reflect them. Then you have several options to respond based on how she reflects:
-Horizontal: You can actually HSU right over it and punish. Or you can focus absorb it (you’re giving yourself YOUR OWN ULTRA… that’s fantastic!)
-Vertical: You can walk in and gain plenty of ground. You usually can also sweep her for free for doing this.
-Absorbtion. Same as Vertical but you can technically also HSU this one.
Using the LP Kikoken (or MP Kikoken from farther) usually gives enough time to get a full charge before she can reflect as well, so you can Ultra all of them.
-If it feels awkward anti-airing her, get the timing and spacing down in training. I still do it to this day for all characters. But overall st. MK, Sweep and st. HP are still really solid AAs in this matchup. Use St. HK for the empty jump range. The problem jump attack I’d look out for the most is her crossup j. MK. It can stuff a lot of your moves when done as a crossup, but you can find some success in dodging it with your cr. MK. You still have air-to-airs and airgrab to deal with her if she jumps from a bit closer. Dash under is still viable as well. Regardless, don’t let her disrepect too much with the jumping.
-Ah yes, her stupid Ultra 2… is actually not that terrible to deal with (unless you’re in danger of a chip-death). First thing I think about is what she’s doing in neutral. A lot of Rose players think those two balls come with extra testosterone and you’d be surprised how many I can just smack right out of it with a st. HP/HK because they just walk forward without blocking. She shouldn’t jump with them, because you can easily anti-air her and take them away. Her fireballs still function the same, so if you happen to have Ultra stocked and charged, punish it just as you would if she didn’t have those orbs floating around her. You can also use your own fireball for the reflect baiting technique with Ultra (or aim to take out the orbs with the FBs obviously).
One more thing that doesn’t have to do with just basic defense against the Ultra is actually old technology and universal for all characters, but hardly anyone tries it because maybe they forgot: You know how any decent Rose has learned to throw the opponent in between the orbs? Well, why don’t you try that as well? Chun Li is actually pretty well-suited to attempt this as her walkspeed and throw range is even better than Rose’s. If you get the throw… good they’re gone and she’s knocked down. If she techs the throw attempt… the orbs will still disappear!
-Your EX SBK is a valuable tool in keeping her honest and stopping her from getting too trap-happy. She also has virtually no true blockstrings, so there are a lot of in-betweens (usually they involve her cancelling into soul spiral) that you can call out and punish.
-If she wants to backdash a lot. Let her or OS/punish it if you want to call it out. I’m not an OS-heavy user, so most of my punishes are hard reads, but it isn’t so bad that you can’t deal with. Backdash means more ground for you. Walk her to the corner and then pressure her from there.
All in all it’s a pretty honest matchup if you’re aware of both of your strengths and limitations. Don’t approach it negatively. Just stay solid in neutral and know what you have to do to counter what she does and she won’t be too much of a pain in the long run.
Shit, great post @Darklightjg1
Also, Rose’s ultra 2 loses to cr.mk on wakeup. So pressure that bitch as soon as you see that ultra meter build up.
I think the following option select tags Rose:
cr.lk st.lk+st.hk
I could be wrong, I use that on some of the tougher people to OS I dont really recall if it works on Rose.
cr.lp, st.lp+st.hp works better
Rose-Chun matchup is more of a U1 for Rose anyways. Chun-Li can thread the needle when it comes to stopping U2 easier than others, I found out. Plus U1 helps shut down Chun-Li because floaty jump and recovery/heavy stuff. It can also tag poorly done fireballs up close.
Damn, I’m taking notes, man. I’m pretty pleased that I started bitching about this match-up, now, because after all that advice and I still don’t do better next time? What’s wrong with me?
I always wondered why Rose players dropped the Shamwow en masse. I picked up Rose for a while before she got her second Ultra and it was always pretty good for punishing jumps. They weakened it, eventually, right? Less invincibility, perhaps more start-up, I forget the exact details now. That Ultra used to be a pain the arse, anyway.
I’ve got some more problems I wanna discuss, but I think I’ll take it to the appropriate thread instead. Thanks darklightjg1, for your time in making that very thorough post!
U1 really sucks unless it’s certain matchups. She just gets hit out of it too easily.
U2, you’re not really going for big damage, but for guaranteed damage + mixup potential. It’s also a momentum breaker if done correctly.
Yeah and back when U2 was introduced in Super it was pretty much totally free to use and got abused a lot. Her U1 is just now getting buffed to a more usable level, so it’ll likely take some time for Rose players to migrate back to it for more matchups.
Hey, I just wanted to let you dudes know. I destroyed some poor unfortunate Rose I came across yesterday. Omg, she had to tech so many throws on wake-up. I felt so devious. I was watching gooteks & Mike Ross’s latest episode, too, and they said: “Don’t throw fireballs, man. She doesn’t know what to do when fireballs don’t happen.” If that’s not goddamn true. It’s goddamn true.