you must not have fought any good peacock players if you reckon cere/double can beat pea/double.
you can basically never ever punish the double assist when covered by peacock, and they can go straight into super from any random hit the butt does get on you. cerebella cant follow up double butt anywhere near as good as a lot of the other characters just because she cant get across the screen fast.
Talk to Dime.
As for punishing double, that’s not how I fight that assist, I tend to get into the air either double jumping and blocking, or gliding over while they’re spamming, then once at mid-range nothing they can do stops the battle-toads armor except blocking, so I’m in.
Gawd damn it Norcal and your supportive SG scene. SoCal, where we at x.x?
age_of_fools (aof) is the cere/double player that royally kicks my ass. now… there are some caveats to that as we play online, im a painwheel user (painwheel/double/parasoul… usual assists) cerebella may just be a bad matchup for painwheel… ive heard people in the painwheel forums complain about her, and i cant combo in lag for jack shit nor can i punish in lag for jack shit, plus there MAY be a skill gap between us (online there DEFINITELY IS)… i dont know cause im an absolutely horrible player in any kind of lag… even slightly laggy tv’s (though lag affects me personally, less on airdash fighters, its much worse on “more” fundamental games like streetfighter)
so take anything i say with a rather large grain of salt (literally) or 2:
cere can rather easily follow up bomber cause she has a run that basically says on block i get closer on hit i get closer and since shes a command grab character, CLOSER is something that is very very bad. also she has some ridiculous tick throws off of blocked hornet bomber. all this means that blocking OR getting hit by bomber is BAD. BUT, i can fly over bomber pretty easily and make it wiff… so WHEN I DO, that means one thing right? ATTACK!!! however bella has some GREAT AA’s, she has stupid rhino armor charge that basically blows up any flight based jumpin for free, she has cr.fp which does the same thing, and she has AA command grab which… yep you guessed it, it blows up my flight based approaches. also once in flight painwheel cant unfly and block so i cant bait tose moves into block and punish. what i generally have to do is bait the AA (remember, this is AFTER i have already baited a wiffed bomber)
sigh… i’d type more but online work (and baby boy) are calling… so, to be continued (or not)
-dime
So what happened to your own assists? What about calling your own assists after you dodge the Double’s? Pretty much all the good Painwheel’s ive played will up-back flight until they get an assist out and then go in for a 4 way mixup. Double assist is insane with Painwheel since she either gets stupid mixup on block or combo on hit for redonkulous damage + 4 way mixup again. You should worry about Parasouls more than Bella’s imo. Parasoul has so many good anti-painwheel tools it’s silly. Her shots will pretty much stop Painwheel trying to approach from the air, her pillar is amazing if you guess where the reset is, she can swat her like a fly with j.HP. Painwheel has to work to get in on Parasoul, where someone like Bella has to take some risks to stop your approach.
Copying this here since it’s better placed here. What do you think who is optimal in which team size?
I dunno, seeing as Solo 'Bella was well represented in the top 8 at Shadowloo Showdown.
There was a solo Peacock too. I don’t think it means too much. Level of play at SS in general seemed quite low.
Maybe, but you did have some of the best players over there (JWong, Ryan Hart).
Which isn’t nearly as much as most of the cast can do in their BnBs to begin with, adding to that the meter scaling is likely to give your opponent as much meter as you gained for that damage. Same combos off a solo can do 5-6k vs 1, 7-8k vs 2, 8-10k vs 3 for the same meter gain and scaling.
Doing a full combo for 100+ hits that gains 2 meters and uses 1 would be great if that would at least kill and not give the opponent 4 meters.
They’re the best players… at other fighting games. They’ve yet to show me something I haven’t seen before; however, their grasp of the general fundamentals of fighting games is why they place well.
And what, pray tell, is the “one trick”? I’d like to know.
that grab definitely hits people out of the air…
its an overhead but it has like a 100% whiff rate on crouching Valentine though.
battle toads is so unsafe on block though its not even funny. if they do block your basically fucked. gliding loses to teleport as well. some guy i played was such a slippery little bastard using item drops to cover teleports and doing nonstop chip and any random hit went into super for nearly 1/3 life bar.
one thing i really need to start doing is following up her reflector with command run to close the distance though. i always forget to start the charge right after hitting the button.
That’s why you glide when they’re spamming things like qfc+C and double jump otherwise. You use battle toads as the incentive to block when you’re at that range, which lets you get in rather than dealing with spam at mid-range pushing you back. I stopped trying to use the reflector at all since I play online a lot and I’ve been able to get in on everything but parasoul/filia with two gtfo assists.
I’m not talking about meter scaling, and ratio doesn’t matter. 6k at x1.00 damage when base health is 14300 is a good chunk of your life, are you telling me that the rest of the cast has 10k-ToD BnBs? Because so far, the only character I’ve seen do something like that is Painwheel, and she gets around 7k midscreen for hers. Double also nets around 5-6k per full BnB combo.
Filia seems to do decent damage when she has the supers to spam.
Parasoul seems to also get decent damage, but without requiring that many supers.
Cerebella is pretty self explanitory.
Valentine has to squeeze the shit out of every single hit and make the combo as long as possible to even match up to everyone else because of her multi-hit moves, and even then she barely breaks 5.5k for BnBs.
Peacock has a 10k corner combo, but that’s no BnB, you’re not even going to see her in your face anyway.
Where are you finding these ToD BnBs?
yeah, sometimes i do wait, sometimes HE WAITS as well and it becomes a waiting game where its basically normal against normal and painwheel loses that pretty bad, even online it isnt that hard to react to a butt assist with a counter butt assist. and of course thats assuming that he even stayed on the ground, if he jumped which he does do alot, pains air normals kinda pail to his ie they CAN be used to hit his, but it takes some skill to swat his j.mp or j.hp with painwheels j.hp or j.mp both of which have WAAY slower startup than either of bellas jump attacks… not only that but bella can jump hp hold anticipating an air to air and just glide in and let t go if she sees what she wants to see which is an air to air situation… yet if she doesnt see it she can just continue to hold it for glide. really the biggest problems i have in the matchup that bella herself brings to the table are her enormous air normals specifically in air to air situations, her amazing ground to air AA’s and her upclose damage.
i probably am not playing the matchup totally right i give you that, but my post was primarily to show that bella can use bomber rather effectively… which she can.
anywho i can bait him effectively i feel, but perhaps since its online i cant make quick enough decisive attacks to take advantage of his air to air, ground to air and assist wiffs… since hes the best bella player ive yet faced and i have none offline to play against i cant really make that great of a judgement on te painwheel matchup… but i CAN say that bella is a damn good user of hornet bomber.
-dime
Let me just start by asking, how many Noms are used in this 6K BnB? You do know that will be patched, right?
So. Only taking one Nom into consideration, unless she has perfect head positioning (or in a corner) she will need a lot of meter to do that much damage. The damage scaling is not as bad as Valentine’s, but I assure you; she needs to reset to cause that much damage. And if she needs to reset to do so, well so does the rest of the cast so I fail to see how that’s particularly special.
Going to have to contest this some of this, pretty sure Valentine is doing more damage than Filia is damage to super ratio. Pulsar’s bnb is certainly over 5,000. He gets to 8000+ with Valentine from a grab anywhere on screen (nearly 7000 without bar).
[media=youtube]m_OankZ2oGc[/media]
Filia’s damage is actually fairly lackluster but it doesn’t matter because her reset game is so good.
Parasoul has better than “decent damage” especially in the corner (or near the corner) where she can get to 7000 without even using meter.
Tod bnbs. Don’t come from one character, they come from 2 characters each uzsing their best bnbs in one combo through the use of well synergized dhcs.
Example when I went to seasons beatings I played a guy named thulius, and even without om nom loops he could get half my lifebar. Off with a bnb into headless furserker furrage into. Parasouls Legion super andthen he would get a full combo off of that, which would kill me
Oh please, don’t give me that shit. I’m talking about off random shit. Not nom specific, just combo super combo super, MIDSCREEN. Maybe like 1 nom for anything. And she doesn’t need resets, but resets do help a lot. And so what if she needs meter to do damage? You get meter so damn easy in this game, why not use it? I pretty much always have enough meter to use a super in a combo.
Yeah, I remember this combo, didn’t realise it did 7k. But this is what I mean about Val having to do long combos to do damage. There’s more chances to mess up, but it does help overall if you’re on a team, so that’s good.
Everyone has good damage in the corner. What I want to find out is how often, overall is a character able to reach that damage. The entire match isn’t played with the opponent in the corner.
Don’t see your point about how long her (Valentine’s) comobs are, the point is that they do great damage, just because a combo is long doesn’t mean it’s harder. Even it was, just learn the combos. Valentine is a power house, She might do more damage than Painwheel, other than Cerebella, she probably does the most damage, she’s very easy to get in with, I think she’s obviously one of the better characters. Also everyone doesn’t do impressive damage in the corner, Parasoul does way more damage than Filia in the corner, and it’s pretty easy for Parasoul to get people to the corner. Valentine’s combos (i.e. the Pulsar BnB) ALWAYS bring the opponent to the corner.