Sirlin.net: "The Anti-Progress Attitude"

Classic Fighting Games Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
841

I think the distinction between which games should be re-balanced or not, is due to age. With new games its ok and kinda expected in this day & age to have some tweaks beyond first release.

With older games like third strike, they’re long established, and suddenly wanting to re-balance them after 13+ yrs feels “shallow” and dirty, like they are screwing with the time stream.

MVC2 is one of my favorite games of all time, and while some broken gameplay elements still piss me off, the thought of it being rebalanced after all this time is crazy.

842

The Kuroda defense they keep using, every time they use proves their opinion invalid since it is the same guy.
One guy makes it an anomaly.
Everyone keeps using that one to show you that through blood, sweat, & tears you can balance the game.

843

I guess because Kuroda wins with shitty characters everyone should. Also, Jesus walked on water so everyone should be able to do that also by that logic right? And for the god damned last time SBO is single elim! Makoto Mike(no offense) got top 8 in single elim over “3s gods”

844

People, 17 pages???

Just fucking stop it.

Some of you think this one thing.

Some of you think this other thing.

845

Hey can I just play 3SOE the way it is, stop with the rebalancing talk.
It’s fun, leave it alone.

846
847

The article was based solely on the quote from Haunts’ review that “Balancing it would make it an inferior version”.

848

17 pages?! Wow! I’m not gonna bother reading it all. I can already guess what 90% of the posts are about. I’ll just say this, for a guy that seems to get a lot of hate on here y’all sure do seem passionate about his blog posts. LOL!

PS: I picked up 3SO. Seems like they did a good job on it. If you guys are gonna dedicate 17 pages to something, maybe you should talk about the WTF decision they made where pressing A turns you back to unready in a lobby.

849

The biggest reason for a the game to remain this way and not rebalanced is because of the community that plays it. Think about every fighting game, or any competitive game for that matter, and even at it’s earliest stages of competition people will start throwing fits about imbalances and OP characters. I see this the least in the 3rd strike. People are extremely aware of the problems, and the people that play this game seem to be completely okay with this. The most I hear is the occasional “Chun Li is a bitch” or something. Other than that this community loves the game exactly the way it is and their doesn’t need to be any other reason to release it as is other than that.

It’s admirable really. This community embraces the game exactly the way it is and you don’t hear a lot of whining like you do about every other game.

Note: I’m talking from real life experiences. People will always bitch online, but the people that REALLY play this game wouldn’t have the game any other way.

850

Imagine if MvC2 was rebalanced. The uproar and fissure in the community it would cause. I don’t even think it would bring in a lot of players simply because it was rebalanced.

You guys should see peaceful jay’s stream. A lot of people who started playing SF4 discovered 3S and are liking it more than SF4, without a rebalance. What blasphemy…new players liking a game without a balance patch!

851

Kuroda is an example of a crazy demi-god who wins with nearly every character he touches by first waving his penis around in the air and saying some magic words. Saying that Kuroda is the only one who wins with lower tier characters is an insult to the people who do very good with the rest of the cast.

Like these people:

I think the problem here is that you guys know almost nothing about the 3S scene outside of Kuroda and the 3S players are making the mistake of bringing only him up as an example of exemplary play. Maybe I’m wrong and you do know about it, but hardly anyone here has demonstrated even basic common knowledge of 3S that is available on page two of this sub-forum (which was page one about four days ago).

Outside of that, as I stated earlier in this topic, the game has a rebalance option if you choose to use it. Make a player match room (casual room) and ban Gill+Chun+Yun. That is just enough (coincidence?) ban slots to ban all the characters that are known to be overboard and then play the game to your liesure. Ken is not overboard, by the way. He’s the epitomy of a strong character with sufficient scaryness to him to make him very well rounded out. If I were to release Street Fighter III: 4th Cumming I would probably rebalance the entire cast to be roughly on par with Ken and introduce some new characters like a giraffe with three necks and one head and probably give Hugo an alternate outfit where he wears Poison’s clothes instead.

There are legitimate problems with 3SO that revolve around the matchmaking system and the games supposed “arcade perfectness” that need to be addressed to insure it really is a solid port of 3S with the expected superb online mode it’s supposed to have (but doesn’t have). I’ve put in around 125 ranked matches and maybe 200 or so player matches so far and I’m very happy with the incorporation of GGPO netcode and the game’s overall presentation, especially the ability to finally play a greater range and variety of players. Some people can’t do that, though, thanks to matchmaking errors and a buggy game. Fixing that and complaining about that is more important by a long shot over this pissing contest you people are having in this topic.

Everyone knows the article written by Sirlin was an attention grab and everyone knows this topic only exists to provide useless drama in the scene. If you care about progress you should be preaching to the majority and not persecuting the minority. This topic and the other topics with useless whining about 3SO are taking up forum space. Topics like C-Royd’s videos, Metric’s videos, and the Ken Primer along with numerous others are being pushed aside for this trashbin for posts. We should have a clean updated topic for reporting bugs, errors, and issues with 3SO along with potential feature requests so that the developers can actually have an easy time finding it, even if they don’t use it. We should have topics helping ease new players into the game and just discussing the game and its mechanics in general on the front page.

Instead we have this.

And not one of you fuckers has a solid picture of tits in your avatar to make it easier on the eyes when I open this topic. Wtf SRK? Tits or GTFO.

852

NOOOOOOO OH GOD NOOOOOO

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO MY IMAGINATION

853

and the “Kuroda defense” is just one example (and a very good one), but I believe TM is just as good with Q (Kuroda being god-like with other characters though gives him the edge of better player overall) as Kuroda is.

how about Hayao’s Hugo?
Pino/Sugi/Yakkun’s Necro? I guarantee Yakkun will rape you just as hard with Necro as he would with Yun, and he won Japanese tourneys with both.
RX Urien?? This guy eats Chuns and Yuns for dinner
Dirty Music Oro? come on, this guy will rape you with BOTH hands bound.
I could go on, and yes, Sean and Twelve are the hardest to win with but still possible. I have seen and played some godly Twelves and Seans, believe it or not.

and you want to know how to win in 3S…because its not about hit confirming…Chun’s low medium to super, Yun’s genajin, aegis reflectors…those things are meant to either GET YOU or DESTROY you in…THE CORNER.

YES, ignorant people want to bitch about balance but its all about spacing and timing… all to position your opponent in corner and keep him or her there.

90 percent or more players win when their opponent is cornered and they can successfully keep them locked down… and vice versa. Get cornered, get beat. That is an essential mindgame in 3S- TO CORNER YOUR OPPONENT AND NEVER GET CORNERED YOURSELF.

854

I know I’m going to get flack from the 3s community, but I believe TM is better then Kuroda.

855

Niji, you had me at penis and tits.

And all that stuff about that one videogame was cool too.

856

If you’re just talking about Q, a lot of people would roll with that. Personally I think TM is a more entertaining Q to watch, that’s for sure

857

ITT: Socially retarded nerds use terms they learned in Philosophy 101 to boost their own ego, then make it evident they don’t even really know what they mean or understand basic logic/reading comprehension.

858

Haven’t read the entire thread, but I don’t understand why people are so fucking anxious to change the game. The game is 3S, the 3S fans wanted 3S; that’s really all that needs to be said. If you want a game that’s balanced differently but plays like 3S, why not ask for a new iteration of SF3 (EDIT://Originally said 3S like a dummy)? No one would be against that, it’s just that people who loved 3S wanted to play it on modern consoles with a fully integrated GGPO. We got that; why the fuck does it bother y’all so much?

This isn’t some blight on the FGC; this is fans getting a product they wanted, just as they wanted it. And frankly, for the most part, the imbalances aren’t going to affect anyone in this thread as hard as Sirlin would have you believe. No one here is playing on the level of the Japanese folks that are actually shifting the tier list around, and will never play against someone with that skill. Or if you do, it won’t matter who the fuck they pick because they’re gonna push your shit in so deep it’ll get squeezed through the pores of your skull like play-dough.

We enjoy 3S, we enjoy the core system, the characters, we find the balance acceptable. Who is Sirlin to tell us we’re bad for that? I mean, really. I’m not gonna bring up HDR, because I don’t play ST and I don’t know shit about it, so I’m not gonna sit here and say he fucked it up or he’s bad or was wrong for a rebalance because I don’t play that game. So if he’s not super-involved with 3S like he seems to be with ST, why the fuck is he even talking about it? To try and make a point that his way is the right way and that the 3S community and Capcom are dumbheads for wanting a port and making a port respectively? Then why the fuck isn’t he against the stupid shitty bullshit that happens in ports like MegaMan 9 that people eat up like Skittles? There’s rooms in MegaMan like this one shit filled with spikes that you have to perfectly navigate or it’s insta-death. That’s bad modern game design, but I haven’t seen anyone cry about that, because people who fucking loved MegaMan 9 wanted that kind of shit. People who love 3S love parries into hit confirmed supers and Chun Li ramming a big white boot up someone’s asshole. What the hell is wrong with that?

And I don’t mean to say that any rebalance would be unacceptable, I’m just saying that I feel that people are missing the point of this re-release. It’s meant to be an arcade perfect port, with GGPO on modern consoles and some extra goodies; that’s what it is. They tried to do that with MvC2 (sans the GGPO) and I don’t remember people making a big deal over how that game has a cast of like 50 characters and almost none of them are viable, which strikes me as much worse balance than 3S’s. Why doesn’t Sirlin talk about that?

I just don’t understand why folks are so salty about Capcom doing what they said they were gonna do. I’m happy with the product. I do think the balance could be better, but they said they were gonna release an arcade perfect 3S, not a rebalanced, retooled, reimagined 3S. If they’d said the latter, and I got it, I would’ve judged it in light of that, and if I wanted to buy it, I would’ve judged it in terms of whether the rebalance works better, etc. That’s not what they set out to do, so I’m not gonna sit around worrying about what ifs and could bes and should bes. They said arcade perfect 3S, I said cool and paid, and I’m happy. Shouldn’t that really be all there is to it?

Also, I support SF3: 4th Down with some new characters, continuing the story and adjusted balance. But for right now I’m fucking happy with my arcade perfect GGPO’d 3S. Sorry for the folks who aren’t or buy into the hype that tournament level play and tiers that affect the most elite of players are gonna mean shit to them when they’re playing online at home.

859

There’s this novel called To Kill A Mockingbird. You remind me of a character named Bob Ewell, specifically in the scene where Atticus Finch drops the “left hand” bomb. Check it out.

860

He´s butthurt that 3SOE is so well received unlike his “im gonna buff my chars” version of SF 2. So he had to come out of his jungle with his little fanboys (always the same 5 ppl arguing for sirlin) and diss the 3s community by talking out of his ass. Imo his ugly ass harry potter like looking face shouldn´t open his mouth and keep circle jerking with his fanboys on his forum.

Hope this post is enough to get the thread closed.