Im not sure why you’re talking about FBA, i was talking about iframes on ST (since when is FBA a db charge?). I’ll make it simpler for you people who are screaming ST will be god tier. DB charge limits its effectiveness compared to a srk or flash kick.
Lol at the “regulars” saying vega is a runaway character. I dont know whats worse that that’s false or he doesnt even have the tools to run away in the first place. You’re running away because you have NO CHOICE. Its retardedly obvious from this that he needs more than tiny buffs.
News for you chun li’s pokes are getting buffed with cr.mk and she already has better pokes than Vega.
Thanks that also applies to every freaking move vega has :bgrin:
I think Blanka is 5-5 or better. I can post more on it in the Vega forum if you want (where I don’t really go either) but for me at least, Blanka is not a very tough match. I won’t try to convince anyone by theory fighting, and convincing you that I play competent opponents just by saying I do, but I think it is one of Vega’s better match-ups.
I don’t think Blanka is free, but I don’t feel it is a 7-3 and I don’t think 6-4 is even correct.
I tuned him out after he said he never played Street Fighter 2. And as a general rule, if someone needs to tell everybody how good they are at something, they’re usually not very good.
Just reading through, so many of the posts in this thread are just…frustratingly stupid/clueless. Not worth the time or effort.
lol
relax dude
like fouts said, it’s not as if there’s really a reason to study it in the first place. i always just pressed punch at grab range of normal izunas and got waht happened. wasn’t until yesterday when i was messing around in training that i saw its other properties. i probably haven’t used the rolling izuna in about 5000 matches.
and @ prof, think what you want man. like i said it’s 2 different perspectives. you’d be surprised, actually, who agrees with me about this whole ex st issue =\
@deadfrog: again, never studied piece of mercury as i came to a consensus early that it was a garbage move. i could probably tell you everything you wanted to know about cosmic heel, and obviously ST, and izuna, which are obviously the real tools vega has to work with. also kara throw and pretty much every one of his normals… is it really a problem that i studied the useful tools first then only recently started checking the shit tools to see what i can add to my shenanigan-barrell? everybody here needs to just chill out
and if you guys think me saying i’m good is putting up a front / isn’t something i can’t back up then play me. fouts did. we had some amazing mirrors. i say i’m good cause i know i am, and if i can win 75% of my matches without an invincible ST then i think i can continue to find some way around it again.
My feelings on the Blanka match is that 6-4 is about right. It heavily depends on who’s controlling that Blanka though, more so than your average “is the player good” situation with tiers.
I find the best way for me to see if I have a chance is to do a regular FBA. If they do a vertical ball, then I know I’m playing someone competent, and I’m gonna have to go to work for my win. If I don’t see an attack coming at all, then I know that I can afford a slip-up or two without worrying too much.
What’s the consensus on the Gief matchup? I’ve been playing o many of them online, I’ve almost got the match memorized.
You win 75% of matches with Vega? Amazing. You’re not good just because you say you are. Quit playing online, it’s a poor way to gauge your skill when many moves cannot be countered on reaction.
I really doubt that you’d win 75% of your matches against a good Ryu, Balrog, Blanka, Zangief, Dictator, Ken, Chun-Li, Abel, more than half the cast…
Jozhear, I don’t want to bash on your skills. But your credibility takes a huge hit when you say things that are contrary to what many of the knowledged members say.
The fact is: RCF isn’t good, ST isn’t good, SHC isn’t good, BA’s aren’t good, and his Ultra is definitely not up to par. This is a general consensus of many experienced players. When you combine the equpment loss and poor stamina/stun afterwards, it’s not hard to see that Vega is flawed as a character.
check win / loss. i hardly ever play online dude and if i do i’m often blazed and i usually spend more time taunting then playing for srs cause it’s a wash-out anyway
i understand that because knowledged players disagree with me i look misinformed, but you must understand that there are just as many vega mainers that agree with me as there are who don’t. where exactly am i off-base here? i’ve described the benefits of ST as a combo-ender, and i still manage to get away with using it on defense much more than i should, apparently. we see eye-to-eye on many of these specials but the only differences between us and your point of view is that A) you think ST sucks and B) you think Vega sucks
now while I’d love to be able to play really, realy serious competition and really see where i’m at, i’m 100% confident in my skill in this game and what i know about vega, and from what i’ve been able to get out of this game i’ve come to only 2 conclusions that really differ from yours, which is that ST is the best of VEga’s special moves by far and that Vega may suck relatively, but has the tools to compete. the other thing is I think you guys overexaggerate just how fucked vega is on wakeup while i find myself getting away from nearly all contendors aside from the specifically bad ones like rufus or cammy.
maybe i am misinformed, but i’d chalk it up to me being an optimist. or maybe i’m just jaded because i do well with vega. but i sincerely think that it is entirely possible for vega to be able to be good without an EX ST. i’m obviously not a complete vega retard as i know wtf i am doing currently so please while you guys may think our opinions are “frustratingly stupid” and worthy of “UGGGGGH” from emblemlord just please, hesitate before (ShadowOS) you throw disparaging, baseless insults and criticism. i’m trying to come in here with facts to back up my arguments but for the most part i get “No you haven’t played ST, you don’t understand”… I’ve been playing SF4 for like 11 months now and probably 10k matches, I think i understand quite well. i’m also not saying i’m good just cuz i think so, i’ve gotten praise from many players in this game and frankly i’m confident in my skill so i’m just going to go around saying i’m good anyways. no harm in doing so realy
anyway, release date is april 27, which is further away than i had hoped. At least that is , in a way great timing as school will be done.
man i just wish you could go to arcade infinity and just compete in one of the ranbats so you can see just where vega really sits amongst serious competitors
I don’t know how good Joz is, but he usually makes well thought out posts for why he thinks ST shouldn’t be invincible. Even though I disagree, it’s usually the best arguements I hear for it.
I think the main problem people have with Vega is how smart and calculating he needs to be played rather than the simple-minded gameplan of his opponents that create his worst match-ups (Blanka, Chun, Rufus, Cammy).
All of these characters have tools that can crush Vega so easily its ridiculous.
Rufus - Easily punishes walldives with EX-Snake strike, j.HK > Ultra. Can put huge and in some cases inescapable pressure on Vega in the corner. Dive kick leads to so many options its mind boggling. Block strings leading to a safe Galactic Tornado, tick throw mixups, guess wrong on a tick throw you could eat a target combo > Ultra. Just try escaping corner pressure against J.Wong, you wont.
Cammy - Safe blockstrings mixed with safe spiral arrow. Cannon strike has amazing priority, cannot use j.HP on her wakeup. Her long chaining combos can take Vega’s equiptment off in a flash. Again, being stuck in the corner with her is pretty bad.
Chun - Far better pokes than Vega, a fast OH special thats great for ruining Vega’s charge if he can block it in time. Fireball spacing game, you try to jump, you get airthrown or eat j.FP leading to EX-legs. Walldive is basically nullified when Chun has EX bars. It’s only use is to bait an EX reversal. Also puts great pressure on Vega in the corner.
Blanka - Unpunishable Blanka roll unless you have EX or ultra. Cross-over shenanigans mixed with safe electricity, if they’re smart they won’t allow you to back up in time to counter with slide. Inescapable ultra in corner. Does huge chip damage and even more if it knocks his mask off, no way to counter.
These gameplans require no skill and can be abused mind-numbingly easily. This is the reason why we want I Frame EX-ST, to force the opponent to play using skill, no just any lame tactic that can be abused that is safe.
Thats crazy, he shuts all your moves and options down by simply pushing downback… A meterless blanka might be 5-5 since you can beat his up ball… if u get lifelead in the meterless period , you might be able to counter his attempts to get damage, and it MIGHT be 5-5 if u play perfectly… if he gets the lifelead and has meter, your screwed and its 6-4 to 7-3 from then on (depending on how much meter he has), with compentent Blanka turtles.
Blanka’s horizontal roll is actually punishable. Vega will have to block it standing, walk a little bit forward the moment the block stun ends and slide. Vega can also escape Blanka’s ultra in the corner should the blanka user be so ill-informed that he shouldn’t ultra Vega when vega is not lying on the ground.
Take a look. :3
[media=youtube]CVhHOQ4bHyw[/media]
I agree with the comments about Rufus and Cammy. Chun li is still not that hard a matchup compared to Rufus. Ex.SBK happy chunlis can be easily baited by doing neutral jump HK on her wake up, it beats Ex.SBK cleanly.
The only problem with that is if you’re close and stand blocking Blanka will do his slide and trip you, setting up shenannigans. Even if blanka is doing roll from long range I can usually counter it with jump back fierce or even a slide of its the short version.
As for Blanka’s ultra, i never knew you could backdash from point-blank range and avoid it, I always assumed it would still hit since you were right next to him. My whole point though is that if he uses it on your wakeup you’re still screwed. At east they fixed this with new I Frames on Ultra 1, in addition to Ultra 2.
As for neutral j.HK on chun’s wake up : Its situational. Sometimes it will trade in Vega’s favor, if the chun does it early it has a small chance of beating EX SBK, but if timed correctly EX SBK always beats neutal j.HK. Just tested it in practice mode.
Well, we can always switch from crouch block position to stand block position on reaction. It is just a matter on whether the Vega player is willing give up his DB charge. One of the key things vs Blanka as Vega is the willingness to rid the thought of having a DB charge all the time. Many blanka players I’ve played (I’m a fairly average vega player) likes to do stuff like a ground poke string, then attempt a jump mk as a crossup. Though Vega has no suitable AA vs this type of play, he still has his forward dash. Just how many players will attempt a dash under just to avoid crossups? Not many I suppose, cuz many of them just subconsciously push their joysticks to the B/DB position most of the time when they are playing charge-based characters.