Nope I’m saying it’s low commitment being able to do move> confirm into unsafe special on hit.
It’s here to stay in sf5 and turns some absolute fucking zeros into heroes. In sf6 that shit needs to be bye bye.
it’s not here to stay in sf5, it’s here to stay in SF in it’s entirety. Stop trying to alter reality. All SF games have one hit confirming and the difference between a normal xx safe special and normal xx one hit confirm is literally that the latter is so heavily committal on block you are required to confirm the action to remain safe, they are the same thing outside of one being thoughtless, because the on block situation is the same as just blocking the initial button.
button(safe) xx confirm
button xx special(safe)
no fucking difference, outside of the special in question being more committal.
I don’t agree or disagree, but i think Dime is saying OHC are low commitment because on hit you are rewarded but on block you are safe.
I’m not sure how that is different than just canceling into a safe special other than removing the execution element though.
1 Like
thats literally what a normal xx safe special is without any form of thought/reactive play lmfao.
1 Like
Whoosh.
Also, these moves have the downside of being slower than most medium normals and being punishable upclose.
I’m not saying we can all react to a 7f Cr. MK, but the player can’t just spam it or he’s eating a jump-in for a gorillion damage.
Frankly, we’re all kind of overlooking the point that Cr. MK xx Safe Special would be the exact same issue with extra chip. (Well, Akhos kinda noticed that flaw)
Edit: Y’all fucking ninjas. I still take credit for raising the extra chip damage tho.
I mean I’m not overlooking it, I’m just not getting what the difference between each scenario is besides execution. Seems like they same thing to me.
Edit: and chip damage
doubling down on retarded argument is top quality Dime tbh
I would never want the game to go back to sf4, but what i would like in future iterations is more simple.
Increase recovery on a bunch of things such as normals, specials and whiffed jump ins. Nash whiffing moonslash and taking his turn back is just straight bullshit. This allows you to also more easily play a whiff punish game. There are obv some moves that should be extremely difficult to whiff punish such as st mk poke, however crush counters heavies should be universally be punishable. Normals such as psycho axe should be likewise.
Increase the reward for anti airs. This doesnt necessarily mean damage, coul be mixup. Either damage or the latter will do great.
Make it so that critical arts never give the player a hard knockdown/okizeme. Having someone wakeup with a critical art, a pure guess, and then also dash in twice to put you into a mix up is ridiculous.
Slow down dash ins to atleast 3 frames slower than they are already.
Priorities netcode, no frame delay.
something like Chun cr.mk xx MK.SBK versus her crmk xx ex legs, one costs bar to remain safe and one is meterless, more contextual to her charge timing but still offers the knockdown for no meter.
Ken cr.mk, he can do cr.mk xx fireball which yields no knockdown and lower damage, or confirm cr.mk into hp.dp for knockdown into oki and more damage, this isn’t something trivial to do, you need to be able to clutch this out reactively.
It pays off more to be able to confirm something that’s way more risky on block, that’s the entire point.
2 Likes
That’s my point. It really is. It’s even worse. You just add extra chip from the special and remove any difficulty from it.
In fact, you make the issue worse because of all the other normals that benefit from it.
There being a one hit cancel confirm somewhere in a game, is way different from a game where it is prevalent as a mechanic for most characters.
It’s like I make a game with all grapplers save for one character that has a projectile, and then people saying that the game I made is projectile based.
Pls use some form of common sense. I know this is a sensitive issue for you guys bu there being a cancel confirm here or there in a series doesn’t make it prevalent.
There are 1 hit link confirms in sf4 (ryu cr.mp link into dp, as an example)
And there are even 1 hit cancel confirms (sakura cr.mk into dp) but the game is not ruled by these types of interactions.
Your argument is like me saying “man sf5 sure is ruled by these stupid -2 interactions” and then you coming in and saying “what DIME! JEEZ YOUR DUMB! every sf game ever has had moves that are -2 DUH”
Cmon, get off it, stop being beliberately obtuse or I might actually start thinking you are dumb rather than just passionately displaced.
And no I don’t think you are dumb, but your arguments point in that direcation so I can only assume that you are disproportionally passionate about the subject.
@Dime Just drop the commitment argument and leave it here
I don’t think you should be able to safely confirm a poke into a ton of damage (IE Karin crmk xx tenko), too low commitment for too high reward
I’m pretty sure that’s what you’re trying to say but you’re doubling down on the side of the argument that doesn’t make any sense
4 Likes
You’ve obviously never played 3S or Alpha if you think one hit confirming hasn’t been incredibly prevalent in the last like 20 something years of Street Fighter. Your understanding of the game goes as far as your preferences to how you want it to play, not the facts behind it.
Again, you’ll just warp reality to suit whatever argument you’re making.
Yun, Chun, Ken in 3S. Top tier, all relied incredibly hard on one hit confirming.
Why would I do something just because you told me to?
I don’t see police anywhere in your moniker so I’ll continue to speak however I want, thanks.
Ohhhh ok I think Dime doesn’t like OHC’s because it’s a low commitment, high execution tool that only benefits a few characters. Compared to past SF games (i assume)when lots of characters had safe cancels.
He doesn’t like the gap in power it creates in SFV since safe special cancels in SFV are rare without meter.
Or maybe im 100% wrong. I really have no idea.
1 Like
He doesn’t like OHCs because he’s bad at them, it has nothing to do with their design philosophy.
Also, OHCs aren’t low commitment, that’s objectively false. Because the risk of messing up exists. You literally can’t mess up a safe special.
Fei Long in SFIV did a ton of OHCs, they aren’t exclusive to ANY iteration within the series. They were way more prevalent in 3S than V, he’s talking completely out of his ass. Cammy had them in IV.
In IV, they were WAYYYY harder, cancel frames were overall lower. V has the easiest OHCs of any iteration in the series.
I said versions. Never did I say it never existed I streetfighter I said… I think almost verbatim “people have gotten along without it fine across streetfighter versions, years”
That doesn’t say that 3s didn’t have them. It’s the game where they are most prevalent. Shit they are more prevalent in that game than in sf5. Once again, streetfighter isn’t only 3s and sf5. Lots more games, lots more characters are not based around the mechanic.
It’s lazy balancing and non committal stuck behind an execution barrier. 2 things that sf5 says it’s trying to make go away and because of that it sticks out like a sore thumb in the overall balance planning of the game.
I’m sorry but if you want to put “over the years” within the statement you’re obviously nodding towards other entries in the series, and if you aren’t, then V has had one hit confirming be prevalent throughout it’s lifespan.
You could just say “I’m bad at one hit confirming so I don’t like it” as opposed to going on a tirade about how it’s bad for the game, but in Dime’s world, if you’re bad at it, it’s bad for the series as a whole.
So to sum up -
Dime hates one hit confirming due to how low in commitment it is.
His fix to this is to inject more options within the game that have absolutely no commitment whatsoever, thus fixing his issue.
Because a safe special from a cancelled normal is very different to a safe normal that you confirm into a heavily unsafe special.
This has nothing to do with Dime not being very good at reactive play btw. It’s all for the enrichment of the series.
Again, Dime’s reality is whatever he pleases.
I definitely don’t like OHC because I suck ass at them.