He’d be broken? You they can still throw him (everyone has the range advantage) or, when he’s really pressuring you up close, use a well timed dragon punch/rising hawk/cannon spike/buffalo headbutt/flipkick/dread kick/tiger uppercut. Ha!
But in all seriousness, he’s not the worst character ever but he has a ton of uphill battles: Dee Jay, Honda, Vega, Balrog, high-level Ryus (damn that fake FB) and, to a lesser extent, Bison. Sometimes, I wonder why more people don’t use him but then I’ll play Hondas (MrEgo and Madpossum) and Vegas (Branta, blueblood, slipkicks etc.) and realize why. Those matches can be very lopsided indeed.
I didn’t mean to say that he was low tier because of his flame kick. I just meant to comment it’s on the lower end of SRK moves.
I think worst DP probably goes to the Tiger Uppercut, in terms of beating meaties and unsafe on block.
… No.
Thawk DP.
Nah, Hawk DP can go through fireballs and [media=youtube]yY3Yx9mT6Ks&#t=3m04s"[/media]. One of the best DPs in the game. Tiger Uppercut can’t do that.
Go trough fireballs i’ll give you but beat shoryuken requires specific timing which is why you found it in a NKI video.
Right, cuz everything in an NKI vid is BS. You’re right: the timing is *very *specific, but I can see a good Hawk player training himself/herself to learn the timing. I mean, safejumps have very specific timings too, yet good players learn how to do it. Point is, even with programmable inputs, Tiger Uppercut will never beat Shoryuken. At least we agree that Fei’s Flame Kick is not the worst DP.
I think it’s actually specific spacing. It travels way far forward.
Ha ha. Okay okay. Let me rephrase my statement in a way that I think we can agree. Fei’s hot foot isn’t as good as Boxer’s Super.
Edit: I’m rephrasing again to avoid all arguments all together. Fei’s hot foot doesn’t do as much damage as Boxer’s Super on it’s own.
Edit edit: Fei’s hot foot doesn’t do as much damage as Boxer’s Super (assuming all five hits of Boxer’s super connect) on it’s own.
Edit edit edit: Wiffing Fei’s hot foot doesn’t do as much damage as Boxer’s Super (assuming all five hits of Boxer’s super connect).
Agreed. It travels very far forward. Which is probably why it’s not as safe on block as Ryu’s Shoryuken. If I had to make a list of the best DPs, this is what I would have (not including Akuma, tho he would have the best DPs in the game):
Ken’s Shoryuken
(can go through fireballs at will, beats almost all meaties, the best DP for being safe on block, almost no attacks can punish it, great speed, good range, fast recovery, good invincibility, not to mention Fierce Shoryuken hits on the 1st frame, Strong is completely invincible)
Ryu’s Shoryuken
(can go through fireballs at will, beats almost all meaties, good range, good speed, not the best DP for being safe on block but better than Hawk’s DP for that, some attacks can punish it)
Hawk’s DP
(can go through fireballs at will, beats almost all meaties, the most invincible frames of all the DPs, 9 frames, if timed right can beat reversal Shoryukens, not bad speed, not very good recovery but very good range, quite a lot of attacks can punish it because of its recovery)
Cammy’s Thrust Kick
(cannot go through fireballs at will but close to safe on block, some attacks can counter/punish it, beats a lot of meaties, great range, good speed)
Fei’s Flame Kick
(cannot go through fireballs at will but beats a lot of meaties, not very safe on block, some attacks can punish it, good range, great speed)
Sagat’s Tiger Uppercut
(cannot go through fireballs at will but beats some meaties, trades with other meaties, not very safe on block, some attacks can punish it, great range, not bad speed)
Hawk’s DP is good, but it isn’t THAT good. It can beat Ryu’s DP pretty easily, but I have yet to beat Ken’s Jab DP.
And for the record, yes, I trained myself to DP through fireballs when Im in range. 
IDK about “pretty easily” but if you can beat Ryu’s Shoryuken, you can beat Ken’s Shoryuken. You just gotta do Hawk’s DP earlier, cuz Ken’s Shoryuken has less frames of invincibility (6 frames on the Jab Shoryuken compared to Ryu’s 8 frames on all strengths), but Ken’s Shoryuken is faster than Ryu’s, so do it earlier. = J
? I thought ken’s jab dragon had 2 startup frames and ryu’s had 4?
Ken = 2 startup, 4 hitting = 6 total invincible frames
Ryu = 4 startup, 4 hitting = 8 total invincible frames
? Then how do they trade while on the ground?
Actually Fei’s flame kick can go through fireballs. Well if you’re close enough, basically it doesn’t go through it but rather like neutral jump over it. I done it a couple times but the timing is hard cause the start up for Fei’s flame kick has to be right under the fireball. It even works to punish from a close distance.
Hell yeah good game the other day Coth it was cool playing against you. I’m also getting tired of HDR on the PSN. Probably just put it rest until they decide to fix it…
If you’re talking about Ken’s Shoryuken trading with Ryu’s Shoryuken, I have no idea. If someone had a frame by frame tool, they could probably figure it out.
If you’re talking about Shoryuken trading with meaties or jump attacks, it’s cuz the invincibility runs out while Shoryuken is still grounded.
Fei long can hang with Bison. DeeJay is difficult because Fei can’t get in. Balrog, is fuckin’ balrog. if Fei Long could reliably get around Fireballs NP, Ryu match would be a lot simpler. Honda is surely a bad matchup but it’s honda. You need a fireball to kill that fucker. Vega’s just an asshole. Seriously. Fuck Vega. FUCK VEGAAAAAAAA
That’s why i asked since akiba’s page says 4 and 2 startup frames respectively.
That’s why I was wondering where 6 and 8 came from.