Sakura Strategy and Match-up Thread (2.0)

[Logia]

Because they do. It’s a legitimate anti-air for Rose. To think they don’t is foolish.

Why can’t you jump in for free?

1) After Rose does her back dash, any jumping opponent is safe.

2) You can hit Rose out of her Soul Throw.

3) Rose other anti air is a simple cr.HP. You can trade hits with that.

4) Rose can use an Ultra, but its circumstantial.

5) She can do a Soul Spiral, but it’s slow and can either be blocked or go completely under Sakura.

6) She can slide, but once again, it can be blocked or cross-ed up. In the video you presented, Uryo wasn’t doing what he was supposed to, and he lost. Now, in this video, go to the 2:09 mark and see what this guy did.

You don’t know what you’re talking about. So, hush now.

I can’t believe I’m replying to this. Do you have ANY common sense?

1.) What the hell are you talking about? Almost every single character in the game’s backdash recovers before you jump and land and you can anti air them.

2.) What is your point? It’s a horrible antiair but it works on some jumping moves. I didn’t mean Rose would never use it, I just mean they way you said it made it seem the opponent is gonna be throwing it out, it’s not invincible and it sucks THAT’S WHY ROSE PLAYERS USE OTHER ANTI AIRS.

3.) That only happens if you do the cr.HP early, delaying it would beat out her anti air. If you actually used training mode to test that out instead just copying what you saw from youtube then maybe you’d understanding.

5.) She can Soul Spiral what? Soul Spiral NEVER goes under characters. Again, you don’t know what you’re talking about.

6.) Rose slides UNDER you, meaning she recovers on the other side before you do. Test this in training mode. Uryo plays Rose and was doing the right thing, he lost because he got outplayed.

Using videos to disprove your own points? 2:09 happens because Soul Spiral whiffed and Sakura punished with c.mk xx sho. 1:33, Keshikaran used soul throw as an anti air.

I agree you have to play aggressive but you have to play SMART, not jumping in all day because any player that has any skill in the game will anti air you free. The difference between these players and you is that these players used smart, calculated offense not jumping in randomly and doing random moves hoping they’d work.

You keep saying unintelligent things with no claim. From what I’ve seen you’re someone who watches something and just imitates without thinking why the player did that certain. 5 minutes in training mode completely disregards everything you’ve said. Anyway it’s late and I’m tired but I don’t want to stand back and let players listen to your terrible advice, I’m through here.

[Quinton_McLeod]

I can’t believe I’m replying to this. Do you have ANY common sense?

**
Ok. It’s ok for me to insult you now, you bumbling idiot.

You don’t even play SSF4:AE anymore. So, it was a good idea that you decided to shut your face. However, let me educate you and talk to you as if you’re in kindergarten.
**

1.) What the hell are you talking about? Almost every single character in the game’s backdash recovers before you jump and land and you can anti air them.

**
Then you are debating the mechanics of the game and not Rose, you idiot. When I’m talking about jumping in, I’m talking about when the time calls for it. Not randomly jumping like a retard. Why don’t you use YOUR brain, hmm?

A) You’d jump in on wake-up.

B) You’d jump in to move a bit closer to Rose (because she’s zoning you!)

C) You’d jump in to perform a mixup or crossup. (I.E. Air tatsu for a mix up. medium kick for a cross-up)

D) You’d jump in when you feel she’s vulnerable.

The amount of time it takes for Rose to back dash when you’re in the air negates anything she will do afterward. Why? Because you can either kick her in the face and stop whatever AA she’s going to try, or you’d just block. Stop being stupid! No one back dashes and AAs super fast unless it’s predicted. I’ve NEVER seen anyone backdash and AA on reaction. It’s too risky and it’s stupid.
**

2.) What is your point? It’s a horrible antiair but it works on some jumping moves. I didn’t mean Rose would never use it, I just mean they way you said it made it seem the opponent is gonna be throwing it out, it’s not invincible and it sucks THAT’S WHY ROSE PLAYERS USE OTHER ANTI AIRS.

**
Stop putting words in my mouth. NO BODY IS SPAMMING SOUL THROW, FOOL! Stop thinking that’s what I’m talking about and stop being stupid.
**

3.) That only happens if you do the cr.HP early, delaying it would beat out her anti air. If you actually used training mode to test that out instead just copying what you saw from youtube then maybe you’d understanding.

**
Delaying it would beat out her anti air? You mean, delaying the cr.HP would beat out Sakura’s ambiguous jumps? What are you talking about?
**

5.) She can Soul Spiral what? Soul Spiral NEVER goes under characters. Again, you don’t know what you’re talking about.

**
Look. I understand that common sense isn’t used much in your family. I really do.

I didn’t say she’ll go under and to the other side like a mix up. It’ll go under the character leaving Rose open for an attack. Same for the slide. The only difference is that Rose can mixup with the slide.
**

6.) Rose slides UNDER you, meaning she recovers on the other side before you do. Test this in training mode. Uryo plays Rose and was doing the right thing, he lost because he got outplayed.

Using videos to disprove your own points? 2:09 happens because Soul Spiral whiffed and Sakura punished with c.mk xx sho. 1:33, Keshikaran used soul throw as an anti air.

I agree you have to play aggressive but you have to play SMART, not jumping in all day because any player that has any skill in the game will anti air you free. The difference between these players and you is that these players used smart, calculated offense not jumping in randomly and doing random moves hoping they’d work.

**
You’re an idiot. No one said to do random moves.

Stop being a troll and gtfo!
**

You keep saying unintelligent things with no claim. From what I’ve seen you’re someone who watches something and just imitates without thinking why the player did that certain. 5 minutes in training mode completely disregards everything you’ve said. Anyway it’s late and I’m tired but I don’t want to stand back and let players listen to your terrible advice, I’m through here.

**
Good riddens.

This forum could use less trolls like you.
**

[Fergus2k8]

Lads come on, no need to get in each other’s faces

[Deebs]

Anyone else here slightly bothered by the liberal use of the words “bitch” and “rape” as of late?

[Logia]

You know what Quinton, you can do and say what you want, I don’t even know why I care. If players are willing to take your advice then so be it, I just hope everyone takes everything we say and actually tests it out rather than taking our word for it. That goes for me, you and everyone else who posts here. Life’s too short to be arguing online. Sorry for derailing the thread everyone.

Deebs; you mean here on in the FGC? It’s always bothered me, the fact that I accidentally said it when describing the Yun-Sim matchup really shocked me. It’s scary how easy you can say things without thinking. =/

[Quinton_McLeod]

Deebs; you mean here on in the FGC? It’s always bothered me, the fact that I accidentally said it when describing the Yun-Sim matchup really shocked me. It’s scary how easy you can say things without thinking. =/

**
Funny. You’re doing that right now.
**

[Strider467]

I’m worried I haven’t practiced enough for July. Honestly, which match-ups do you think should be studied for in preparation for Evo?
Since MVC came out, a lot of the prominent players in my scene stopped playing. So, as of right now, the only match-ups, that seem irritating for Sakura to fight, I know well enough are the Guile, Rose, Ryu, and Gief match-ups because I play those guys too much.

Match-ups that I am worried about are Fuerte, Rufus, Sagat, Sim, Seth. Was wondering if you guys think there are match-ups out there that deserve more attention other than these 5 that I may have overlooked.

I’m not gonna be focusing on ANY other game for Evo except this. Though I did sign up for damn near all of 'em LOL.

[Fergus2k8]

Akuma, Sagat, Rufus, Seth, Cammy, Fei Long, Viper, Bison, Ryu and maybe Abel would be prominent characters.

I don’t know much about America’s scene but generally you would see those characters in tournaments.

[Tha_Hornett]

I hate fuerte, Guile, Rose can be a b#tch and if you sleep on able you wont get back up lol.

[Strider467]

I can’t believe I overlooked Abel, Fei, and Viper. Will look into those ASAP. Thanks guys

[OD_Krypton]

Rose matchup is really difficult but lately I’ve been having a lot of success fighting her. Rose’s normals will always win against sakura and it’s so difficult to get it. A super-late lk tatsu will beat most of her wake up options. This includes ex-drill, backdash but sometimes loses to ex-soulthrow(which rose does this on wake-up? seriously). If she does an ex-drill and the meaty lk tatsu is late enough you hit her and it crosses up and you could continue the combo on the other side. After you condition Rose to sit still on wake up, throw in a couple of throws, you win
Also when you get in on Rose(lol) , you want to always use frame traps: they all seem to abuse cr.lk os
Also if you have 2 bars, don’t be scared to do some random mp.dp, this verson is fast and beats some of her far range pokes most Roses always push buttons
Yo hornett I got some Rose matches to show you!

[Fergus2k8]

Here come on, that’s in the past now, no name calling

[Deebs]

and please lay off the casual use of incredibly insensitive words (being used incredibly insensitively?)

[hehwat]

Rose is easy.
Don’t try to poke her or inch in. Jump in as much as possible. You can hit her out of her Soul Throw. Plus, if she does her cr.HP, you can trade hits. She has no answer to cross-ups outside of her dash. She has no options on wake up. She crumbles under pressure. She has no options to remove herself from the corner except maybe an EX or an Ultra.

When she does an Ultra, most Rose like to jump toward you. You can anti air that slut with an EX DP.

Sakura has so many options against Rose it’s not even funny.

ex soul throw will blow u up and jumping in as much as possible only works if the rose player sucks im sure her ainti airs arent useless.

Rose can ex drill or dash on wakeup and its so hard to time the OS to beat the drill and dash at same time.

[Heavy_Mental]

A jumping normal with an option select st.HK after will beat all of Rose’s wakeup options. If she backdashes, Sakura will tag her with st.HK. If Rose does EX Spiral or EX Soul Throw, she eats a cl.HK.

EX Spiral is free against meaties so in situations where you have to choose between an o-s that beats Spiral and one that beats backdash, go with the latter. You can always simply block the reversal and punish her (for more damage than most option selects can do, I might add) but if she backdashes, then that’s that. Rose is now out of your effective range and now you have to play the footsies game in order to get back in, a game which is definitely not in your favor.

[Quinton_McLeod]

ex soul throw will blow u up and jumping in as much as possible only works if the rose player sucks im sure her ainti airs arent useless.

Rose can ex drill or dash on wakeup and its so hard to time the OS to beat the drill and dash at same time.

**
Let me rephrase, since people are getting the wrong idea.

When I mean jump in as much as possible, I mean to jump in when and only when it’s possible. I’m not saying to blindly jump in at Rose. I’m saying to jump in when you see the possibility; more-so than inching up or trying to poke her. Makes sense now?

Rose isn’t prepared to throw an EX Soul Throw at you at every chance she gets. Most Roses like to waste their EX on other things that would cause more damage. Yes, Rose can EX drill, but it’s risky for her to do so, because you can perform an air tatsu which will force her EX Drill to whiff. You actually have options!

You absolutely HAVE to get in on Rose. You don’t have a choice. You HAVE to attack her. If you let her zone you, you will most likely lose.
**

[Heavy_Mental]

That Sakura has to get in on Rose to win is pretty much a given.

Rose dominates the midrange and as long as she doesn’t do anything stupid like reckless slides or raw Spiral (which get blown up by cr.MK xx Shouken and neutral jump j.MK and j.HK respectively), she can keep Sakura at bay with little to no problem. Sakura, of course, has tools to challenge Rose’s pokes with but they are not going to win her the game. As mentioned earlier. cr.MK buffered into Shouken and neutral jumps are useful if Rose is getting sloppy with her spacing. St.HK covers a fair amount of range but Rose can whiff punish it with st.HK and cr.HK or simply out-range Sakura with Soul Piede. Sakura can also try to FA against some of Rose’s longer-recovering pokes like st.MK or st.HK, but it’s not a great bet, especially if Rose has good reactions. If Rose is throwing out slow-recovering pokes like Soul Piede or st.HK willy-nilly, you can always jump in and land a fat combo (you have to do it in anticipation however; if you try and react, you’ll probably end up landing on a cr.HP). At full screen distance, the match is going to be at a standstill, with Rose probably throwing out safe Sparks and building lots of meter, so unless Sakura is sitting on a serious life lead, she’ll want to close the gap.

If you’re going to jump, it’s worth remembering that the risk-reward ratio is skewed in your favor. Unless Rose has Ultra stocked, the worst you’re going to get for jumping in is 160 damage and a safe jump which you must have to block. On the other hand, if your jump-in is successful, you can probably do twice as much damage as that.

Not only is the risk-reward ratio in Sakura’s favor, but the guessing game as well. Unless the Rose player has great reactions and can do late EX Soul Throw consistently, she has to guess between j.HK and j.HP or Air Tatsu. If she mistimes or mispaces her cr.HP against j.HK and j.HP (and believe me, as a Rose player, those are some annoying moves to AA), she’ll be taking at least 200 damage and a hard knockdown or a reset. If she whiffs her cr.HP against Air Tatsu, she’ll get punished doing that move’s tremendous amount of recovery. Rose could also go for slide, which will evade Air Tatsu but it’s no loss on Sakura’s part. On the other hand, if she guessed wrong and Sakura did j.HK instead, she’s in for a full combo. Finally, Rose can always go for the safest option of backdashing away from jump-ins but this is only going to push her further into the corner, which is the last place she wants to be against any character, especially Sakura.

In conclusion, remember that in order for Rose to win, she must come out on top in most, if not all, of the small battles in this matchup, from anti-airs to whiff-punishes. Sakura, on the other hand, only needs one good opening to go to town on Rose. I believe showing too little respect towards Rose’s ground and anti-air game is going to get you blown up but conversely, so will showing too much respect. Above all, make sure to test your opponent but never to underestimate them. Make them earn your respect but don’t give them any more of it than they deserve. Jump-ins are but one of many ways for you to get in so make sure to use it. On the other hand, if it’s your only way in then all I can say is that you have bigger problems than just the Rose matchup.

[Fergus2k8]

snip

Heavy Mental pretty much summed up the matchup quite accurately.

About that j.hk ~ cl.hk os on Rose, was trying out j.hk ~ cl.hp to see if I can get a full combo off it but far hp doesn’t seem to tag her backdash so will give that cl.hk os a go

And I play a bit of Rose and keeping Sakura out is a bit easy but it’s also pretty damn scary considering she can kill you in one opening or a mistimed AA, you just have to be really on point in this matchup and not abuse heavier normals to the point where you’ll get jumped on

I’d say 5.5 to Rose, would you agree?

[OD_Krypton]

IMO it’s 6-4. A solid rose would frustrated the hell out of you. Especially if they use a FA backdash on wake up , this is a way around the jump-in os. Fergus any good Roses in your area?

[Quinton_McLeod]

Heavy Mental pretty much summed up the matchup quite accurately.

About that j.hk ~ cl.hk os on Rose, was trying out j.hk ~ cl.hp to see if I can get a full combo off it but far hp doesn’t seem to tag her backdash so will give that cl.hk os a go

And I play a bit of Rose and keeping Sakura out is a bit easy but it’s also pretty damn scary considering she can kill you in one opening or a mistimed AA, you just have to be really on point in this matchup and not abuse heavier normals to the point where you’ll get jumped on

I’d say 5.5 to Rose, would you agree?

**
You’re an interesting character, Fergus. Heavy_Mental just reiterated what I said and what’s found in the match-up portion for Rose, but then you say that he sums up the match up accurately… Whose side are you on, Fergus?
**