Don’t get knocked down.
Need help playing against shotos (Ryu and Ken). This fight is clearly about having the right distance (which fight isnt 
) It seems both Ken and Ryu can handle throwing fireballs with you all day. And it seems once Sagat gets within a certain range it is a free jump in against Sagat because his limbs are sticking out. Or if I figure I know they are going to jump in then I try to hit it with a tiger knee and we just trade depending on the punch or kick they use. Tiger uppercut is only effective if they jump in right next to you. Any suggestions, tips, tricks?
Jumping roundhouse, crouching roundhouse, standing punches, standing roundhouse and tiger knee all force shotos to time their attacks differently or beat them cleanly. Know that shotos’ safest jump in is fierce punch, which can be swept easily or beaten cleanly with jumping roundhouse. Shotos’ aerial roundhouse or forward have a quite big vulnerable hitbox, so they can be taken out by aerial attacks or knees: if you feel they will try to attack earlier so as to trade, sweep works as they land. You gotta know when they work and when they trade, then apply variations so they can not take it for granted that a certain attack at a certain distance always whiffs or trades.
Sagat will always win fb wars vs anyone assuming both players start the first at the same time it just takes timimg to get gat’s fb’s out as fast as anyone elseI tink from full screen vs shotos after the 5th fb you’ll start to see your fb’s winning out so generally that’s when you should expect a punish on the shotos part in that spcific situation.
From mid range make liberal use of baiting fb’s and punishing with jrh its key in the shoto matchup. Also keep in mind that tk has horrible priority (unless used on a jumpin from 3/4 screen) and should only be used to punished whiffed attacks, and to hop over fb’s but this skill especially is someting that will take time to be able to use reliably in matches.
I’l b online starting the 24th and would be happy to give any help I can to sagat players it’s always nice to se SOMEONE FINALLY using him beyond stiffpeter, lyghts out, and myself.
Okay I need help with Sagat. I find myself turtling a lot when playing with Sagat and only attacking if and when the opponent loses their patience. I need to figure out some strategies and other buttons besides jumping rh, jumping short and jumping fierce. Below is my assessment based on how on play currently:
Ryu - Personally I see this in Ryu’s favor. Possibly 4 (Sagat) to 6 (Ryu). You cant throw fireballs all day because you will lose. If you get to a certain distance Ryu can punish you because your limbs stick out. It just seems like Ryu can dictate this matchup better than Sagat.
Ken - Speed from Ken really messes up Sagat. Possibly 4 (Sagat) to 6 (Ken). Same thing as Ryu and you have to respect fierce dp. Hurricane into knee bash also is dirty if you dont stop hurricane kick. I find it difficult to get aggressive and attack.
Balrog - Tiger shots, tiger shots, tiger shots. if you cant dictate match with your tiger shots this matchup is over fast. You cant be predictable and you have to have patience. I dont know if it is possible to be aggressive besides just throwing tiger shots. I think this is 4 (Sagat) to 6 (Balrog)
Vega - This matchup sucks. Speed kills Sagat. Between deadly pokes and fast wall dives to cross you up, I just dont know what to do. He doesnt need to wall dive to cause damage. Has an easy time getting around fireballs. Again trying to be aggressive gets you punish with pokes, flip kick and wall dive. I try to zone with tiger shots but not effective. 3.5 (Sagat) to 6.5 (Vega)
Bison - Another bad matchup. Hard for me to lock Bison down with Tiger shots. Bison has great normals and can get in pretty easy on Sagat. 3.5 (Sagat) to 6.5 (Bison)
Dhalsim - This matchup is goofy. If you are not psychic then you are dead. Being too aggressive will get you thrown. Sim’s normals beat many if not all of yours. I try throwing tiger shots but either Sim drills to punish or can be aggressive and I can do nothing. 3 (Sagat) to 7 (Dhalsim)
Guile and Dee Jay - I think Dee Jay is definitely the tougher of the two due to his slide. I try to keep both out by throwing out tiger shots and trying to get chip damage from them blocking. Hoping I guess right when they jump. If not they can tag you every time and really keep you on lockdown. 4 (Sagat) vs 6 (Guile/Dee Jay)
Blanka - Again I try to zone with tiger shots but good blankas duck under high and are fast enough to jump over or straight up to avoid the low ones. Having difficult time keeping him out. 3.5 (Sagat) vs 6.5 (Blanka)
Honda - Fireball trap doesnt work as good as Ryu or Ken or even Sim. I dont think you can even jump in on Honda because he is always charging down back. I dont know how to fight him. 4 (Sagat) vs 6 (E.Honda)
Chun Li - I try to zone with tiger shots but there has to be more to this fight because that doesnt work.
Zangief, T.Hawk, Fei Long, Cammy I feel are advantage Sagat.
While Sagat’s uppercut can give a lot of damage it too easily can be countered. I understand the timimg is different than the other shotos but just about everyone can hit him out of it. Anyhow any advance tips on the matchups I think are bad for me would be great.
Any strats for sagat going against blanka. Seems like I get in a corner and throw low tiger shots and try to guess when they are going to jump at me.
Also any strats for Bison? His headstomp comes out so fast that if you dont get him just as it is coming out you cant punish it. I started playing a little defensive but then I start getting thrown like a rag doll. Sagat’s uppercut goes straight up and has no curve so Bison doesnt have to fear jumping in or jumping in to get close. I try chipping away with tiger shots but that doesnt do much. What am I doing wrong?
Thanks in advance.
I’ll bite. Oh…wait…I mean I’ll tiger…I guess. Anyway, when I’m Sagat fighting Blanka, I generally try to either poke at him with cr.:mk: XX :rh: Tiger Shot or use Tiger Knee shenanigans to possibly catch him sleeping and get in a quick throw. Usually cr.:mk: XX :hk: Tiger Shot will push him out far enough that he can only follow up with a :fp: Blanka Ball to hit or make contact with you. You can either bait that and then TIGER UPPERCUT that or immediately follow up with a :lp: or :lk: Tiger Shot. The :lp: Tiger Shot takes away the Blanka Ball and also recovers fast enough that you can TIGER UPPERCUT Blanka if he jumps. The :lk: Tiger Shot takes away cr.:hp: and the Beast Slide (:df:+:hp:) (though he shouldn’t be in range for those to hit) and again sets up ye olde TIGER…TIGER UPPERCUT trap. Of course, if your opponent has good reflexes, you’ll eat a Blanka Ball this way, so don’t forget about your Fake Tiger Shot (cr.:lp: or cr.:mp:). Blanka can easily punish your Tiger Shot attempts, so you must get in their head so that you can reliably make contact with each Tiger Shot. From there, you’re looking at either keeping him out with st.:mk: and cr.:mk: XX :hk: Tiger Shot or using the same moves to poke and rushdown, adding j.:hk: for initiating some high-powered offense. You can definitely try crossing up with j.:mk: to initiate Sagat’s ToD (cu.:mk:, cr.:mp:, cr.:mk: XX :hk: Tiger Shot or :hk: Tiger Knee (juggle up to 3 hits)), but just remember that Blanka can’t be safe-jumped so don’t try that on people that have wake-up timing down. Oh…and if for whatever reason you’re at full-screen range from him, :p: Tiger Shots please to avoid the Blanka Ball on the scar. Full screen is nice, but that’s just not where Blanka will stay since his jump is so fast.
Vs shotos 5.5-4.5 and the matchup maybe even 6-4 after forcing the jumpins tk that shit and corner pressure until you think they will dp their way out the corner and if you look for that it’s over.
Vs boxer 3.3-6.5 an aggressive boxer is impossible to keep out but even when he gets in look for the dp to get out but do not spam it and also look to punish buffalo with cr hk and what you do after the knockdown determines if you will win or not.
Vs claw 5-5 gat beats walldives clean with j hp and can nullify ground pokes with j rh and the lk fb’s really keep him from being too aggressive but his walking speed and st mk are very hard to beat and makeup for most of these disadvantages, just don’t give him breathing space and don’ fall for walkup throws.
Vs dic 5.5-4.5 Keeping dic out for a bit with fb pressure is easy as long as you can quickly dp on reaction his dr’s after getting a knockdown advance and keep moving forward also since he has no dp j lk rick throws are wonderful don’t forget to punish those dr attempts even when he’s cornered.
Vs sim 3-7 THERE IS NO RELIABLE STRATEGY! lol really all you can do is like you said be pyschic, however you can be aggressive if you look for the right spots to tk, punish drill with dp, and when he tries to setup the fb+normal trap j rh that shit. This match can be won offesnively or defensively both are equally viable options.
Vs guile 5.5-4.5 you can play offensively but do not let guile get close to you at anytime otherwise after matching fb’s he can punish your limbs with many normals, it’s a good matchup as long as you keep enough distance to be able to not get punished by any st or cr normal after your fb. Also don’t get tricked into letting him jumpin on you also make sure you have recovery to fb and dp or tk right after.
Vs dj 5.5-4.5 all he can do is hope you whiff an fb so he can tag you with j rh since you know this force the jumpin with lk fb’s and even if you try to punish the jumpin with hp fb you will get hit but so he will he but more importantly he gets knocked down so win with chip.
Vs blanka 5.5-4.5 Zone as usual, if he jumps from far away st hk otherwise dp repeat until won.
Vs honda 5.5-4.5 NEVER play aggressively jsut punish jab hb’s with fb or cr hk, punish fp hb’s from full screen with dp which is important to do because honda will sicne it goes over low fb’s. Also if he buttslams and lands in front of you cr hk that shit. NEVER do more then 3 fb’s in a row.
Vs chun 6-4. zone and dp simple as can be.
Vs geif 7-3 cr hk lariats, tk jumpins or st hk if your reaction isn’t fast enough, bait greenhand and cr hk, st fp works well if he hops, don;t fall for tick setups you should win this easy.
Vs hawk 6-4 j fp beats dive if you can’t dp on reaction also try to bait his dp and remember vs hawk, geif, honda, n boxer you NEVER want to play aggressively.
Vs Fei 6-4 bait cw’s and punish, don’t get cornered.
Vs cammy 6-4 even if she corers you she will rely on drill pressure which you can beat with j rh and after you scare her with that counter pressure with lk fb’s until she’s forced to hooligan.
Good advice except about the tk. NEVER tk vs blanka.
Unless it’s in a combo and you’re juggling. 
But yeah, I can definitely see that. I usually punish any Tiger Knee that doesn’t hit me…especially with Blanka. The opponent would have to be in a deep sleep to get fooled by that. Point taken.
Orochi could you go into detail about why you think Sagat v. Guile is 4.5-6.5 instead of 4-6… I think this match is just a straight up disadvantage for guile and not just a slight one…
Tiger shots wreck Guile in this match if you know your distances…
Play Marsgatti and caesar and try telling me it’s a big advantage for gat. DO NOT LET GUILE GET CLOSE! (unless you got him cornered) if he does he has a big advantage because after trading fb’s he will be in range to punish your limbs on your fb recovery with most of his normals and beating his footsie game is nigh impossible.
Also don’t underestimate the arrogance even a good guile has when using sb as a walking shield, they usually think ok this sagat just blocked the sb he won’t have enough time to dp my jumpin! and because of sb’s blockstun it’s kinda tight timing but you can dp him.
Zoolander, you have Sagat with only 2 bad matchups, 1 favorable and either even or slightly in his favor. Why then does no one use this guy? I know I still have a lot to learn but I still think besides Boxer and Sim that Vega and Bison have to also be heavy in the opponents favor. Struggling immensely against Vega and Bison. Speed ,kills Sagat.
And speaking of speed, dont laugh, but how do I fight ChunLi? I have played so much with Sim I dont know how to handle this fight. Even in the chun li thread they say Sagat is tough. I know I cant play back because even though her fireball is slow her walk speed makes up for it and allows her to if she wants follow with her fing infamous light or medium kick.
And I have been on psn (cant wait to get back to xbox live just strictly because of the netcode. great players on there though) but I have been getting destroyed by binstone who uses dee jay. And also having a difficult time with Guile. I played TecmoSuperbowl and he was just straight rushing me down after a sonic boom just to close the gap so I couldnt dictate the match with tiger shots.
And real quick but how do you handle T.Hawks that abuse their jumping jab or strong. It seems to nullify the tiger uppercut which allows them to get in and do their ticking spd?
And I do agree Zangief is definitely Sagats easiest match.
Thanks again bro and loving Sagat. I also will start recording some of my matches so you can critique them and let me know what the heck I am doing wrong.
Before answering that question take a step back and look at o.sagat who is universally known to be top 4 in ST. His dp damage which ranges from 20-40% and notorious fb recovery made him difficult to get close to without taking a significant amount of damage unless you’re sim or boxer and yet only a very small handful of people (Choi, Valle, Wong, Gigamsx, and maybe one or two others) were ever able to consistently do well with him. Those few people IMO don’t use sagat in hdr because while he still only has 2 bad matchups (it’s debatable on whether claw is a 3rd) the other 12 favorable matchups went from 6-4’s and 7-3’s to mostly 5,5-4.5’s with a few 6-4’s. Also look at how the top 2 o.sagat players Choi and Valle use ryu in hdr IMO this is not because sagat got that much worse as much as it is because their other main ryu got moderately better since fake fb helps a little in all his matches and his bad matches are slightly better since the 4 gods were nerfed. Don;t forget Wong doesn’t like hdr (even though he’s the best hdr sagat I know by far.)
So when a character who isn’t very well represented to begin with lost the people who were best with him it caused a negative stigma for him in hdr since not many people have seen what he’s capable of, leading many people to ignorantly believe that due to his absence among tournament winners he must suck. I don’t exactly consider myself hot shit (if I was I’d have something better to show for it then scrubby 17th place at evo09 and a 7-2 loss in losers finals this year) however, I’ve played most people on this forum and I hope by now they’ve realized that any preconceived notions of hdr sagat not being that good simply don’t hold water.
Get someone to spam hawks j lp and learn the correct spacing to dp him.
Why bother recording yourself and have a scrub like me critique? Just play me lol. I’m not saying I’ll consistently win but invite me to a room with whomever you consider good players or anyone you have trouble against and I’ll show you hdr sagat can hold his own. I usually play on 360 obviously so I’m never on psn but if for whatever reason you can’t get on 360 send me PM so I know to get on psn.
Also play/watch piston honda x previously known as lyghts out his style of play is different then mine but he’s just as good maybe even a little better, anyways it’s really great to see someone interested in picking up sagat:rock:
On a personal note when using gat I seem to feel at my most comfortable when playing shotos, not because they’re his easiest match but I think I know these matchups much better then others and so it doesn’t feel particularly difficult even against a vastly superior player like dgv who by consistently raping me shows how far I have to go I seem to get more wins vs him then a player of my skill should.
Dude Sagat is NOT that good at all. Those match ups are soo wrong. I have no clue where you are gathering this information (your head I presume?), since he is not represented at the highest level at all (because he sux) and you need that data to determine if he is going to have 10 advantageous match ups. To be honest he loses to the top 6-8 characters.
Personally I think Sagat is a really solid character. Lyghts out Stiffpeter and orochizoolander are the only ones I see playing him and i don’t get why, I hate turtling up so I don’t play him but he really is a good character. J Wong and StiffPeter have both placed pretty high in HDR tournaments using him
I don’t know if you’re trolling or not but 2 things you should never do is be condescending and/or disregard another opinion especially when said opinion is founded on logical reasoning while yours is lacking. I stated my opinions and gave sound reasons supporting them while you on the other hand have done little beyond tell me I’m wrong due to an ill found conclusion, also saying “because he sux” really doesn’t help you much and going on to draw your own conclusion on his tier ranking without any support is hypocritical and ignorant.
You saying sagat isn’t represented at the highest level shows you completely ignored my above post which may not be conclusive but is certainly a plausible reason, also the fact that Justin Wong beat Thelo and barely lost to Damdai in the grand finals of a tournament earlier this year further makes your point moot. Like I said before I’ve played the best hdr players online and off and while I may not consistently double perfect them most if not all of them would agree that people like you don’t give sagat enough credit. Not to say that the words of a few players are beyond all dispute but at evo this year I was talking to many top players exactly about this and some (dgv, and snake eyez to name two) agree that sagat is much better then what tournament rankings show.
And why not just play me? show me how much he sucks. I’m on almost every week night after 10pm.
edit: forgot about st1ffpeter he’s good too.
money match. lets get this hype. 50 dollar? zoolander sounds like he’s about to prove you wrong jamie. what you got to say about that?
zoolander, don’t waste your time. jaime has been known to troll with dumb shit.
Sounds good to me, anyways I forgot who you used but I remember you were really good in casuals at evo, I think you also beat SE or came close.
What happened to that “I can take care of thelo easy” =P get on xbl lets get some games in I remember you were nasty with them knee bash mixups holds ribs