Thanks highland, those are good tips. freaking chain jabs…just mash them while holding back and everything is solved…we on the other hand have to contend with one frame links to string two crouching lps together.
As for Marz’s comment. yes, bonchan was connecting ultra 1 off a regular ts fadc. I tried it on dan and it works, but couldnt get it to work on ryu for some reason. I saw bonchan do it to michael Tan’s ken twice in their topanga set.
It’s pretty old tech , if you sift through either the regular threads ( or maybe in the video thread? ) one of the regular Sagat posters ( when this place was busy ) has a video showing all the different versions of Ultra from fireball cancels. He too argued at the time why we didn’t use it. I’d link it but I’m on my phone.
I guess it’s one of those strange things that people just don’t use as the game matures. Remember back in vanilla a common ultra set up for lots of characters was simply to tag it on from a jump in fierce/ heavy. You hardly ever see that now, people will just combo, it’s like sometimes we just forget ( or over think ) scenarios.
Would appreciate it if you could link it later, man. I dont think i have ever used jump in heavy attack into ultra. I have seen it…i am aware of it…but have never used it. Could also be because i started playing this game in late 2012.
It was Ronnicle that posted it. He’s not posted in here in ages though. This is his channel -
You should go back through all the Sagat video’s one day, there’s a lot of gold in there that still applies, the King hasn’t changed much.
Some pretty good stuff on the channel. Good looking out Highland. I need to go rummaging through the video thread. Thanks!
Any tips to overcome the Ibuki - Sagat matchup? I have trouble dealing with many of her moves (the cross up forward dash, her target combos, the light slide at close range, and her EX reversal kick + kunai). How do I punish all that sh*t?
Bad match for Sagat.
Cross up forward dash you can jab or crouch tech for a punish. Or just uppercut if they do it too much.
Slide punish with jab>whatever if it hits deep, I believe its safe if its properly spaced.
I see Gachikun use a lot of ststand fierce in this MU for some reason…
I’m working on a video at the moment that covers all character punishes. Ibuki is in the first video ( there will be more parts due to the volume of characters). Things I put in the Ibuki part -
For the EX dp you want to hold focus attack as she goes up in the air - this will absorb the Kunai, crumple her and you will land a full punish. Slide can be countered by our st.mk - a very important button in the match, also slower low shots can catch her as she trys to slide past the fireball.
EX neckbreaker is obviously fully punishable on block with anything. The cross ups are not safe, crouch tech will hit her out of it - think of those like blanka hops.
Her Target combo/ and grounded pressure unfortunately there is no answer, thats why she’s TT. There is literally no reason to throw a high shot in this match though, you want her away from you on the ground - constant low shots. The only other trick I can think of (that isn’t really that great) is if you do get in a 50/50 with the Kunai cross ups after a KD, you can time a LP DP that will get reset by the Kunai, what this means is that if she attempts to get a run on, you will just get reset in the air and get knocked down (no further combo), she can obviously then start another cross up after that as you are on the ground again, but it’s sometimes useful if you think the ibuki player is going to fuck up their timings. It’s like taking deliberate damage to escape a worse situation.
TheRealMarz & Highland: Thanks a lot! That info is gold and will definitely help me
I know right! I noticed that too. I saw Bonchan using it against EX Pugera when Ibuki was close to being cornered. But I’m still figuring out why they use that particular button in this matchup.
What’s the link to your channel?
Thinking about the dash cross ups as blanka hops is actually smart and helpful. Damn, I hate that move.
I’ll also try the LP dp thing, since I don’t mind taking some damage in order to mess up the Ibuki flow chart
Thanks a lot guys
Link here -
There’s a thread down the page a bit with some of the stuff in it - Sagat match ups and video thread - Ultra.
Thanks a lot, awesome video and channel. There’s a lot of useful info there.
If that is so. The implications would be huge.
Think o/s cr.LP xx Low Tiger xx FADC. Ultra - Best counter poke ever!
I could get it to work when starting the combo with cr. mk…combo starter with cr lp seems harder…or it could be just me. Timing is pretty tight either way.
So kara uppercut can punish medium and heavy headbutts from Honda right? Do I need to stand block?
Hp is easy , mp is too risky for me. It’s at the borderline of what kara can punish. I’m not actually 100% on the kara data, but I’d say Ryus sweep (-15) is close to the outer limits for me. I think Hondas Mp is -12 or 13? That’s getting pretty tight out of blockstun ( especially at the ranges a Honda player will use it).
Stand block is an effective way of making punishing easier though ( Rolento rolls etc)
I think there was a discussion once on what the actual numbers where.
Hondas mp is -13, I’m not actually sure if Kara uppercut can punish mp even testing it in training mode.
Also at certain ranges I can’t tell what version of the headbutt he’s using so I’m scared to go for punishes.
same concern i had actually. its hard to tell when he does it up close
You can only tell by the speed from memory , a good Honda player won’t use headbutt in a way we can punish, unless you’ve baited an EX. Scrubby Hondas will try to full screen you though. Easy match though , floaty jump , can’t consistently beat zoning, easily Sagats favour.
F. HK kara uppercut cancels have variable start-up times of 6-11 frames based on how fast you cancel it. The distance also varies based on how slow you cancel it (slower = more distance traveled). I did some testing in Frame Trapped and Honda’s HP Headbutt is a 3-frame punish with the slowest 11-frame version from standing and a 2-framer from crouching in the worst case scenario (longer distance headbutts). If you cancel too fast it can whiff and the 10-frame startup version is a 1-frame link from either stand/crouch block. The leniency greatly increases the closer Honda was when he starts the headbutt, allowing for earlier kara cancels. Moral of the story is to try your best to stand block, plink the initial roundhouse/get it out as early as possible and kara cancel as late as you can.
MP Headbutts are easy to punish if it was started from just outside cr. MK range. Kara cancel timing is very lenient and it’s a 3-frame punish. Mid range gets extremely strict and I agree with Highland that it becomes an extreme risk as a lot of the time you have to be frame perfect on both the kara cancel and the roundhouse. Long distance/meaty is un-punishable.
Just watched the NCR games. The more i see Bonchan play the more i go from inspired to just “why do i even bother?”. I mean, the patience and reading of your opponent required to successfully play sagat proficiently is just…wow.