I don’t think that’s true…
Akuma, Ken, Karin, Guile, Necalli, Chun, Urien, Cammy, Birdie, Rashid, Ibuki are all punishable after their metered invincible reversals, if I recall correctly. And that’s just off the top of my head.
There are many characters that don’t have a fully invincible reversal outside of super.
Cammy is nearly as bad with the CC’s since she’s essentially like having a slightly better version of Ryu’s s.HK CC and no s.HP CC or any other CC that hits grounded opponents.
She of course was built around being good without CC’s while Ryu…isn’t anymore.
chun has ex sbk. Urien and Birdie have an ex headbutt type move. The rest of those you mentioned are airborne so those are easy to punish.
Lets say with Urien if I block that said move it seems like anything I throw out gets stuff. Maybe I can try lp.dp to testif that works but I I dont know what to do after I block those moves besides keep blocking.
I would like to know and i dont care to be wrong.
You probably just need to work on your timing.
Are you familiar with frame data? If so, there’s plenty of resources that will tell you what you can punish specific moves with (there are a few apps for ios and android that are helpful to have on hand when you’re playing online).
Otherwise, you can just go into training mode and record a character doing a reversal and blocking afterwards.
Try out different punishes.
I think the nerf I feel the most playing is LP FB recovery increase combined with MP DP nerf so you don’t get deep DP’s for AA.
I think if my math is correct you need 7 additional frames to do a classic deep AA off a LP FB. 7 frames (3 more recovery of LP FP, 4th frame MP DP becomes invincible for air attacks) seems like a lot to me. Assuming the standard jump in is roughly 35 frames, you’re looking at 20% increase in the ease of jump ins hitting Ryu if you try to zone with him.
Playing against Bison is miserable experience with this Ryu. I’ve never had to guess correctly so many times just to have an offense. It feels like the game is somehow even more mash and jump-in friendly than S1 which is madness to me.
Looking over his Frame Data, Dictator is like + on every single attack of importance sans his slide. Since he V-skill kills FB (not that it matters) and his normals are all literally better than Ryu’s, I’m not sure how Ryu can really fight him.
You just turtle Bison til you get close to him then you run gambles. If you guy’s are not using it try jump in (blocked) raw tatsu to blow up the tech or knock down forward dash raw tatsu. Yes its a gamble but most Bison players back dash away from pressure or late tech since they have no reversal.
That in turn opens up your throw/shimmy game once you can put those doubts in his head. Honestly I hardly throw fireballs against him because they will usually jump or devils reverse which you just DP unless it’s EX plus you are just feeding him free meter like Nash. Also V-reversal all the time vs Bison as soon as you’ve got it, it’s easy because he’s hitting you with long moves like fierce and scissors.
It’s a tough match if you can’t block, you’ve really got to block a lot and get that stun/grey down with the V-reversal. Also don’t be afraid to just Dp his ass. Bison players think they’ve got a right to link in 5 normals. Fuck it, if they designed the game around choices then make your choice with EX DP and let him know your not standing for that shit.
I had a match with a Bison last night and I actually did block A LOT. And won. Second match was 2 rounds to 0. I was so refreshing to break a Bison player’s will and make him or her desperate and out of ideas.
I don’t like turtling but Ryu is my main and I will make it work no matter what >: (
I would like faster recovery on v-trigger hadokens.
His up-close ground game is great. My worst match-up is Zangief. I hate it. He has the upper hand up close, and he can spin like a ballerina through fireballs in my preferred range. V-trigger spin is even worse, and his muscle-parry absorbs too many hits in my opinion.
I don’t find the gief matchup that bad. We still control the pace against him although it’s a lot harder to tame gief in S2 than in S1. The thing about his lariat is that it’s VERY negative on block. So I usually bait lariats like I bait jumpins. After a blocked lariat I dash up -> combo of my choice. Then it’s your turn to play.
But like if he only does lariat when he sees a fireball, how we use shoryuken when we see a jump, then he dominates the footsies with st.HP, cr.LP and SPDs, plus shutting down our fireballs with lariats when we try using them as an extension to footsies. And yet further out than that, he can still lariat like usual and negate the fireballs there too. In my opinion it’s Gief who controls the pace and spacing now. It was 6/4 to Ryu in S1 and now it’s 6/4 to Gief in S2.
I’ve seen a few matches where Daigo will hover around gief’s st.fierce range and try to whiff punish with cr.fierce xx tatsu.
I feel like gief’s st.fierce really hangs out for a while after he whiffs it, especially after it’s been charged.
Worth a shot…
Got the app but I mostly just tried different punishes. I usually just start with s.lk and see if it connects. So far I am getting positive results. I do wantto point out i feel that s.lk nerf even more now. Poor ryu has stubby range.
I am trying to see the positives in this version of RYu and its hard. I notice a lot of characters have knock down type of moves. Maybe capcom can give ryu and s.mp into sweep. Isnt this the reason why a bunch of his normals have a 1 frame longer start up?
Pretty much, they didn’t want to give him st.mp - sweep without a counter hit. So they fucked him up there too. Just like a domino effect from all his normals but in a bad way - we’ll nerf this…but that means we’ve got to nerf this…and this…and this.
But we can buff his b.hk and his st.hp in V-trigger only! Yeah thanks - fuck off.
After watching the Topanga League, it should be very visible the absolute shortcomings of Ryu in Season 2 after the nerfs. If this is not a better demonstration of just how frustrating it is for Ryu to deal with multiple situations due to lack of range, any form of effective zoning, pathetic VT, I don’t really know what else is.
To be fair Diago didn’t play his best either at Topanga League. Right now Ryu needs something “not fair” because in my opinion the way this game is having a toolkit that is too fair isn’t gonna cut it in this game not when you have dumb stuff like far away normals doing massive damage off of a v trigger cancel normal on hit or Rog’s ex dash punch. They could atleast give Ryu’s st LK back but i have no faith in capcom’s balancing patch at all I be very surprised if they buffed Ryu
Also, it is too late to the party but I would take non-invincible DP as a reversal as long as they took its Crush Counter vulnerability when he lands. That would be only fair, considering.
