If you’re having trouble against good Nashes who chuck tons of plasma it is absolutely free to walk him to the corner with walk forward block against fireball spam. You can force his hand. I had issues with that too early on but now it’s not a problem, just walk forward block, after four fireballs they’re in the corner and they have to make a decision.
edit: i remember daigo remarked ryu’s back dash was strong, i think this is because of the short range it covers, it avoids throws/sets up a throw whiff and then leaves you in range to whiff punish, whereas other back dashes move too far back to do anything. this is also true during pressure, you can escape frame traps with back dash between normals and then go for a whiff punish if they throw a button out. ryu’s back dash is actually a really strong defensive tool and i think at the moment underutilized by a lot of people. try experimenting back dashing during some block strings (after blocking the first one/two hits, if its a three hit string) and see what i mean, you might be surprised. very useful against the likes of bison or other bully characters during pressure (nash, cammy, chun, etc).
Did you body me? If yes then you better accept my rematch request the next time that happens after the patch drops
Yeah, I’m here trying to learn all I can and help out to if possible. These character specific forums are great for learning all the little nuances about your character.
Now that everyone has played the game for about a month, whats everyones opinon about vt cancels of sweep? It seems to me to be an allmost direct substitute for srk fadc in terms of reseting a sitiuation and does seem to make the use of v meter very one dimensional.
Do you guys love it or hate it?
Im kinda split on it, i like it when i have that safe sweep option available… But i tend to get negative when i eat one myself and seems odd to me that capcom would leave this in after adressing fadc safty in sf4. Its prob a non issue in general but thought it would be a worthwhile topic to discuss
I got shit for saying the same thing in the general thread. Ryu is at least only a sweep, some characters can throw out a button - cancel it - watch the screen freeze, if it hits - continue onto big damage, if it gets blocked you’re completely safe.
Basically you get a massive reward at zero risk.
Birdie can take a gamble with EX bull horn through a fireball and cancel it if it doesn’t hit so some characters not only get anti fireball tech, they get safe anti fireball tech once a round, maybe twice.
It’ll be interesting to see how this game develops, once people are aware of options.
Didnt really think of it as a fadc thing, but I can see how it can been seen as such. I guess since I was playing KI alot before and VT cancels are no were near as good in sfv as instinct cancels are in KI that I dont mind.
FADC is the worst there is something about being able to cancel specials to be safe or into damage that is kind of lame to me in a SF game. But really the mechanic’s behind sf4 is what made FADC’s even more lame. (back dashing etc etc) At least have to keep the pressure on or be neutral…not back dash to safety if it doesn’t work out.
There’s for sure a trend of people just using vtrigger to throw out low unsafe moves, cancel them, then actually be at advantage for it. Look at mika who can just run towards you and do the shoulder slide cancelled into vtrigger for an auto 3 way mixup, or chun who can just start throwing out cr.mp and confirm to a full combo if it hits, bisons slide etc. I’m really not a fan of that kind of play when in general this game is focused on having to commit to something unsafe and you get punished for it if you fuck up. That all changes when someone fills their v meter on a lot of characters.
when bison is doing his slide and I neutral jump mk it does miss sometimes completely although it looks it would hit, its weird but this happened a few times today
Career_Mavin here, shout outs to Rice Eater, we’ve played a lot of tense sets. I have to say, I really enjoy the Ryu-Ryu mirror.
I’m fine with the VT cancels after sweep. Sweeps aren’t that good anyway, you run a big risk betting crush countered or CH while throwing them out, or straight up beaten by other pokes.
I don’t know if I’m the only one but I have no complaints about the game. I love it. I think VT is great and adds just enough depth that I’m constantly thinking about how to do situations differently, without being so frustratingly over powered like Ultra combos in SFIV were. I love Ryu’s VT and think it’s very well balanced. Always helps but never does the work for me.
I know some people think parts of the game are cheap, but as someone whose made it to Gold with Ryu I can tell you there’s a pretty simple way to beat everything in this game. The challenge comes down to the mental game and enticing your opponents into doing what you’ve set yourself up to beat. Because things move fast enough that any tactic can work if you’re not expecting it. That’s not easy to do, but it’s fun and anyone can learn how to do it with some practice.
I was in the middle of an axe kick and Nash Vtriggered above my head, I thought I was toast but he got crossed up somehow?! If I was Daigo, I would have finished the combo into denjin.
Bison gets his slide made safe by VT. That was his exactly his FADC right?
Ryu’s sweep is jackall in comparison.
Birdie gets a hit/juggle just from his activation.
meaty denjiin guardbreaks, these assume you hit with a well spaced sweep (travel time of the fireball matters if its meaty or not, so if you are too close it will go over them before they wake up)
if not in vtrigger
CC sweep, VTC, st.lk, charge HP hado
if already in vtrigger
CC sweep, immediately charge HP hado
after both you can dash forward into f+hp for a full combo
"However, for me personally, one of the main issues with SF5 is how the neutral game is designed. For example, quick recovery and lack of hurtbox on medium buttons for many characters. Karin, Chun-Li, Birdie, Vega are the most prominent ones, but every character has it to some degree.
Compared to SF4, whiffpunishing these buttons on reaction consistently is too hard, which forces you to predict when they are coming and do a pre-emptive whiffpunish. Combine that with the fact that dashes are generally much faster and impossible or very hard to react to and it makes the mid-range neutral game much more random, in my opinion.
For example, while you’re looking for your opponent to use a poke, he suddenly dashes or jumps in and gets the momentum in his favor, which in this game is very rewarding. I would prefer the game ot be based on consistently outplaying your opponent in neutral, instead of you or the opponent guesses right once and takes the whole round.
I’ve heard a lot of players insist that this is a heavily footsie-based game, which I don’t think is true. If anything, it is a pressure based game, with the objective to gain the momentum first and take advantage of that, until your opponent somehow finds an opening in your offense, or you make a mistake, and shifts the momentum to their favor. Since pressure is very heavily rewarded in SF5, this is a pretty big deal."
Glad to finally see someone say what I’ve been thinking this entire time. I feel like this really applies to Ryu’s neutral as well and is what made the transition from SF4 Ryu to SFV Ryu so hard.
I think I agree with what he says. If someone gets lucky with a jump in as you press a button, it can be game over. Momentum is huge. A few times I’m within a hit of wining and I let up the pressure to be safe. I then get momentum reckt.
Mika and rashid with the amazing momentum based reckage.
I’m totally fine with that.
SFV is more about taking risks and playing poker than SFIV which is about playing it safe.
Matches get more hype, you feel better when you win and you feel more devastated when you lose.
I like it, but I feel this game should be played in 3 out of 5 sets.
But dashing in and jumping is a huge risk that should be rewarded with momentum though. It’s not like they can dive kick in for free or focus attack in and bypass footsies altogether.
Whiff punishing loses to walk forward.
Walk forward loses to pokes.
pokes loses to whiff punishing.
If you’re expecting a poke, and instead your opponent closed the distance, that’s footsies. You lost that exchange. Some shit you have to chalk up to luck. I’ve chucked a fireball or two that my opponent randomly jumped over. But if I keep getting my fireballs jumped over it stops being luck at that point.
As far as momentum goes, you definitely benefit from it with normals doing grey damage, and relatively high damage and stun. But you don’t just lose to momentum. Momentum doesn’t stop you from blocking or watching your opponent’s attack patterns
To say this isn’t a footsie game boggle ls my mind. How can you say that? Players are not just blindly dashing and jumping and those who are getting punished for it. At low/mid level you may get away with this, but that stuff isn’t free against good players. Those jump ins/dashes are set up.
Example, watching Daigo play Ryu he doesn’t just arbitrarily choose to dash in. He establishes a fireball game and capitalizes on hesistation by dashing. Jump-ins are usually to counter long heavy pokes.
I won’t disagree with the pressure aspect of the game but you’re not just going to walk through your opponents wheelhouse and go “aaye dawg eat this throw/CH”.
To say this isn’t a neutral based game sounds like initial impressions/mid level mindset. As for Ryu while his general style is intact he’s not designed the same, and on top of that its a brand new game. You can’t just expect to play the same way in a new game and do well. That doesn’t just apply to SF4 to SFV, that holds true to every title.
I’ve said exactly what that guy is thinking many times over the past 4 months.
I think it has footsies, but they are more based on guessing something at the right time rather than whiff punishment. It makes footsies feel more like “I guessed right” rather than “I made that happen” I’ll give you an example-
In SF4 you can sit at a range where you are “just” safe, but you have buttons that will whiff punish the opponents attempted pokes. This range varies from move to move, but you can sit at a range where you can make Ryu do cr.mk but you (also as Ryu) can whiff punish with …cr.mk. It’s like a dance at midscreen.
In SF5 the whiff punishment range is either really far or really close, meaning the person really has no reason to throw that normal out because you are too far away to get hit.
Take Birdies st.mk as an example - in order to whiff punish this move with say Ryus cr.mp, you have to stand in a place where the st.mk wouldn’t hit you anyway and you have nothing that will reach birdie from that distance. In other words once a characters dominant normal has started up, it’s going to win almost all of the time if you are at the midrange. Take again say nashes cr.mk, again the distance is large, which in turn limits your other options , you can only whiff punish the move from a pre-emptive guess rather than a visual confirmation, you can’t close ground and whiff punish it because it’s box is too big - this is why people jump, because instead of interacting in the mid range, they want to by pass it completely with a dash or a jump.
The only time this is less apparent is when a character like Chun Li is playing a character like Karin. When you have a dominant normal AND a fast walk speed.
Let’s put it another way. Who has better footsies? SF4 Ryu or SF5 Ryu… That’s a pretty easy decision to make.
Came here to talk. The more i play with Ryu the more i think he’s the bottom of the bottom, he’s so bad that i’m about to change character. Why do even ppl think he’s good? Ass fireball, Ass normals that have 0 range, bad pressure game (you can’t follow any knowdown). The only good thing he has is the reversal and it’'s not that good.
Is there any reason to play Ryu over Chun-li, Bison, Dalshim or Nash?
The shoto power is strong in this one.