Ok…? Which of these series outside of some V-ism bs let him use it to hit confirm ~500 damage?
Tradition is a pretty lame excuse to keep things the way they are, it’s not even an argument, it’s that thing you turn to when you can’t think of a reason to not do something.
The game has changed from 15 years ago, changes need to be made to things that need them. Keeping something some way and expecting it to work perfectly for that long is naive. There’s no excuse at all for Ryu’s lp.srk to be that beneficial.
All I’m saying is that the move was built to beat things directly in front of it, be it mid level or low level. The thing that balances this fact is that if blocked or whiffs, ryu gets chewed up. The risk reward is changed slightly because of sf4’s game mechanics but thats not really a complaint about the move itself, that more of a complaint about the fadc system. Like I was saying before, a lot of these complaints just sound like new sf player whining.
I still maintain my previous thoughts on Ryu and his SRK’s…
More moves need to knock him down on a trade. Keep lp SRK -> Ultra, just let him get fucked up a lil more when he trades. No way EX HS from bison (for instance) should trade into an ultra
Make his Ultra projectile smaller, so that it either whiffs if you mistime it in a juggle
or doesn’t get all 8 hits cleanly unless it’s perfectly timed.
As it stands now, the timing is ridiculously forgiving.
Other characters have to accurately time their ultra juggles (Abel, Sakura, Viper).
Ryu should, too. This would put a little more brain power into the whole DP > FADC > Ultra and trade > Ultra thing. Suddenly it matters what height your opponent was when you traded, how close you are to them, what strength DP you used, etc.
I would like to humbly mention that if you talk about hard or restrictive ultra juggles, chun should be the first name out of anyone’s mouth.
Her BnB juggle into ultra literally does not work on a great portion of the cast unless it is done (regardless of timing) from ONE EXACT SPOT on either side of the midscreen line.
Oh yeah, miss it by a few pixels and the other character falls out with enough time to quickstand and punish with THEIR ultra which usually ends the round.
Do the juggle in the corner and THEN it becomes timing specific…a few frames early and she whiffs in a way that gives her opponent enough time to taunt, build a full charge, and punish with anything the want.
IDK about alpha and 3s, but in ST if you traded with ryu’s jab srk, then he got reset in the air. He was only invul on the ground, but he didn’t have an hitting frames. Or it was like 1. I don’t think jab srk should have juggle property. Does ken’s?
It’s not a complaint about the FADC system, it’s a complaint that a move with 14 active hit frames can be used as a meaty on wake-up and the only safe thing to do is block.
What else could you really be complaining about? Cause if Ryu could just upper you as a meatie and the safest thing you could do was block but it WASN’T SAFE FROM BEING ABLE TO DASH CANCEL, this wouldn’t be an issue. Just like it wasn’t in every other previous sf. I really can’t see where your argument is at, guy.
I don’t like this logic.
“It’s hard to do other character’s combos, so you should make this character’s combos hard too.”
Why not just ask for your character’s combos to be easier? Instead of wanting Ryu’s to be more difficult, wouldn’t it make more sense for Capcom to give the characters you’re talking about bigger windows as big as Ryu’s in which to land their ultras?
The challenge in fighting games shouldn’t come from special moves that are physically hard to execute, but rather from the interaction you get with your opponent. Instead of pissing off Ryu players, let’s make Abel, Sakura, and Viper players happy.
Its based on the premise that reward should be mitigated by risk and difficulty.
So, either make these kinds of juggles hard universally (which is what I want).
Or…make them all stupid easy, universally.
OR: Use the difficulty to balance out the characters strengths.
This last option is appealing, but capcom got it all backwards…the easiest ultra juggles in the game all belong to the top tier characters: Ryu, Sagat, Boxer, Rufus.
Incredibly effective tools should be difficult to use. Why would you want incredibly effective things like Rufus’s target combo into ultra to be so easy a cave man could do it? It’s dumb to make something easy to do and hard to deal with, it’s just bad design. That’s why Nu in BlazBlu is retarded (I mained her so I can say this). Her drive attack mix ups are hard to deal with but brain dead easy to execute. It’s just dumb.
It’s not about making the move difficult, it’s about making the move actually require judgment and timing.
Abel’s cr HP into Ultra isn’t difficult at all. But, it DOES require you to pay attention to your timing and spacing. Same with Sakura’s.
As it stands now, Ryu DP > Ultra requires ZERO judgment and ZERO timing. It doesn’t matter what your opponent was doing, what height they were at, how you connected with the DP, where you are in the stage, etc. It always connects 100%.
I’m not talking about adding meaningless execution barriers, like making joystick commands extra difficult for no reason just to make moves harder to do. This change would actually be a meaningful one. Requiring players to actually read and react to their opponent’s positioning is not just a mindless execution barrier.
i dunno how many times i’ve seen my dude get knocked up high in the air, seen a quick ultra fired off, thought to myself “maybe it will whiff or barely hit” then it knicks a buttcheek and proceeds to unload the full 8 or 9 hits.
Besides the difficulty, don’t forget the large number of the cast you can’t even get her full ultra juggle on. Like almost if not all the console characters.
No, you’re still misunderstanding me. Ryu can’t FADC once he’s off the ground. This has absolutely nothing to do with FADC’ing because what I’m talking about puts him in a position in which FADC’ing is impossible. Meaty as hell, hitting someone way deep into it’s active frames, Ryu is -off the ground- and impervious to reversals that aren’t incredibly invincible EX moves.
Nothing even remotely close to FADC’ing, it’s not safe because of an FADC, it’s safe because reversals don’t work, the meatiness of it puts Ryu at positive frames on block, back dashing puts you at even / disadvantage. Again, he is fully off the ground at this point, way beyond the point of being able to FADC the attack. That’s where my argument is at, bro.
As many people state, ryu is supposed to be a “jack of all trades, but king of none”.
The later part of that expression seems forgotten by most, and i for one feel like he surpasses his “jack status” in to many areas, atleast to a queen level (ranking as a deck of cards) and that needs some toning down.
I feel like this thread is not the place to go down to specifics, as the looks of it, it just turns in to a shitstorm of verbal abuse and namecalling.
I do however understand the ryu-mainer’s who feel threatend/scared that capcom will overdo the “nerfing” due to massive forum whining, hence the harsh verbal retaliations, but i choose to stay out of it for now with the exception of ballparking my thoughts on the subject.