Look at you. You’re bad at this. You’ve completely misunderstood everything I’ve said, and really you’re just proving you don’t have that much experience at this.
you’re best excuse for why you won’t bother to main him is because “Oh anybody can main him, blah blah blah.” Which really just sounds comical. It sounds like I’m not going to back my shit up.
And besides, I told you I wasn’t going to answer your question, because I challenged you to prove me wrong. You seem to be the only person having this much trouble with this guy-- you and the other 6 or 7 09ers whove come to this thread(and it’s a term I hate using but whatever, you’ve proved to me how stupid one can be.)
Ryu’s defense by the way-- what do you want me to tell you? His only option out of combos is a jab SRK-- or a heavy SRK which isn’t safe, and if they know that then you just stop your combo early… block…have him do his move, and then punish. If they’re playing him as basically as that he’s PREDICTABLE. What, c.mk? I told you how to beat that. Honestly, there’s tons of ways to get in on him. Tap focus. When you see him c.mk hado-- which is his go to poke… if you tap focus dash in, he won’t recover in time. you can do any combo in the game.
Balrog’s jabs by the way are baitable… But I prefer to stuff them with c.mp.
Also, there’s an entire forum full of articles that debunks a lot of what you’re claiming is overpowered.
They’re all by Seth Killian. Really, everything you’ve said in you’re past posts conflicts with not only those articles, but shit that socal has been leveling up towards.
So tell you what. You can post all you want. In fact, you can even give me this, “You haven’t answered my question crap” which I clearly have(and by the way, those answers have won me matches against good ryu’s using characters like Gouken and even Dan. Fucking Dan.) But if you want to keep on touting. Go ahead. But you don’t even have to balls to prove to me about how so called “brain dead easy” it is to play Ryu(lol). Bullshit IMO. I proved my points. Thank you for proving mine out.
Lates kiddies.
I meant that in regards to invincibility frames. I phrased it incorrectly. Apologies. I meant that by adding less invincibility frames to a shoryuken on startup and even active frames… shoryu’s will get stuffed more often than not.
Which really just sounds comical. It sounds like I’m not going to back my shit up.
"Lol unless you join the ryu army it doesn’t matter how easily you can prove something is broken, im not listening lalala"
No.
In 2006 was a 5 frame startup death like you said it was? Was hondas headbutt elite like ryus SRK back then? I know one thing for sure, flashkick was better so your head wasn’t up your ass for that one. No idea how ryu defense is bad hey? Great cos i had no idea either, way to back up what you’re saying.
Yea buddy, ryu’s only option for defense is SRK, and poor sagats uppercut starts up even slower so his defense must be even worse…wtf are you smoking? Hell if someone gets too friendly with you upclose you can just use EX hurricane and noone can punish you because it’s -1 on block, and if he tried to attack you it’s free ultra. If he’s as bad as you try to act like he is why is he so amazingly popular with so many people taking advantage of what i’m talking about?
Here’s one, who has better defense than ryu? I can use your logic to make it look like they are so poor and defenseless.
**I meant that in regards to invincibility frames. I phrased it incorrectly. Apologies. **
Noone said a damn thing about invincibility frames so apologize for being too dumb to understand what you responded to.
Uh no. Not gonna apologize. And I never said join the Ryu army. I said if what you’re saying is so true, you should be able to prove it no problem. If playing him is so brain dead, it should be no problem for you to enter one tournament and win no contest with Ryu.
And btw, I was also addressing a few other posts I’d missed when I made the SRK comment. You have no idea what broken is. Go play third strike and come back and tell me Ryu is more broken than Chun Li… or even AS broken as chun li.
Anyway. I’m done. For real this time. I’m going to go do something productive like actually play sf4.
Not to interrupt your debate, but Gouken vs. Ryu is equivalent to Dan vs. Ryu? On paper Ryu has the close game advantage but after you read the opponents mix-up tricks, it’s pretty even.
there are a lot of people at the gouki/akuma forums that think he’s pretty well balanced. takes dmg horribly, but gives it out well. personally, i think he’s pretty close, but i also don’t think he’s a good model for other characters to be based off of where as ryu is just the all-around “i got it without having too much”.
well, i can see how edma shuts down fa with rd. it’s the same as doing it from an fa’ed attack (like gouki’s sweep) and following up with rd (well, not the same per se, but you get the idea, it takes away from fa). but really, i think most players will know what not to do to get hit by rd. even in higher level play the only time you really see it get used is in really particular situations. it’s always a threat, but it’s pretty specific.
You have a good point. To be honest, I do think Akuma is fairly well balanced, and I also think this game is VERY well balanced. So when people say shit like so and so character is broken, their being idiots. People who say Sagat is “broken” obviously haven’t played 3s or ST. I just don’t think Akuma represents perfect balance in the game. I used to think Akuma needed to be buffed and then an Akuma player told me straight up how stupid that was.
I don’t think Gouken and Dan are both equivalent against Ryu. You misunderstood. I think both are disadvantageous to ryu, but Gouken is only slightly. Dan is a 7-3, which to be fair, is still better than Ryu vs. Chun in 3s. But then again Dan is Dan. Gouken doesn’t have the fireball advantage, and c.MK is a legitimate threat. His combo potential isn’t perfect, but then again-- if you can play the prediction game with them you can catch them on their shit. I still think Ryu has the slight advantage, but only slight. Good Gouken’s can mix up their shit pretty well. Every match in this game is a toss up when two good people play. It’s all about mental endurance IMO, and skill.
See I like talking with you people. You’re intelligent.
well, for one thing, i wouldn’t necessarily use other games for examples of why characters in this game are, or aren’t, this or that, but i see what you’re getting at. i don’t think sagat is broken, but i’d say he definitely needs to get toned down a bit. a little here, a little there, and i’d say that’s about right. the fact that he doesn’t have a bad matchup, and only 3 matchups where it’s even, says a lot :lol:.
about dan and gouken, i can only imagine you were talking to someone else, but since you’re on the subject of gouken, i’ll just say this: he pisses me off. he should have been so much better than he is. you can play him well, but you have to have the ability of a saint to do it consistently. even then that’s not always enough.
If playing him is so brain dead, it should be no problem for you to enter one tournament and win no contest with Ryu.
WHy waste time doing that? There are already soooooo many ryus winning tournies and anyone who wants can go to practice and see how amazingly hard his combos are to perform…do you get that?
And btw, I was also addressing a few other posts I’d missed when I made the SRK comment. You have no idea what broken is. Go play third strike and come back and tell me Ryu is more broken than Chun Li… or even AS broken as chun li.
Who said he was broken as 3S chun-li? Why not try responding to what i’m actually saying instead of making things up and looking like an ass later? In this game, what he has is comparitively is broken because he’s got no downside to what he does and only an upside. It’s a well balanced game sure but as i said before when it went over your head, the imbalance is independent of player skill
If we make it so that EX hurricane is -6 on block, or SRK has a 4 frame startup, or sweep has a 6 frame startup,or his super is actually in the minuses on block, or air hurricane maybe 13 on recovery then you’re not even going to notice because you had apparently no idea this existed in the first place, so why cry?
**9272 needs to learn to click the quote button and the game better. **
Clicking the quote button is what made arguments like “omg hondas headbutt auto-corrects so it’s just as bad as SRK” so intelligent.
Yes. Because A Ryu won Tokido right? And Activegamers-- and there was TONS of Ryu’s all over seasons beatings top 8, correct? And at Evo? I mean out of top 8 HALF of the PLAYERS had to be playing Ryu? Amirite?
You don’t know what a broken character is buddy. You obviously haven’t played this game nearly as along, nor other street fighter games, and even if you have-- You’re the one who looks like an idiot right now.
You’re even going as far to give me shit like I’m not reading what you’re saying, yet you’re quoting shit as If I really said “Oh yeah, Honda’s headbutt is JUST AS BAD AS SRK!” without reading the context of what I even said in the post.
There’s no imbalance. If there was, Ryu’s would be winning a lot more, and he’s not. There are videos on the internet everywhere of top level Ryu’s getting scraped, and if you want to go and tell me their not playing him right or whatever, go ahead. But frame data really doesn’t mean shit compared to mind games in a tournament setting. And even by Frame data standards-- why do you see top level Ryu’s getting stuffed by shit like Balrog’s standing RH, and Guile’s forward fierce? Or Chun Li’s c.mp? If Frame Data was as Jesus as you’re describing it then it would be more important?
I’ve been playing these games for 3 years. I know this shit. It’s basic, I learned it before my first evo at a game with a character who WAS considered imba by everyone. Ryu is nowhere near Imba. And if he was, it would have been pretty easy for Daigo to win Tokido, the Japanese Nats, Valle to win Activegamers, and Choi would have beaten Combofiend at Activegamers too.
Am I missing something? Because pretty much your entire argument has been that frame data states Ryu is Imba-- and I’m saying Frame Data in a tournament setting really doesn’t matter when the other player is mindgaming you… which is how Street Fighter has ALWAYS been played. Also, the Headbutt comment I made was about Auto Correct. You had made some stupid comment about how Ryu’s dp was so blatantly easy to autocorrect, yet even I can fucking stuff that shit easy with a well timed crossup. And then you Also said that Ryu’s DP can just be spammed during block strings and combos and that he gets a free ultra out of it, and I countered that you can do that with most reversals in other games as well. I also said that that’s what the Shoryuken is somewhat meant for-- to punish shit like missing combos as well as predictibility… and that if you know your opponent is mashing that shit. Just stop your combo early, and they’ll whiff the SRK. Punish time. It’s simple. I stated his downsides were his predictability, and his lack of excelling at either Offense or Defense, which is the main strength of such characters like Bison or E.Honda respectively. Both those characters outclass Ryu at Offense(For Bison) and Defense(For Honda. It’s a pain in the ASS to get the lead back when Ryu is down in health.) This is a big deal, because it means Ryu has to CONSTANTLY mix it up against other characters-- as they always have a way in if the Ryu gets predictable… which means they can just jump over a mid range fireball, tap focus a fireball into a poke, Outfootsie him, safe jump and pretty much everything else. It’s a lot easier for a Ryu to get predictable than any other character in the game. That’s his glaring weakness, is his predictability. His strength is what? Linking his ultra, super and c.mk? Random Jab uppercuts? EVERYBODY, has away around those to do damage. EVERY character. Including Dan. If you have a way to counter it, an easy way(which their always is) then it isn’t Imba. It really isn’t.
^^There. Ive addressed you’re points and every counter argument I’ve made in PREVIOUS POSTS. So please don’t tell me I haven’t been listening. All you’ve been doing is responding with “This concept obviously went over your head and you didn’t answer me.” which is just fucking stupid, because everything you’ve been saying is in that last paragraph. If I missed anything, let me know.
And If I didn’t, you’re still wrong-- because Ryu’s would have won Tokido, ActiveGamers, and GodsGarden if they were so OP and broken. But we lost. To characters like Dhalsim, Rufus(Who has a 4-6 matchup to Ryu), And Viper(who by the way, has terrible normals compared to Ryu.)
So I simply asked, that if Ryu is so OP as you say, you pick him up for one tournament and show us what we’ve all been missing, because tournament results and play seem to say otherwise.
The headbutt argument was about auto-correct…really? No shit, i already said that you can’t compare moves that are similar in one regard and not in any other…who cares if hondas headbutt auto-corrects but he has balls anti-air defense otherwise? It starts up 3 times as slow? Maybe that’s why noone mentions that? Read and comprehend the first time and i won’t need to repeat myself.
You said that lp shoryu was easy to stuff too, and you said that slightly more startup would make it easy to stuff, so forgive me if i don’t believe a damn thing you say about how bad the move is. Are their shortcuts in other games combined with a huge reversal window? That’s always happened in streetfighter right? Wrong.
He DOES excel at both offense and defense!! What’s he so bad at exactly? Bison…doesn’t outclass ryu at offense…wtf. How does honda really outclass ryu in defense? It’s such a pain in the ass for HONDA to get in…it’s so damn well known that he has trouble with projectile characters how the fuck could that be a bad match for ryu? Even guile in his multiple nerf state is considered a bad match for honda…but ryu has trouble with honda defense??? LOL
Ryu has shitloads of options in this game, if his weakness is predictability you can blame that on the ryu army and not the actual character. Come on, poke characters have more options that ryu, who has both exceptional pokes and crazy combos? Really? By the way there wouldn’t be a ryu army if he wasn’t so effective…
Ryu wins the second most tournies out of any character besides sagat last i checked, and there’s that article about how capcom admitted they overpowered sagat, and yet ryu has no disadvantages against him and can outfootsy and outmove him…hmm. If he’s not imbalanced because of the frame data, who exactly is overpowered in this game? There’s no reason anybody should be toned down if you can look at ryu and cover your eyes.
Count the amount of jumpins made by ryu as opposed to successful jumpins made by honda. Sure, auto-correct headbutt works a bunch of times, but clearly it’s not that much of a threat if jumpins continuously happened. It’s even baited like i said a few times because it has about 3 times the amount of startup that SRK has.
It’s a balanced game so he doesn’t run away with it, but they sure as hell shouldn’t use ryu for a model of everyone else or it’ll be turtle fest, and like i said there’s not a real justification to change anyone else for the worse
**Really though, 9272, you’re raging a little too hard. **
Have you ever even played Alex Valle? I have, and he’s not just getting free jump ins because he’s ryu… Watch him play Fei Long or even Ken. He gets just as many jump in’s, if not more. He’s Catching Honda at moments where he doesn’t expect it. I asked him the same thing and that’s what he told me.
And Bison doesn’t outclass Ryu at offense? Really? Free light scissors all day. fast ass dashing? Have you played AndyOCR, or even Sanchez? Honda’s defense is better than Ryu’s, are you kidding me? You must either be playing shitty Honda’s if it’s so easy for you to win with Ryu. What, Jump ins? All Honda has to do is space correctly and jump Fierce. Yeah, it’s a bitch to get in, but when Honda has the lead it’s a BITCH to take it from him.
Those two videos are examples of people being outplayed. I could link you Akimo videos where he’s wrecked Daigo, but you obviously ignored those.Sorry dude, but you really are new to this game, or don’t have enough knowledge on this matter. You’re relying too much on frame Data and for some odd reason think Ryu can beat any character by just jerking off. Argue all you want but honestly you just told me, a ryu player, that Bison has better offensive tools than Ryu when I’ve faced 3 of the best Bison’s in so cal, who have all not only proven, but told me otherwise. And EVEN THEN, it relies on the player. So please shut up. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
**
Have you ever even played Alex Valle? I have, and he’s not just getting free jump ins because he’s ryu… Watch him play Fei Long or even Ken. He gets just as many jump in’s, if not more.**
Maybe it’s because honda doesn’t have exceptional anti-air defense…like i said…which was the point of linking the video.
Exactly what “frame data” is it that you keep referring to? Be more specific. It kinda sounds like you just like using the words “frame data” because you think it makes you sound like you know what you’re talking about. It doesn’t.
And Bison doesn’t outclass Ryu at offense? Really? Free light scissors all day.
Umm…no lol. See because i know the frame data, bison can’t just spam moves on me for free. Bisons lk scissors starts up in 10 frames, so if he tries to spam it on you and you have a move that starts up faster than that goodluck to him, it’s not like ryu doesn’t have any moves that start up quickly…wow.
That’s independent of player skill buddy, or maybe you can show me a high level match where a bison player spams lk scissors all day since it’s “free”? You sure you don’t want to edit your post again? Bison has great pokes yea, but ryu has great pokes and great combos and a great super and an easy ultra and better defense…yea ryu wins. Maybe you ought to go to the bison forum and inform them of how superior bisons offense is compared to ryus? Noone seems to know that there.
I think being unable to safejump ryu is kind of silly.
Ken has it off a fairly low priority fierce srk that can’t link to full ultra, but ryu has it on every one.
Ryu has historically been safe jumpable, and he is pretty strong in this game, maybe it could be removed with like 1 more startup frame per srk, and one more unhittable frame to not be a total loss
