I think this crap with c .mk avoiding so much shit isn’t exactly meant to be and was missed by Capcom. Hopefully they fix his hitboxes in the next version.
It does have godly range as well.
Lots of ex moves are really punishable, EX DP , ex headstomp, ex greenhand ect. If it is only -5 on block it shouldnt push the opponent away at all like it does. It probably should be more like -6,-7 on block anyway.
C.MK dodging stuff does do some interesting stuff in some matches (Sagat Tiger Knee/Dictator Skull Diver), but I wonder if Capcom feels those matches are more robust for changing the properties of those moves or the cr. MK.
Oh yeah, I really enjoyed meeting all the SRK people that I met…sorry we missed each other, hopefully next time! I’ll be at Aerial Rave too.
And to answer your question, the only character I know of who has that is Boxer…He can combo into his sweep off some good and very simple shit.
But that is boxer’s whole game: Devastating overpowered combos off the most simple setups ever. Safe three frame jab combos into ultra on a grounded opponent without meter or a tight link? Seriously capcom?
No wonder all you heard at SB4 was “NoooOOO ESSCCAAPPE!” and “HEHEHEHHEHE”…cause EVERYONE was playing boxer.
I spent an HOUR in training mode with him the other night just to see if his shit is as easy as it looks and its EASIER. c.jabx2 > c.short > fierce headbutt > Ultra is so easy its stupid…but Boxer’s whole game revolves around that.
If you really want to talk about shit that makes no sense…boxer is top of the list:
Stand fierce = GDLK universal anti air.
Headbutt = GDLK anti air + combo into super or ultra for free even on grounded opponents.
Sweep = KILLER range and like a 5-6 frame startup and its safe on block 99% of the time.
EX armor for EVERYTHING.
His jab beats everything and recovers so fast that it allows him to EASILY link damn near everything after it.
His most effective and devastating combos are all so easy a beginner can pull them off.
Throw range = top notch.
Shit is crazy.
Stand fierce = GDLK universal anti air.
You mean crouch fierce right? Ryu’s starts up 3 frames faster, last 3 frames longer and only has a damage disadvantage of 10, it’s the better anti-air here and it’s something that clearly doesn’t need to be this way. It can also combo into super for free on grounded opponents, and the super itself is ridiculous in terms of utility,startup,range,speed, and most notoriously recovery which leaves him at a +11 frame advantage on block as opposed to boxers -14
His headbutt can be beat by low attacks,making his wakeup game weaker so i would say that’s balanced. It also doesn’t have a reliable auto-correction leaving balrog vulnerable to crossups and can’t be mashed unlike SRK, it’s also a charge move and the startup of even the lightest version is nearly 3 times the startup of ryus SRK.
Ryu’s sweep has faster startup, but i don’t see a problem with that really except for the fact that he can combo it from jabs unlike balrog, boxers sweep has better recovery however, not sure that a boxer should have such a good sweep? shrugs. In practice mode i can hit ryus leg with boxers hand, and the move still doesn’t connect,similar to ryu’s sweep.
Their crouching jabs are both 3 frame startups, but boxer has a 2 frame advantage on recovery and block while having a 10 point damage disadvantage which doesn’t make alot of sense. I think boxer should have a better jab than ryu, but toning down the advantage on block wouldn’t hurt. Ofcourse, ryu can also combo the aforementioned sweep off of this unlike balrog, and also the super, and it’s crazy easy to do as it seems as it was BUILT for mashers. He can set up crossup confusion off the knockdown unlike balrog who has no crossup at all.
I can have my entire hand through ryus head without throwing him with boxer,ryus throw will connect as soon as you can touch your opponents shirt apparently. Not sure how i should be testing range honestly but i think it makes sense on principle
The tradeoff for his EX armor is that when he’s not using them he’s quite vulnerable to FA’s
Don’t forget his ridiculous air normals.
Yeah, the hitbox on J.roundhouse is CRAZY good.
i dont main ryu in this game… but i mained him in almost every other sf game that i’ve played… and i also use him quite a bit on 4 as hes like my 3rd or 4th…
his cr.mk is RIDICULOUSLY overpowered on 4… kens is even better but alot less frustrating …cause its ken…
it is probably the best OVERALL poke in the game when one considers the range, cancelability, damage options it opens up, speed on wiff, and hits low.
giefs standing mp can maybe get a nod as well but it doesnt hit low and cant be cancelled.
chuns sweep is focus bait and easily destroyed by jumpins.
its not so much that shoto cr.mk is that bad cause it most certainly isnt at all…the thing is that ryu has so many other things that a godlike poke like his cr.mk is just a little too much… he really has NO WEAKNESSES in 4.
and a main reason for that is that he cant be bullied by other characters pokes cause of his cr.mk.
i dont want them to nerf ryus cr.mk at all.
i want them to give other characters pokes that staright up outclass it like how it was in st and previous streetfighters.
-dime
Dime, AMEN!!!
Its crazy that chun’s c.forward is weak shit compared to Ryu’s…especially considering what it used to be…and how much rock solid shit Ryu has.
I argee with you on SWEEPS. Standing Fierce not so much. Sweep is really gay since it sets up for big damage opportunity/mixup. Being able to hit confirm into a sweep is mega gay ;(
Fuck, some of you people want to remove the ability to link into HP/HK for basic BnBs (Because it’s SO OP for say, Dictator and Blanka), and yet you want this game to be less turtle friendly at the same time? Almost as if you want the fucking rounds in this game to be even longer…
His c.HP is a good AA, yes. His HB, however, is not. It has an extremely slow startup, and basically works like Honda’s LP HB except that it isn’t safe on block in the least bit. His c.HK actually has a 8 frame startup, and outside of CH he can only link it off of s.LP (How many Boxers do you ever see use this?). It’s just as much focus bait as Chun’s is (Which is also usually safe on block, iirc). The EX Dash Punches are almost always safe on block, yes, but they don’t get him out of mixups for free, and if the Boxer is stupid enough to throw them out carelessly you can (Or should) throw him out of them on reaction. His jabs beat every other normal in close range, yes, but consistently lose to certain, properly spaced pokes (This depends on which character you’re using). He may have a reliable way to combo into ultra, but it generally only adds 150 damage or so. The bigger issue is that none of the other charge characters (And many motion characters) don’t have solid ways to land/combo into them. Boxer is solid, but he’s definitely not on the level of Akuma, Ryu, Sagat, Zangief or Rufus in that there’s very few match-ups that he dominates. In my humble opinion, other characters should be brought to his (And Ryu’s) level, not the other way around.
No we just dont want the game looking like SFA1. Granted it’s only Ryu & Rog that can really make it look like that with their jab into anything chain looking links but still…
I have no problem w/ his EX moves or specials or throw range, but I’d love to see Rog’s jab and/or sweep get nerfed.
No offense to Rog players but it makes him too scrub-friendly/easy mode. It doesnt make much sense that I have to play super smart w/ Vega or perform high execution combos w/ Viper to be competitive, while Rog can rely on mashing jab and execution my grandmother could pull off.
**Nerfing sweep? Yes.
Nefring jab?
No**
No jab nerf? Despite the fact that it leaves you + so many frames on hit that you can link [media=youtube]ytwGlA5aW0A"[/media] on it?
His jab should still hit in three frames, but capcom should add a frame or two of recovery.
This would still make his jab able to interrupt damn near anything else in the game, but it would make his jab links tighter, and it would prevent mindless jab spam.
Thoughts?
**
thinks about it
You have a point…**
Sounds like a plan. As long as he still has the fastest jab in the game I’m cool.
Balrog is fine the way he is, leave him alone… ryu has 3000 more ways into connecting his ultra + insane bnb into ultra hit confirm l.sh combos but yet no one wants to nerf Ryu. wow. :wtf: Why do i get the feeling that the majority of people that is saying to nerf Balrog might be coming from Ryu players themselves that might be getting beat a little to much by rog players?
Because you’re looking at the ease of landing an ultra as the basis of determining whether or not a character is balanced, in need of buffs, or deserving of nerfs?
rog doesn’t have the fastest jab in the game. ryu’s is just as fast (3), and in fact most characters seem to have a 3 frame crouching normal. the issue is that it’s got a huge hitbox and great frames on block and hit.