People from the Rose community have collected suggestions to help you in buffing Rose in the right direction. The list might end up being long but the point isn’t to give everything to her but to have an idea of what to buff.
Rose’s Normal moves.
Rose’s normals are pretty good. Still, some moves could get some buffs:
Neutral Jumping Fierce: the hitbox could be extended to her scarf.
Crouching RoundHouse: Revert back is her cr.HK to her vanilla incarnation. It has slow startup and cannot be comboed into anything so it was fine the way it was before.
Rose focus attacks: A lot of people in the Rose community thinks that Rose’s Focus Attacks hitbox should be extended to the end of the scarf and being able to have less start up on level 2 focus attack (17+12 instead of 17+14)
Some people liked how her normals were in the alpha series so tweaking a little bit with the frame data could help her.
Rose’s Special moves.
Soul Sparks: This move is fairly good but some people think that the move has too much recovery on the LP soul spark and too much startup on the MK/HP version of the move. While his main purpose is not to be use offensively, she is wide open to a counter when someone anticipate it. The LP version of the move could have a bit of less recovery frames and the MP/HP could have their startup reduced. Like this she will at least be able to defend herself in some situations.
Soul Spirals: It was suggested that this move gets a damage buff for MK (100->110 or 120), HK (100->120 or 130) and EX (100->110 or 120) versions of soul spirals. Also, we have known that Rose doesn’t have a true reversal and this for the past 2 years. By having the lowest damage output of the game, below average health and not-so-good offense, she could at least have a way to counter her opponents on wake up. 2 suggestions have been addressed to this matter: You could either:
Add 2 more invincibility frames to her EX spiral (going from 11 to 13 frames of invincibility)
or
Make it hit earlier during the invulnerable frames so it can be used as a proper reversal.
The move simply needs to be reworked and tested if it’s ever going to be usable as a reversal and if you are willing to spend the time on it, removing the gap between the invulnerable and active frames is the place to start.
Soul Reflects: The arrangement made on soul reflect really helped Rose for her matches. But still, it is also a move Rose has to discard from her arsenal against non-projectile characters. The extra combo ability was nice but not really useful. Here are some suggestions to upgrade the move:
LP Soul Reflect: Perfect the way it is
MP Soul Reflect: hitbox for projectile stays same / hitbox vs opponents increased horizontally so its easier to hit them and push them back
HP Soul Reflect: it can either be:
hitbox for projectile stays same /hitbox vs opponents increased upward and slighty decreased her hittable
box where her scarf is so its easier to Anti-Air them
or
hp reflect FADC U1 for easy comeback ability
EX Soul Reflect: This is the most useless special move Rose had for the past 2 years. It’s been notice that Gen’s EX Jyasen has different button combinations to allow different movement and damage. Using different button combination could open a lot of variety for Rose’s EX soul reflect:
LP + MP: opponent goes upward, can combo into Soul Satellite and Soul throw. 3 invulnerable frames on startup. Reflect projectiles diagonally with 5% more damage and speed
MP + HP: opponent wall bounce, can combo in Soul Spiral, Soul Satellite. Reflects projectiles horizontally with 10% more damage and 5% more speed.
LP + HP: travels across screen + untechable knockdown, faster recovery from the 3 EX Soul Reflect versions. Reflect projectiles horizontally with 5% more damage and speed.
Soul Throw: While the range of the move was increased, the only way to properly use this move is to combo it with a Soul Reflect. Otherwise you literally have to predict your opponents actions because since this Anti-Air has no invincibility, it gets stuffed by most attacks of the opponent. It’s less risky to use crouching fierce as an Anti-Air. The move could be a bit better if you extend the grab box more or if you remove some hittable box ? As for the EX Soul Throw, it could be better if you decreased the start up on the move to have an answer for people that jumps on her after they knock her down.
Alpha Counter: Considering that Rose has little defensive options, a lot of people were suggesting to bring her alpha counter back as her alternate if making ex spiral into a true reversal was out of the question. LP could be used to switch place with the character and make her in frame advantage (+5 or +6 ?), MP could make Rose counter with a crouching RH and HP could make her counter her opponent with HP reflect to allow a combo. If developpers think the move would be too powerful, maybe alterating the damage by giving it gray damage or make it usable by using one EX bar could be done. But the main purpose for this move would be to use it as a defensive and allow Rose to “breathe” more on wake up. So attacks with armor break, projectiles and ultras have to be taken into consideration.
feel free to asked about stuff or say: WTF DONT ASK FOR THIS! ITS STUPID or w/e lolEnglish is also the language I DONT talk the most so any grammatical corrections could be useful too hahaha**
Refelect doesn’t need anything armor related. Not supposed to be a wakeup tool.
All this shit wouldn’t be a discussion if capcom literally just helped out ex drill. We don’t need substitute moves for a shitty wakeup when ex drill can be a viable reversal and still be ass.
Also super was the most balanced of the incarnations. not saying much.
I’m pretty sure that even if EX drill was fixed some people would still complain about something else. It always has been something like this since vanilla / games that could get patched.
Maybe we are all doing this for nothing and Capcom already found the solution for Rose. But we are left with literally no news so I would rather send this message letting know to Capcom that there are some people that cares for Rose than just hoping for the better and for the worst and do nothing
And yeah @zangief I must say…its kinda weird to have a ex reflect with armor to be used on wake up
In reality it doesnt really matter WHAT move helps her defense, as long as she gets something good. Kinda silly to keep arguing against others ideas when defensively they can serve the exact same purpose.
Keep in mind Capcom may not want to change certain moves for whatever reason, so logically itd be best to list multiple fixes for the same problem to increase the chance of finding common ground with the devs.
Well most of the bitching has stemmed from the fact Capcom really hasn’t touched Rose even from Vanilla to Super. They basically gave her U2 as a “here’s your reversal”, gave her a soul throw combo that requires meter (like mostly anything Rose does in this game) and a few other pointless/useless tweaks that doesn’t solve the fact that she doesn’t have a viable wakeup outside of blocking.
But again, this would be fine if Rose actually excelled in something else. She’s pretty much a jack of trade that doesn’t have defense. She has normals, but they get beat by characters with better normals. Specials have potential, but then you have to waste meter for a simple BnB. U2 was nice, but then people complained like the new generation does. U1 doesn’t even combo off a juggle. Really Capcom? You can’t even bait a jump in with U1 like it’s supposed to 100% of the time. Not only that, fireballs beat it if you’re not directly next to the opponent being a psychic. She’s been riddled with holes or unpolished things from the inclusion. While most of the home only Vanilla characters got tweaks to help them out, Rose is still here…struggling. Maybe with Gen? I don’t play Gen at all to know outside of people crying over MK>Hands.
Here, like , yeah, I try to argue on both sides for Rose is good and not good to see how you guys answer back (and sometimes you guys have the dumbest comeback arguments, lol)…
But she isn’t good, I know, I’m not dumb lol. She needs a wake up move that’s reliable, but otherwise, nothing else is needed. Her normals are good and have one of the best properties of normals there.
Rose’s normals have better properties than Chun’s all in all.
Chun has better footsies, Rose has better properties on her normals for frame traps. Who has a normal that’s in air, anti throw, and +0 on block? like wtf, and it’s getting buffed
Oh yeah, and Rose has a decent anti-air normals, not many other footsie-based characters have one as good as hers. >>>
And even then, Rose can compete with Chun footsies to make that an even, footsies based match up.
I would love to see something like that on Ex reflect, but just to be more fair ( i mean more balanced)
lp + mp: invulnerable frame, but no combo possibility, punisable on block
mp + hp: can combo, no untechable ( like you said)
lp + hp: send far away, untechable.( like you said)
I see that some ppl have asked for a damage buff on rose’s spirals, but a lot of ppl have used low damage numbers. 110-120 from the range of light to heavy and I don’t think that ppl have taken the damage scale in account if you hit a basic bnb withh these numbers your damage will only increase by 5-10 damage where as giving a larger range on spiral damage wold give a damage increase between 7-20 damage. These are number that I got from damage values I had choosen for spiral 110,125,135 and feel these would be significant but not over powering and give rose at least average damage output.
I would like to see Rose with some more damage on the spirals and a better focus attack since it would make her offence much more scary.They should also Improve the damage on U2 and maybe increase U1 start up and nerf the damage a bit. If Capcom give her this in addition to the buffs already announced already then I think she would be perfect.
