I’ve been having a problem, and it’s an embarrassing one.
Flowchart Ken.
For some reason I have a hard time beating flowchart Ken’s. I like to think it’s more out of shock that people actually do it, and less my skill level. But that’s pride talking.
Anyway, I took a video of a match against a random flowchart Ken.
[media=youtube]TVhL1Z1Mzkw[/media]
I know I’m not very good, and I’m not asking for overall gameplay tips. I’m still practicing combos and getting the basics down tight in training. But if someone could watch that video and tell me what I should have done to stop flowchart Ken specifically, I’d appreciate it.
EDIT: Oh and before anyone says it: I know I did stupid stuff like jump into fireballs and throw out random Ultras. I is dumb sometimes.
EDIT2: I wasn’t sure if I should put this in the Strategy and Matchups thread or in here, since I also included a Match video. Sorry if I chose incorrectly.
whenever you get an FA crumble, remember to dash forward, then combo or throw ifyou’re not comfortable
work on a bnb combo like c.hp xx h.dp, or my favorite c.hp, lk tatsu, c.lk, ex tatsu, (variable). start doing that instead of throws when you block ken’s dp.
from my experience within the first 10 seconds of the round you’ll know if its a dp happy ken or not. if it is a dp happy ken, scale down your link combos and start baiting the dp. like you threw out two c.lk’s, then block and wait for the dp. punish, rinse and repeat.
also. you kept breaking off your advance, you’d lk him in the air, and then run away. you’re at a disadvantage when you do that, because then you have to contend with his fbs, and risk jumping into them like you did. try sitting at mid-screen. if it’s a flow-chart ken, he’ll def try to jump in on you, that’s when you can c.hp him comfortably.
The most important thing is to not play his game. a couple weeks ago I was having a lot of trouble against flowcharting shotos. I still do from time to time, but thats more a /v/ fueled Ken Fighter 4 rage than anything. You just have to calm down, and just turtle until he is off balance to go on the offensive. Once he gets tired of chipping fireballs, or playing footsies and goes on an offensive you can score some easy LShunpu combos. Also, one thing I’ve noticed is if they are reflexive flowcharters, if you try to crossover the EX Shunpu with LK or even just try to reset with HP or HK, they may EX SRK. IF not, you’ll easily be able to get a reset, and dizzy them, then they’re done.
Ashwilliams: You said you don’t want overall gameplay tips, but your overall gameplay is the reason you’re losing. Think about it - flowchart Ken gameplay is, by definition, bad gameplay. There’s nothing special about it; there’s no trick to it - to win you just have to play better than you were playing, and doing so will help you in all of your matchups, not just matches against Ken.
So, to give some advice on what you could be doing better:
You were afraid to approach Ken on the ground, so you tried to get close via the air (including a lot of air tatsus), and you left yourself open to punishment. You’ve gotta get comfortable getting around fireballs in ways that don’t leave you open. FADCing a fireball should be second nature. Also use more neutral jumps and smart forward jumps that don’t leave you open.
When you got within striking range of Ken, all I could hear was you mashing buttons. Learn your combos and don’t button mash, ESPECIALLY if your opponent is reversal happy. If I were in your situation where I couldn’t do combos and knew a DP was coming, I would have only done the attacks I knew I had time for (e.g. 2 jabs or 1 c.mk, etc.), and then waited for the DP. Then block and punish.
You’ve gotta come up with more damaging punishment options, for when the other guy whiffs a move or crumples. Even HP, sho would be infinitely better than throwing, because you rack up that much more damage each time. Remember, Sakura does damage via combos, so it’s simply going to hurt your game more than another character if you can’t do them.
yeah ash williams, learn some simple combos
i just heard you spamming buttons in the hope of a combo 9rather than anything precise
also, after you learn basic combos, you can bait flowchart kens to do srk, then punish them every single time, easy win
also, keep the pressure on him, it’ll force him to whiff srk’s
staying away is a bad idea, and you backing away when hes up against the corner relieves him of pressure - making him feel much more at ease (especially with his superior fireball game)
Watching a lot of these videos, there are a great variety of play with sakura. Everyone has different tendencies and playstyles which all work for them, its pretty cool.
Just seems ash isn’t using all of her moves to their fullest potential. Use your EX otoshi as soon as he throws a fireball, after about 3 or 4 times he’s caught with this he won’t be retreating and throwing fireballs anymore. Also this brings you right in his face, even if he blocks it you are still right up close again. And you don’t take any advantage from whiffed dragon punches at all. Once he whiffs a dragon punch and you break out a nice little combo or juggle he won’t be dragon punching anymore.
Plain and simple, if you take away flow chart kens major moves they are pretty much a sitting duck and the game is all on you.
My earlier post was right before heading to work, so I didn’t get a chance to answer this. But now I have time!
I just wanted to say I hope I didn’t come off as arrogant or anything when I said I didn’t want overall gameplay tips. I know my play isn’t very good/ There’s just alot of overall advice on the forums, so I was trying to save people from the hassle of repeating that info.
Once again, thanks a ton, hope I didn’t seem like an egotist.
I really recommend neutral jump RH, once you can force ken into a pattern of low blocking.
On flowchart ken’s I usually pressure with some wimpy chain strings to get them blocking low like cr LK x3. They’ll almost always try and SRK you at the end, with enough time for you to block. After a couple blocked -> punished SRKs, the neutral jump starts really screwing with their head.
See if you can master
jump straight up and throw out RH late on the way down -> cr HP ->ex tatsu -> otoshi.
Sometimes you can even stuff an SRK with the RH on the way down from a jump.
Who’s got a video example of the most ridiculously good Sakura play? Honest question. I know it’s really hard to quantify good, because of everything being completely situational, but still give it a try.
mm this is for ash…
even though people have probably helped already…
i noticed when you get an opening when he does a fierce shoryu or ex and you block it, you just grabbed him. don’t do that! try a good damage dealing combo that will knock him down or something.
also, when fighting flowcharts like that, don’t do any crazy combos that require links or anything, becuase if you mess up you’ll get a shoryu right to the face. do the fast, easy stuff. cr. fierce shoryu, cr fierce tatsu.
also don’t back out. makes it harder for you to get in. stay in his face, but stay smart about it. block his random crap and punish it.
i guess another thing is to try not to hit the buttons a lot of times to get a move to come out, because it’s just not as consistent and it’s just blah.
[media=youtube]qwkuEF9owL0&fmt=18[/media]. After losing to a few other Blankas earlier tonight, smacking one down for that much and getting a replay out of it equals fun.
Oddly enough, it says “G3 CHAMPIONSHIP FINAL BATTLE” despite both of us being in G2-D.
That dash -> jab -> Dash mixup is really, really interesting. What you can do out of the EX tatsu, is walk up, s.lp, and then dash and get behind them. Once they catch on, what you can do is either walk forward slightly less before the s.lp, OR delay your dash, and you’ll end up in front of them.
With the dash -> s.lp -> dash, you can also delay the second dash.
Is there any reason c.lp is used over s.lp? Both work…
