Gonna have to try this buffering inbetween jabs business. Maybe it is practical if it’s trained enough. =o
You can dash through the start up of Guiles U2.
I had Guile cornered and knocked down next to me and I was moving back and forth quickly looking for a Kara throw, when he did wake up U2, and I panicked and did dash forward SRK and it worked lol. Was able to replicate this in training mode. The spacing is roughly 1/4th screen Im playing on a crt though and some of the screen gets cut off
Does kara focusing sonicbooms ever leave Ken at an advantage?
I’d say yes for the sonic booms he does in your face. And if you expect one of his pokes to come out and kara-focus it, you’ll be in good range to kara-throw or maybe even start a combo with cr.lk
Thanks. Also, is it possible to combo into kara-DP?
[media=youtube]niRj3_S_Vi8&feature=sub]YouTube - Playerjun52 [Ken] vs jyobin [Ryu[/media]
at 0:44 he inputs kara DP after a combo, but maybe DP has priority over f.MK hence DP came out?
yes u can
Guys did you know that Lk tatsu> FADC is +3 on hit :D? More combo possibility ! I might make a ken combo exhibition part 2 soon :D!
Yeah I noticed that, specifically with the first hit the knee portion of lk tatsu. I thought it’d be interesting to use during frame traps or use it like a delayed uppercut to fuck with crouch techers.
Nice find GTF.
I just wanted to throw a question out here guys.
Obviously, after Ken’s fierce DP, we can do a character specific safe jump. But for those characters that we can’t do the safe jump follow up on, I propose that the best strategy could be to utilise Ken’s Thunder Kick (TK) and/or Fake Thunder Kick (FTK).
Here’s my reasoning:
If you land from the fierce DP and do an immediate FTK, Ken finishes in time to do a meaty cr.lk on his opponents wake-up (even if they quick stand).
If you land from the fierce DP and wait for a tiny moment, then perform Ken’s TK, it will hit the opponent on their wake-up (if they quick stand).
The timing is just too good to be accidental and I honestly think that this is why Ken’s TK and FTK have that exact amount of start-up frames. I believe they were intended to be the preferred method of sustained pressure after a fierce DP knockdown.
I have talked about this mix-up in the past, but I was new to the forums back then and I never really followed it through with proper testing in matches, so I’d like to raise the matter again to see what people thought about it.
So if you decide to do the follow-up safe jump against your opponent after a fierce DP, they don’t really get put into any kind of guessing game. Their only choice is to block or escape (either by using meter or dashing out).
If you decide to use the TK or FTK mix-up after a fierce DP, the opponent has a lot more things to think about:
Do I block high to avoid the TK damage (which is Ken’s most damaging normal move!)
Do I block low because I think he’s gonna do a FTK
Do I attempt to tech a throw
Do I attempt a reversal
Do I backdash to remove myself from this set-up (can be option selected against).
If timed correctly, you can do a FTK and then a delayed crouch tech as well. This avoids reversals and protects against throws too (kinda like an empty jump OS tech).
I honestly think that Ken’s TK and FTK are very underused and I don’t think they need to be slept on like we do. Ken has more Overhead normals than most characters AND a fake OH too. I know his TK only has 2 active frames, but becuase the timing is almost done for you after a fierce DP, I really don’t see this as a reason to not use it.
I can imagine the situation going like this.
You open up your mix-up with the full TK. This would encourage your opponent to wake-up and block high. This is where you could switch to doing FTK into meaty cr.lk and then the combo of your choice! Then your opponent starts to backdash and you can respond with cr.lk, OS sweep. Then, just to add insult to injury, you can do the FTK follow-up into forward throw for the untechable knock down OR even do a delayed back throw. Thus avoiding the reversal and possibly setting you up for a fruity safe jump!!
Giving your opponent 5 decisions to make after a fierce DP is pretty damn intimidating no?
I guess my main suggestion is that after a fierce DP I’d like to put forward that character specific safe jumps create less of a guessing game than TK mix-ups, which can also be used against the whole cast.
What are everyones thoughts on this?
Peace,
G.
I use the tk a lot and ftk but the way you think is verydeep so how come when I see you play u don’t think that far ahead?but the setup seems legit ill try it out
I have never thought about this! Great thinking G77 :tup:.
I will add this to my Ken notes :woot:! I didn’t test it, but I know G77 is legit so I’ll test it later if FTK recovers before opponent’s reversal if he quick stand after Fierce SRK.
BTW, did you know that unblockable J.fierce can be done against sagat? I was messing around trying to replicate Wao’s forward throw > step back > cr.mk indicator > J.hp, and it turns out unblockable against sagat!
I’ll record a video and upload it tomorrow, I’ll post it in your Ken’s unblockable thread and you update first post :wgrin:.
EDIT: Also works on seth and zangief!
EDIT:I just did it on balrog too with different spacing :o!
EDIT: on gouken too! LOL ill just go post in your thread :p.
@sicx
Yeah, my theory fighter is waaay better than my actual fighter!!
I’m currently completely restripping my game down and starting from scratch to try and get rid of bad habits, improve my hit confirming skills, block confirming fierce DP’s to save on meter etc etc. In short, I’m starting a lot of stuff over again. I’m also practicing removing st.lp from my tatsu combos (at least until I get confirmation of an AE patch for 360). Unfortunately, a lot of my habits need some serious brain re-wiring so it’s taking a while.
@GTF
Yup, you can definitely get the meaty cr.lk post fierce DP, FTK set-up. The only difficult thing is that you have to be tight with your timing after you land from the fierce DP and because you have to hold the button down for the FTK, you can’t mash it. You might be able to plink it though (never tried it). To land the TK after a fierce DP, I tend to hold forwards or backwards and use this to guage the extra 2 frames or so that you need to wait in order to land the meaty TK as they rise. As soon as I see Ken enter into his walking animation, I know I’ve waited long enough to land the TK correctly.
Hope you guys can experiment with it against some good opposition and get back to me with some feedback.
I also forgot to mention that after the fierce DP, FTK, you also have time to do an immediate backdash, neutral jump, back jump or forward jump if you want to bait out a command throw, hit the instant overhead (e.g. jump back FP) or catch a teleporter for example. I wouldn’t advise any of those though against characters with DP’s because the backdash doesn’t seem to get you far enough away to avoid the reversal.
Let me know your findings guys.
Oh, did everyone see that Cammy also has a version of the unblockable jump ins that I found. I feel like my vids should have made front page now that everyone else’s have. But at least less people will know about Ken’s if they just stay here in the thread!!!
@GTF
Nice finds with the unblockable updates. The characters that I listed in my initial post were the ones that it worked on without any changes in the timings. I was fairly certain that it could be replicated on other characters with different timing, I just never got round to trying it out. It’s a long old process as I’m sure you’re aware!! Nice work though.
2 questions though:
Are you gonna video them?
Did you get the jump in mk to work on the new characters as well? Because the fierce punch can be ducked under (risky, I know), but the mk version can’t, so it’s actually much more reliable than the FP version and still has all the other pros as well.
Peace,
G.
I also forgot to add that Ken can combo from his TK if you land it as a counter hit!!! The extra 4 frames of hit stun make it +3. You can reach with both of Ken’s crouching light attacks and also you can obviously hit them with another fierce DP.
Fierce dp > CH TK > Fierce dp loop sounds like a mighty fine Ken like thing to do haha
Dr G77 delivering with the lab work once again!
This is REALLY good, I mean REALLY GOOD!
I used to always dash after fierce dp and go for meaty cr.lk > cr.lk/cr.lp OS sweep or tatsu or U2, and mix it up with late crouch techs against 3 frame dps sometimes. This is a new mixup no1 thought about before! Perfect timing for meaty cr.lk, Perfect for late cr.tech OR late stand tech as you mentioned!
And yes Plinking the FTK guarantee’s the setup, I have tried it.
You know what’s another great thing about it, is if they don’t quick stand and you already did your FTK, you can whiff cr.lk as if it would hit meaty and it will almost auto-time a safe nj.hp against fei and viper. Against sagat/cammy you have to time it later because of wake up time difference.To safe jump guile if he doesn’t quick stand, do your FTK then walk back then nj.mk. It’s impossible for ken to safe jump guile at point blank knockdown with neutral jump as far as I know. Ryu’s Light and Medium DPs can be safe jumped with nj.mp too in this same situation but this is extremely hard to do, I tried safe jumping his heavy shoryuken but i failed although I am 50% sure it is possible. But a better mixup is FTK> Whiff cr.lk > nj.heavy tatsu crossup, cannot be auto-corrected and hits ryu crouching.
Good job G77 :tup:
I will be doing serious testing on your j,mk unblockable soon =).
awwww man our ken is getting more dangerou and dangerous
Ken isn’t my main, but I do like to mess around with him occasionally. I found that if I chained the jabs together it made linking ultra 2 after standing jabx2 a lot easier.
Seriously I messed around with this for 5 minutes and I can hit the link pretty consistently. Inputs for me usually show up like this.
:lp:
:d:
:df:
:r:
:r::lp:
:d:
:df:
:r:
:r::lk::mk::hk:
If you chain the jabs together, you do not have to worry about specials coming out while buffering qcfx2.
Not sure whether or not you guys knew about this but I thought I’d pass the tip along to you guys.
Thanks, We already know about it. Personally, I find it easier to do it the normal way. With this I always end up with Far LK instead of ultra or with thunder kick. But then again, its a matter of preference.
Arcade UFO SSF4 Arcade Edition: The Rise Before the Storm
We’ll be streaming once we get the game and I’ll play as much Ken as possible for those that won’t be able to play! I’ll make a reminder just in case day before or day of.
Appreciate it, keep us updated 