Why don’t you? I mean you might as well. Those strider resets in your video are nice though. So I could see why you wouldn’t wanna drop him.
After playing extensively offline the past weekend, I came to the conclusion that Jill NEEDS a horizontal assist before anything else. Yeah an anti air assist helps her out with those troublesome MUs and a lock down assist is great for her mix ups, but she definitely needs assist that covers full screen to either help her get in or to keep the opponent on their toes and makes getting in with her from long distances much less troublesome…
So for any future Jill players trying to build a team for her… ** Make sure you have atleast one horizontal assist on the team! **
^^ This is why im such a believer in the fact that Iron Man is Jills absolute best overall teammate. He just provides…literally everything she needs. Amazing horizontal assist which also doubles as a very good assist for resets, IM is a character who can deal with SJ height bullshit (which Jill has problems with), provides easy tac infinites anywhere on the screen, and provides a very high damage DHC.
Then again NSR does it with just shopping cart and strider lol
My team has a beam (psionic blaster), and coldstar for lock down. Its been working out good for me, even though all I know with ammy is a TAC infinite. 
Yeah, well, NSR and I dont quite see eye to eye on a lot of things. Ill just leave it at that I guess.
Yeah I agree. I personally have difficulty against decent player/team if I don’t have a full screen assist. At the very least you should have a THC or good MGS+assist combo to help you get in.
And thats why NSR has trouble with certain match ups he wouldn’t have any trouble with if he ran a beam…(Hulk/Sentinel for example) And any smart player wouldn’t have any trouble keeping Jill/Frank out. It is strider helping him in his neutral game in the end though.
Oh boy im getting my popcorn ready. This gon be good.
Being fair, I think NSR says a lot of crazy stuff, ive just learned that trying to argue with him is completely useless.
Honestly I was originally going to run a Jill/IM team when ultimate came out but after what they did to him I didn’t want to have to depend on Ironman in his current form.
I still think hes considerably better than most people give him credit for. Hes no magneto, but he does have some good tools. Hes great at preserving a lead, pretty ass at getting the lead back.
I absolutely positively suck with Jill lol. But I personally think Jill/unibeam/cold star is prob the strongest Jill team. Basically I see it as a variant of Viper/Doom/Dog. I kind of feel that Jill should be played similarly to Viper or at least Full Schedule’s Viper. I just look at Ironman/Dog as the same as Doom/Dog but with a weaker midgame in exchange for a much better assist. In the end is that really that big of a deal?
As far as the lack of an anti air goes: everyone has to come down sometime. And you have 50/50s and SS waiting for them everytime. You could hard tag Iron man as well. And if someone blocks cold star vs. Jill…GGs. You get total ground control.
JIll does not need a horizontal projectile assist, at all.
She makes use an anti-air assist as that makes matchups that are even/slightly in her opponents favour completely lopsided in hers (Trish, Doom,skrull, etc.). Have fun finding time and space to call your beam assist when vsing a morrigan player.
Jill is strongest at the start of round gambit where she has ample time to close in and apply her mixups at the beginning of the game. A projectile assist doesn’t necessarily help her there as they all have considerable start-up time and is asking you to get bopped. Hence her comparison with Wolverine players.
If she wants to cover distances easily, there are many options. Plinked feral–> Slide which low profiles beams, MGS+Assist, Arrow kick, etc.
Also having trouble with one matchup is a stupid reason to refute the shell. You know it is. The team J/F/S doesn’t even have to be played in that order as S/F/J deals with Hulk laughably easy. Hell, in this day and age I don’t have much problem with the Hulk Matchup as I learned certain nuances which make dealing with him with Jill less of a chore. Position exchange blows up a large amount of his actions, Somersault–>TK’D snapback does as well, so does Cr.L,Cr.M chains that blow up hulk under drones pressure. Plus Hulk’s options remain the same against Jill/Iron-Man. Iron-man’s startup on his assist beam is ridiculously long, there’s nothing stopping Hulk from bulldozing him anyway. Maybe from FULL screen, but Hulk’s options are severely limited from full screen anyway.
The team has had good success.
J/F/S has ONE wonky matchup for decimating the rest.
I’ve used J/IM/Doom for a considerable amount of time and it has notable flaws. Yeah everyone has to come down at some point, but opponents make it so that you’re in a mix-up on the way down, or make their descent safe. Magneto has to fall at some point, but be damn sure he’s applying pressure on his way down. Same with Trish, Same with MODOK who can lame you the fuck out, Same with Morrigan, etc. Missles help with combo extensions but Jill can’t protect them anywhere else, Plasma beam causes soft-knockdown, which makes converting tedious, less damaging, and resets harder to manage. Plasma Beam does have stronger durability and faster start-up though (but you loose the before mentioned items+presence at the SoRG). Rocks has a SoRG presence and helps with resets, remains active for a considerable period, can’t be low profiled unlike plasma beam, etc.
TL;DR: Team building is largely up to the player as Beams all have considerable faults while Rush-down assists and Anti-airs cover different naunces of Jill’s gameplay but too have faults that are all too important. To say that you “NEED” one is dumb.
I’m not going to argue with ya NSR, I’m just going by experience. Maybe Online it is okay to not run a horizontal assist, which I was doing for the longest and didn’t have trouble getting in on most players and teams. But as soon as I started playing offline with my previous shells that lacked a full screen horizontal assist against actual competent opponents, things got incredibly difficult fast. Why make things harder then they need be?
You can also still have a lock down assist running side by side with a Horiztonal assist, thats why they give you a choice of two other characters. And in my opinion, that would probably end up with a stronger team for jill. Jill/Iron Man-UniBeam/Dante-Jam Session IMO would probably be a really great shell for jill.
online/offline has does not have any affect on team building for Jill and online has absolutely no bearing on this conversation as I always speak on terms of offline data. Do not get things confused, I play online but all of my posts retain to offline scenarios (as, shocker, I do play offline as well). You’ve been here for years, this isn’t new.
I don’t see how it would be any harder Offline unless you’re doing something terribly wrong. Jill’s options at the Start of the Round remain the same if not stronger due to feral plink consistency offline.
Once again, iron-man or dante don’t solve Jill’s problem about lack of air options. In fact, hitting opponents at Super Jump height with Jam Session restores their air options and allows them to stay in the air for longer. Depending on the height in which you hit you’re opponents at, you may convert, but you must utilize you’re ground bounce to get anywhere with the already-scaled to shit combo as well as giving up reset options. The height where Jam Session can actually help you (jump height) is where Jill doesn’t really need assistance as all of her tools (flip,cart,Somersault) cover that height already.
Dante’s weasel assist is far better for Jill than Jam Session, imo. I feel Jill/Dante/Strider is stronger, or if you have to insist on a beam assist Jill/IM/Strider.
Yeah I think Jill/Dante/Strider would be retartedly good for her, because it covers both her needs. For me cold star works out really well. I also agree about modok laming Jill out, and modok can also lame ironman out as well quite convincingly. Which is why I would never main IM for the sake of just having unibeam.
I guess my team doesn’t really need strider cause I have modok for zoning. In those instances with bad match ups I start dok to get rid of the problem then switch Jill back in for clean up time. Like bill said if you block coldstar GG’s, confirm with Jill into modok TAC. NSR is right about that modok vs Jill match up though, I lame other Jill’s the F out lol. Plinks and coldstar work pretty good for me.
Indeed. I know it’s a shocker to many, but I don’t talk out my ass
MANY characters can lame a unproperly assisted Jill out. She’s, for all intents and purposes, a better Iron-Fist save damage.
Cold-Star Is retarded too. The minute someone blocks that shit they have to block two more mixups (which they never do). You could set up many a combo with it too depending on hitstun, also that stuff benefits the Start of Round Gambit since it’s startup is good among the location Amaterasu comes out at. My amaterasu is pretty ass though.
My amaterasu is ass as well. I feel like I finally found a shell that works for me that doesn’t involve sent. I would much rather have anchor ammy with x factor than anchor sent as well. I tried Jill/Dok/Strider, but I felt Jill didn’t get a great lockdown with psionic assist, where as you (NSR) had shopping cart and strider. So that shell didn’t work out for me as well. I may need to use jill/modok/strider for the morr/doom match up though.
I don’t know though cause from what I hear hidden missiles blows up strider assist calling. I haven’t run into many good ones though so dok ammy works out pretty good for me.
Nah, The thing about Vajra is that it’s not only an anti-air assist but also for screen presence. If you’re using it right then you should be using it in conjunction with your movement so that it’s always forces a block.
I’m going to upload some new gameplay sometime this week, so you can see what I’m talking about.
I’ve been waiting to see some more recent good Jill gameplay. Thanks