Somewhat true on the option select thing but SF4’s have gotten pretty ridiculous because of how long the buffer window is. A lot of games with one button throws have throw / attack option selects but that’s about as deep as it goes. Then you look at SF they have an option select covering most of the opponents options on safe jump or off of light attacks. Although, could it be that’s because people have taken it that far with SF and not other games? I really hope it’s just because of how SF4 reads inputs.
Anyway I would like mashed lights to be cancelable into specials, just seems odd that they put some arbitrary rule on when you can and can’t cancel your moves. I don’t mind links but I think if shit is chainable and also normally special cancelable, why not just leave it that way when you chain? Never made much sense to me.
For anyone that doesn’t know, in ST: T.Hawk can SPD you, safejump you, then using the blockstun or hitstun from the safe jump do cr.jab > 360 ~DP + Negative edge jab. Sounds confusing. If the opponent is in range the highest priority move is the SPD, if they are not in range SPD whiffs instantly and since there is no animation, the DP comes out. Back to square 1.
I agree , I really hate 1 frame links in particular. What is the point? Moves that you can only cancel at certain points (take weskers OTG gunshot into cr.m for example in mvc3) make sense and I don’t mind but … 1 frame links? Where people just plink into a 2 frame link anyways, I can’t stand them. They fall into the category of hard just to be hard.
Yeah plinking is just another unnecessary level of execution for overly simple things IMO. I don’t really use option selects or plinking and I kind of suffer for it with dropped combos and actually having to read people, but I think in the end it makes me a better player for it. Of course I’m also at a pretty big disadvantage vs people that do use that stuff.
There’s some pretty ridiculous option selects in 3S as well aren’t there? I wonder why it’s only SF games that have this stuff? I know I’ve seen a few in BB but it was pretty simple / self explanitory stuff.
How much hate can be spread about 4? IDK why you guys STILL hate the game for no reason. Saying you don’t like a game because a pro doesn’t like it is a poor reason.
ESPECIALLY when the person you mentioned says its his FAVORITE SF SERIES!!!
Japanese ST Hawk players have been using that Option Select for a LONG time, WAY WAAAAY before SF4.
“SF4 influenced” my ass. Pretty sad how even Ultradavid and Seth Killian aren’t even aware of what’s been going on with the ST scene for the past decade.
If you enjoy rhythm, then why not play Guitar Hero?
I’m not saying every game needs to have super-easy inputs, in fact execution is an important part of any competitive fighter, but making a game in which most characters’ offense at the highest level revolve around 1-frame links doesn’t provide “depth”, it’s stupid and arbitrary.
Of course it’s his “favorite” because he’s won tons of money from SF4, and he’s not even close to Top 10 in Japan in 3S, ST, Alpha 2, etc. Alpha 3, back in the day–yes, but now…probably not.
Option selects are funny, and they do tend to pop up in most games, but they always have one common theme: they tend to have negative effects on gameplay.
I’m ok with option selects, if a player on defense can predict the option select and punish it.
Example of a “good” OS: Fuzzy Guard in VF5. It avoids mids and throws, which are the two most common counterattacks, but you can beat it with lows, or you can do a delayed mid/throw to beat the fuzzy. If that’s predicted the attacked can low block or abare, so it’s a mindgame. The execution helps, but it isn’t something you can do without thinking. I won’t say that it adds to the strategy of the game, but it doesn’t hurt it.
BBCS2 did a good job of nerfing option selects into something you had to think about. I was really impressed.
As for the Hawk OS, it’s something you don’t have to worry about in HDR. He solved it by giving Hawk a whiff animation.
I’m very excited for SC5 , it looks like it will easily be my favorite game. I somehow got hype for ultimate in the past week or two, not sure how but I’m looking forward to that as well.
I’m sure ultimate will get as as stupid (or stupider) then vanilla but I plan to play that game just to abuse stupid stuff and not just play the team I want to like I did last time. If someone I put on my initial team turns out to be trash (iron man) or a top tier silly broken strat pops up (wolverine, haggar/phoenix) I’m switching to it and I’m abusing it without giving it a second thought.
Plinking is a tool that makes execution easier. It’s not remotely difficult to do, and the moves you need to plink (close fierce) are easily done on pad. Also, no, not using OS doesn’t make you a better player; it just means that you aren’t playing the same game as the top players are, and consequently, means you need to work WAY harder for no reason. While you’re thinking of whether or not they’re going to backdash, they’re thinking of what happens after that, because the game does the work for them up until then.
GG had a shitload of option selects. Hell, every game that has hitstop has SF4 style OS built into it. The problem is that’s basically what ALL SF4 offense is built around.
EDIT: Top players threw a shit fit about the HDR Hawk whiff animation because it took a low tier character and removed the only thing that made him scary, while giving him essentially nothing in return. HDR Hawk is basically O.Hawk without the OS aka useless.
I agree, actually.
Personally, I don’t really have any problem with option selects, especially in ST, as long as there is at least one POSSIBLE option to beat it.
Out of all the things to hate about SF4, option selects existing (when do they NOT exist in any competitive fighter?) is very low on the list for me.
The real problem, is as you say, is not that they exist but they are the ONLY thing that exists.
That’s why I said: “Damned if you do, damned if you don’t”
Sirlin was in a situation where if he left T. Hawk’s OS in, new players would bitch and T. Hawk probably would have skyrocketed in the tierlist (let’s not forget Gief won the last EVO and the last Final Round).
If he took it out, top (i.e. OLD) players would bitch and there’s pretty much nothing as good T. Hawk could get as compensation besides maybe fireballs shooting from his fingertips during his cr. MP.
I defer to your knowledge. I know nothing of rhythm games, nor do I care to.
Ultimate is gonna be dumb. Watching more videos of Strange, he looks like Phoenix with over double the health and no need to go dark. If Zero ends up sucking I might just play Dorm / Dante / Strange or something.
If you’re thinking harder than your opponent then I feel like it levels you up faster. I’d rather just develop good reads vs developing good option selects because option selects are a mostly SF specific mechanic as far as the safe jumps go. I like the stuff I learn in various games to carry over to others, so maybe that makes a little more sense in that light?
