Yes Gav was the first to come with the money so he got served. Not a promise to come with the money later… someday. The rules are foggy on that really that is what I’m arguing.
Nothing mentioned about a 24 hour rule.
I was assuming that was after somebody firmly agrees. If somebody says yes I will pay you give me your paypal, then yes I’ll give them 3 days.
What happened with us is.
DIIIIIIIIBS.
But I gotta check on some things.
???
That is like calling gamestop asking them to hold a game, but telling them, but I gotta check on if I can get a ride. I should have said. No I won’t hold it for you, and we wouldn’t be having this discussion, but I didn’t even answer Yes to it either.
It seems like we will not be seeing eye to eye on this, and would like a independent ruling from a moderator so I can understand better the rules of the trading forum with fully detailed procedures and processes so this doesn’t happen again. If someone calls dibs, and I don’t agree, am I obligated to not enter negotiations with someone else? Or how long am I forbidden to take a deal from someone who is ready vs someone who I am not sure is ready?
Again your style of business is not what SRK wants…Put it in this scenario, you’re not on 24hrs a day.
1st Buyer: Hi, i want to buy your stick, what is the condition of it…
You: Its mint condition, you goto sleep
2nd buyer: Hey i know someone already got dibs but i have money in hand right now can you sell it to me
You: wake up notice guys is online, yeah i can sell it to you here’s my paypal
2nd buyer: Thanks man, payment sent
1st Buyer: Can i get your paypal?
You: Sorry its sold, look at the bright side you can buy something else…
Imagine other possibilities…
Hey i notice that guy has dibs but im willing to pay more…
Seller notice guy is local, this would be easier…
3 buyers send pm, hmm i’ll just pick the guy closest to me…
Out of curiosity rcaido what state do you live? My motivation was to get the stick sale over and done with as quickly as possible so I could put more of my crap in my closet and stop having to check the trading outlet. I can’t imagine you live too much farther from California than Rhode Island.
I live in Washington State…So yes it would have been cheaper for you to ship to me. That’s not the point here though, when someone got dibs on something you give that guy a chance to pay first or least some courtesy saying you have this certain amount of time before i go to the next buyer. It was a really cool looking stick w/ amazing price which makes it hurt even more as i was really excited to get it…
Yeah sorry If I wasn’t courteous to you enough. If you want I can send you the digtal files used for the stick if you wanted to get the same art as an attempt to make amends, and show no hard feelings, but still would like to have a clarification on this.
It was my preference to deal with the other guy because he was more assertive in his commitment to buy while you where still kicking the tires so to speak. The opposite side of abuse is that one person can unduly stall the sale of something when somebody needs money fast by calling dibs, and using more stalling tactics to try to gather funds. This obviously wasn’t you rcaido but I had the stick up there for a few days and just wanted it done with and didn’t want to lose an oppotunity to sell.
It was a case of a bird in the hand beats one in the bush.
Where I come from you come to the bargaining table ready to go or not at all.
I honestly thought that it could have been possible to have played out like this:
“My wife says she’ll kill me If i buy the stick sorry for wasting your time.”
“Sure no problem” Hey Gav rcaido don’t want it you want it?
The value of my stick instantly goes down when there is no competition for the stick and its ability to move. If one person doesn’t want it it becomes less desireable.
He offers $80. I say no.
I spent nearly $150 on this stick and the art and hours I spent wiring the electronics getting those little wires soldered onto the LEDs the holes i carefully drilled, the time I went to driving around find suitable covers for the LEDs. All for the love of being a nerd for arcade sticks. I don’t want to lose too much on it. I actually do care about the effort I put into the stick and when someone comes to me unprepared to deal, I feel less inclined to sell it to them.
Outside forces hurt my bargaining position. If I waited patiently It left open the possibility that I would be lowering the price of the stick again.
Just for the record I would never expected any body to hold anything for me, especially If I wasn’t ready cash in hand waiting for approval from the wife.
The infraction was only at warning level, it personally does nothing to the user but let him know of a situation to the likes of breaking guidelines. If you feel inclined to take it up with MrWizard still rtdzign, you can.
What we are trying to prevent is the huge amount of complaints of people doing business as the buyer, then the seller cops out to another party. The complaints are in HIGH, guys are getting pissed when sellers are backing outta deals only to find out that the item in question got sold to another party. We selected the most frequent of happenings as an provided example: selling to another party locally. Transactions of these happenings were within short time frames, so we personally started to identify these people and call them out. The goal was to prevent ANY cop outs of the like, because there was some situations exactly like this one. Most threads we have usually have a “first come/first serve” type formula, though understandable it is EXTREMELY important that if an item is pending then it is marked as pending sale. I know a lot of you already do this, but if you don’t you really should start. Threads MUST be updated with ALL and ANY information possible, I’m not saying post up your bank accounts, tracking numbers, etc. but common sense things. If you aren’t gonna hold something for somebody, say so. If you wanna raise prices, do so and say you did. If you have a potential buyer that needs some time state who it is and how long he’s gonna take (if you want you can make that determination on how long the buyer has). Things like these help other buyers know where the thread’s pace currently stands, so that when the mods check them everything is balanced.
Mods CANNOT read other people’s pm dialogues. So we have to go by what we see unless the accuser just piles up information, when seeing that thread that I questioned “did rtdzign agree to hold it for you and how long he was willing to?” and that’s what I pretty much told rcadio. One basically says yea and now the other nope, so then I had to use evidence and judgement. Since rcadio provided the link to the thread of course I went in and read what happened.
rcadio reply
then rtdzign
Although I never saw that he said he would personally hold the item (rtdzign), he did in-fact quoted the message. From my point of view, it does appear that rtdzign is going to reach a deal with rcaido sometime later or possibly soon after these quotes. Once GAVOLUTION had posted I didn’t see any updates afterward, rather rcaido pissed about the item getting sold to another person. I had originally thought that rtdzign did in-fact see a pissed off rcaido raging in his thread which happened exactly 2/1/2010 at 11:33am pacific time, but since he did not take the time to address him I was again left with uncertainty. Although by asking rtdzign just what was going on should of been what I did, I figured that he possibly already seen rcaido going off and was going to do so anyway whether it be in this thread or his own. Many MANY times I faced situations where somebody lends proof and the other guy just didn’t care enough to defend himself. I’m not saying rtdzign would of done that, because like I said I was certain he would be defending himself like he is now. Which is why I sent the warning and NOT the actual infraction (it’s basically a warning-infraction, it does nothing to the person)
Sorry you guys have your troubles. We want the best outlet possible to where people can come in here and won’t find scamming, etc. nothing but smooth transactions and high positive itrader information.
Yes you are the seller and have that right. In some places you see signs like “we can refuse to hold service to ANYONE” or something of that nature, it is the sellers right to refuse service to anyone he/she chooses. In this case, you can choose whether or not you wanna hold something for someone (most people who do in here place “ON-HOLD” next to the item)
If you post “No I can’t hold any thing for you I’m selling to the first person who is ready to buy.” plz be sure it is the moment you make the intended thread. This lets people know off the back that you will NOT be holding stuff for nobody, some people I’ve seen do this already because they must sell everything ASAP.
To answer the other question, yes because you want BOTH parties to know what’s going on. But this can only happen if you are willing to hold stuff for people, if you are certain you aren’t going to then don’t do it. I mean you can anyway, but it could lead to unnecessary drama and confusion if you aren’t careful.
Yeah I’m satisfied with that. I’ll take the warning, no need to bother Wizard on such a trivial thing. I guess I’ll be stating in my forums that I will never hold items for anybody because it is inconvenient for me to do smooth transactions. Come ready or don’t come at all. First come first serve, meaning first to come ready with money ready to go.
I wish people would talk to anyone they have to be it the wife, girlfriend, moma before they come talk to me.
lol But seriously who the fuck needs to talk to the wifes or girlfirends this days to have permission to buy things. Hell they buy shit like crazy between shoes, clothes,purse or anything and their hubbies work hard all day and earn their own money and still needs permission from the wife to buy things and when they are using hubbies money. After that the guys cant complain about that part. What happen to equal rights.
Hell i buy things all the time w/o asking my wife and if she doesnt like too bads its my money anyways. Plus if she wants to buy things she has to ask me first then i will say yes or no but most times will say yes.
I got burn many times on srk like example i pmed someone for wiimote and nunchuck and i was first then later asked for paypal. The seller said it was sold to diffirent forum. Yes i did get pissed but i didnt complain here. Shit happens in life and ppl should know that.
A happy wife is a happy life…Been married for 8 years & No I wasn’t asking permission to buy a stick…My last 5 transaction here has been me being screwed over, i got burned out from the SRK trading outlet so decided to take like 6 months off & then my next transaction I get screwed again. Things really need to change, as yourself admit you been screwed over many times. If everyone keeps doing what they are doing how is the trading outlet going to change for the better?
So Fir, this is kind of news to me about selling to a person who is ready to pay over the person who has dibs. Seems like this can lead to Pandora Box. What if all sellers start putting that on their listing? There will be no point of posting messages nor can we actually monitor who is following the rules through PM. IMO, i think everyone needs to follow the same rules. This has nothing to do with rtdzing but just my concerns of the possibilities of what this can lead to…
I agree, and that’s why we are cracking down on the people who back outta deals. We simply ask sellers to be fair and considerate. If somebody states that he/she will not hold the item then that’s that, however, that information is extremely important to cover the moment you begin your sell. If it is not disclosed, then buyers have more right to call dibs on a item and complain when it is sold to another. When we look at the top business dealers in here they have NO problems at all about managing their business. That’s what it’s about, management.
I’ve dealt with people on here and a lot of times I was told that somebody already had a particular interest in an item I wanted. I was told that should that person not come through then I would be contacted again about its availability. Had I lost interest in the item from there then the seller would go back and make the announcement to everyone that the item is once again open for deals. I don’t think it’s hard to understand, the management of your business is what brings people back more and more. I’m not saying rtdzing is a bad seller, but he probably could of handled it differently to where he wouldn’t be in here with walls and walls of text.
People buy stuff everyday. We know the “first come first serve” principle is generally applied to many transactional purposes but the goal is to weed out messes like this. We know the buyer wants to get rid of it for the $$$$ if he can, all we ask is to be fair and accurate during business runs. If you aren’t gonna hold it, say you aren’t. Do not wait until you get caught in a jam.
Though it may seem that way, the way of posting is to let the buyer know you are interested in a particular item. We see “dibs” like post all the time, but if the seller already had stated he WOULDN’T hold anything then there’s no point in continuing further. Each seller is different, the same rules cannot be applied to everyone because each seller has his or her own way of selling of products and merchandise. Each situation is different, some sellers must sell everything ASAP to cover loans, rent, etc. while another seller is just selling for extra $$$$$ in his/her pocket. What we try to do is to create a system to where these events like this DON’T occur, bad transactions and low itrader information is something that doesn’t please ANY mod here.
Buyer and Seller are two different aspects to achieve an transaction. We try to be fair to both and give them certain authorities and rights during negotiations.
Is it okay to state that you won’t hold items for more than 24 hours? I am conflicted on this subject.
When I am a buyer I pay immediately.
When I am a seller I regularly have transactions that drag out.
If I feel like someone is flaking I will tell the flaker that the item will be sold to someone else if they cannot pay. I’m not trying to be harsh or unfair. It’s just that when I resort to selling it’s usually because I either (1.) need the money or (2.) that I’m trying to clean up the house.
Yeah i dont see nothing wrong with that Kyle, as long as you let the person know & give him a deadline even if its less then 24hrs. As long as you say, you got until 5:00pm or its going to the next available person. I think that’s quite fair for both parties…Also make sure you post it on the original post, say rcaido has until 5:00pm today or Gavaloution is up next. He then has insert time until he pays, then comes the next person, etc…
I think this would be the best solution, what do you think Fir?
since i’ve been “sold” a few items on here already, paid via paypal, then told that they have already sold them to someone else, i like your idea rcaido.
I do not like talking to people who do not have money in the bank ready to go. Ideally when I am selling something I am super happy to answer questions about the product so they buyers can make a decision on if they want it or not. I do not agree that a person who calls dibs should be guaranteed any time to make a descision. The sale should go the person who makes up his mind and has the courtesy to be always be prepared to do business.
The reason I sold to Gavolution is because I did not know what the outcome of your discussion with the wife would be. I do not have a magical integrity scanner to know if you would follow through. Gav in his email communicated to me that he understood that my time is valuable by having his funds in order.
I am not trying to make a dig at you rcaido, I just want you to understand how I felt at the time and how it influenced my decision to pass you up. I was slightly annoyed with your whole unpreparedness in the matter. Kind of like people who come to the post office to mail something but did not box anything up have addresses filled out and not filled out a delivery confirmation slip and want to hold the line so the postal worker can help them.
I did what any postal worker would do, called next. I do understand now that I may have by a mistake of quoting your text and half answering your question inferred that in fact that I did give you dibs, but in fact that wasn’t my intention to hold it for you. I didn’t answer your question about holding because I was thinking about it when I was typing about the artwork, and then forgot to answer the question about holding because I had to jet to make it to work.
My idea was that the seller could announce at the beginning of his thread whether or not he was willing to hold goods for someone. In turn, if nothing was disclosed to that nature then we would basically go by rcadios ideology of calling dibs and getting infracted for bailouts.
We COULD poll this and see what the masses think. I want to be as fair as possible to the both of you, really. Two people already came here and one sided with rcadio and the other with rtdzign. The current rule is that we DO NOT accept bailouts of any kind, but if people are beginning to question where our rules are heading (possibly to disaster) then we can settle this with a mass vote.
I’m aware that MegamanDS likes the “first come first serve” ideal, but like I said I want to really see what the mass population of TOers think so we can go from there.
I like the idea about if a buyer asks seller to hold, seller then agrees to hold for a specific time, buyer agrees to that time frame.
Agreement now reached. Paypal info exchanged via pm.
Now if the buyer turns to non-buyer and bails out, non buyer gets infracted. I would be then more willing to do holds. As it stands the seller loses opportunity to do business and has no recourse.
Of course all this must be stated on the trade forum and not done via pm. Pm should be reserved for saying, What is your paypal/home address/penis size? or personal questions only. I was willing to be transparent but shady people probably wont.
Seller has little incentive to do holds, and if when I see people do it, I think the sellers are too generous with their time bending backwards for people.
I too agree with Megaman DS, first come (with money), first serve. If a hold agreement is made, the seller then should give the paypal info after the agreement and then wait for the funds to come in. That way both know they are locked into an agreement.
Unless a seller and buyer agree that an item will be held, I would assume the first person to confirm payment and transfer funds gets it. It works like that at any normal business.
While it might upset someone, as long as the seller hasn’t sent payment information and confirmed the item is held, then the sale really hasn’t been broken (As is the case when someone cancels a sale to sell locally)
Fir or Valaris can u please give him warming or infractions to Esjihn dude this guy fucked me up twice and i was nice before but this time it has gone too fair with him. Im sick of this guy. I once bought MW2 Ps3 game from him and he never sent if out and giving me bullshit story. He did five my money back but 2 weeks later and this time he fucked me up again. I asked for 2 games but later on i pmed saying only wanted Blazblue and paid for it then he goes behind my back and sells to another member when i was the first person that want it. Yes he post said only 48 states but he agrred to ship to canada. All he could have said was no to me.
Here is the deal that he broke with me.
QUOTE=Esjihn;8330566]PM sent.
[/quote]
See u pmed me
then same time u said games are still available when their werent b/c i wanted them
{made me hold the other game for no reason}
Here u said i made u hold the games for me but when u posted earlier the game are still available. So who is the lier here not me.
Im not trolling im saying the true facts. U fucked me up with mw2 before and i was nice to let this go but not this time.
Plus if u didnt want to ship to canada u could have said no. Im done too.