I thought thatt post by enix seemed off as I was scrolling down before I saw his corrected one lol
I think the people you’re really bitching about will weed out eventually. Just give it time and enjoy the larger scenes that most of us got from this release if you don’t care for the players or the game
Its too soon to state particular details as fact about Super, but I agree that some of the annoying elements will stay, I disagree about SF4 being a “steaming pile of shit”. Try to be a bit more reasonable and you might see people start to listen more to what you say. I assume you do care about being listened to, given your participation in this thread.
I also disagree about their being “tons of money” in SF4. There is a LITTLE money for the top 3 spots at a major. Its not enough to live on, its not enough to quit your day job, and there is a LOT of competition.
Example: Marn said “fuck season’s beatings” this year when he saw the list of confirmed high level players, because he knew he wasn’t getting paid out. That was at a MAJOR, not some podunk tourney with 60 people signed up. When players of his caliber are declining to even attend majors due to the lack of financial incentive, I feel that a reasonable person has to agree that saying “tons of money” is a gross exaggeration.
EDIT: If my understanding of the Marn sb4 situation is flawed, then please feel free to correct me, but he was definitely not there and I’m pretty sure he even talked about why he declined to attend, right here on SRK. I am certainly not trying to put words in anyone else’s mouth or speak for anyone…this was just an example and I understand it to be accurate.
I believe if you win sf4 @ evo, and lets say 3 other sf4 nationals, you’ll probably take home around 17 grand for the year. The marn example is kinda flawed because he’s a great player but not the best. If Marn was scared to enter, daigo sure as hell wasn’t. Daigo’s last 2 american tournaments has probably reeled him in around 15-17grand. Great chunk of change. certainly not enough to live off of but its a good bit. Who wouldn’t that much money just sitting in the bank for an emergency or take a vacation?
when I say there’s money in sf4, total the entire prize pool up from every major tournament then compare that to all the other games. Sf4 probably has enough total pot money to match the total pots for every other tournament game combined. Its going to exceed 20grand easy. Will 1 person win all this money, hard to say but its certainly available for someone to do so. From time to time players dominate. Justin dominated real hard in mvc2 for years and basically won 99% of his mvc2 tournaments. Thats probably a bit far fetched but he won a lot of them. I’m not saying there will be a dominant sf4 player and he’ll smoke everyone easily, but it has been done in the past. tomo, valle, justin come to mind and I’m sure there are others.
I think the big problem with this entire discussion is that some of you actually think game designers base their decisions on any sort of rational thought process. At best, Ono put in some stupid shit he imagined new players would want or like or grow to like and appreciate or what-the-fuck-ever, and completely failed to see how it actually gets in the way of new players as much as it does for the rest of us. The amount of things wrong with SF4 do not at all add up to the conclusion that meticulous planning and solid design philosophy were the bedrock on which the game was built.
For fuck’s sake, they didn’t even get the HIT BOXES right. This is one of the whiffiest Capcom fighters outside of, like X-men CotA. Nobody asked for that, and it sure as hell doesn’t make it easier for newbs to learn when i have to explain why that c.mk just went through the other guy’s foot.
Yeah, dude, you’ve really got to get onto the idea that no one gives a fuck about what your interest is. That tack has really become your way of lazily simplifying whatever anyone’s talking about the the point of futility. Really, great. We get it. Run along back to Denjin while the grownups talky-talk.
The point is not that these hypothetical people who’d drop the game because of rep are fragile and prone to immediate butthurt. It’s that it was a signifier that trying to be a part of things was going to be way more trouble than it was worth. Given the things newbies could get shit for, they were screwed no matter what they did, and i wouldn’t blame anyone for just not wanting to deal with it.
And ironically, as someone who bathed in his red bar with a grin and saw the retarded anonymous comments that came with neg rep, i’d say that the people who put so much importance in the system as to use it weren’t exactly the most valuable community members. It didn’t do anything but enable the petty and borderline-illiterate to impotently play out their continued highschool clique fantasies.
goodness Viper’s fuckin cr.mk comes to mind…it’s a decent passible poke until you realize shit whiffs right over people’s foot. This also reminds me of Cassy’s foot stomp not working on a standing Lizardman in SC4.
This GARBL CORPORATIONS NEED MONAY argument is so trite. SF4 was practically guaranteed to make shitloads of money regardless of Ono’s whining about how they can’t fund a fucking decent patch. On top of that, they have 20 years of fighting games to draw from, most of them made by Capcom.
In fairness, this would not exactly be the first SF game with hitboxes that made no sense visually.
IIRC, CE Guile comes to mind, where the hibox on his crouch fierce extended WAY past his fist.
sf4 has a lot of those though and I hope they’ve learned since CE lol
im no expert but has there ever been any consistency in the teams that have been behind various sf series?
Well, that’s the thing. Previous games generally erred on the side of caution, where the hitbox was a little larger than what you’d expect. And then, not by that much.
Yeah, Ken’s ultra comes to mind…you can reliably produce some INSANE looking situations with that thing…although that doesn’t equate to the move being too good…just looking funky in certain situations.
Yea, I’ve had that thing pull someone almost off the other side of me before
20 years of fighting game experience…cool. Does experience make the game? Does experience pay the programmers? Experience doesn’t do shit for the bills, and the bottom line is money needs to be made for the machine to keep working. Maybe you’re too grassroots and underground to grasp this concept, but money perpetuates things…Not well-wishes, not good intentions, not rainbows and unicorn piss. Great ideas (not just in video games, but in everything else) have been passed on due to money and lack of it, who are we to think capcom and street fighter are not susceptible to this worldly trend?
The problem is that many of those people who we could attribute that experience to are no longer with the company. Which is why I don’t particularly support any futhur revisions/updates/sequels for their fighters until I see them improving drastically.
I honestly think even if SFIV were released years back when the scene was stronger this game would have died on the shelves. I really don’t even see it succeeding today if it weren’t for the massive hype train and advertising made for it. I really don’t see why anyone who had a moderate amount of time with fighters in the past years would touch the game. It just seems so empty and pointless.
It’s not my aim to point out my personal interests, but instead to point out that its a false assumption that everyone who posts on SRK is solely interested in reaching out to every single potential player. Obviously this is true since the reaction to the huge increase in SF players was hardly the celebration you’d expect from a community that posts threads about community growth weekly.
How much trouble does red rep really cause anyone? If red rep or trolls stop you from playing SF, isn’t only a matter of time before online scrubs calling you a turtle bitch would have got to you too? And besides, theres all kinds of people who play SF competitively who don’t post on SRK.
ST? that doesn’t exactly inspire confidence. one of the reasons i didn’t like ST is because it didn’t go far enough. nonetheless, i agree. although, the question of how much of an improvement remains to be seen. who knows? Capcom might even surprise me.
well, i wasn’t expecting much from SSF4 anyway. yeah, i’m sure they’ll give players a few more bells and whistles, but currently i don’t expect it to be a game changer.
Yeah Seth already said that if you weren’t a fan of the mechanics of SFIV you won’t be a fan of the mechanics of Super. So I’m done wishing blockstrings and reversals weren’t so stupid cuz it’s confirmed that none of that shit is changing. So from there it’s pretty obvious that Super will be better than Vanilla IV because IV wasn’t necessarily the most interesting SF game on a technical standpoint any ways.
Whether the same people are there or not doesn’t change the fact that the games exist and can be analyzed. In the case of Capcom’s own fighters, even the source might be available for… actually the industry track record on that one isn’t so great. But the point is, the genre as a whole is not even close to being so new that they’re still at the stage of throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. Gief didn’t have to be a grind for most of the cast, because we’ve already seen him be a grind in damn near every other game he’s been in. Sim was godtier in WW, bottom tier in 4. What changed? Sagat’s awesome for the same reasons he was awesome in some previous games plus he’s buff to brokeness. And that’s to say nothing about the location testing, which didn’t do much for poor Claw and Guile.
The players end up understanding more about the game than the developers, and we do it with access to less information. I imagine this is where people start getting the idea that the game’s dumbed down for newbs, because surely the designers should be above us on the foodchain? But not really. If newbs are responsible for the game’s design, it’s not the ones on our side of the fence.
Hmmm, household name in gaming from a company that really isn’t hurting for money thanks to its pathological inability to not shit out 20 billion sequels, WHEREVER WILL THEY FIND MONEY FOR IT. God, if only they had some other recognizable franchises. Please, clockmaker, explain to me the vagaries of this mystical and confusing machine. You’re my only hope for understanding it.
When the fuck was that the issue?
I’m sure someday that comparison’ll make sense.
It didn’t cause any real trouble, which is what i said. It’s as devastating as people throwing a hissyfit for saying Snorelax is a shit pokemon. It’s also about as :rolleyes:. You got rep for something insignificant, then the kiddies used that as an excuse to keep acting like twats to you. Oh look, i can spend more time ingratiating myself with the emotionally retarded, or i could… go do just about anything else. The entire reason it was ditched is because the only real use it had was to make people go “Yyyyyeah, i’ll go stand over there now…”
your responses are getting too vague for me to respond to
its obvious that one of you two geniuses will convince the other of your own opinion on the matter, so keep on typing short stories refuting each other. this is going places.