Yeah I’m pretty sure that’s why SRK made the newbie thread and took away the rep system. That way newer players can ask questions freely and more than likely someone knowledgeable from SRK will respond. Before newer posters had to deal with all of the rules of posting on SRK like no duplicate threads or threads that don’t pertain to gameplay. On something like GameFAQs threads are monitored much less for content and are only really looked at if you sneak in a curse word or use words normally to describe someone’s sexuality. When they get on SRK it’s weird because you’re basically allowed to curse up a storm and have pretty heated debates sometimes. Yet, as you do something like make a topic that says “Ryu is overpowered” not only is every other poster on SRK on your ass and neg you to hell so your reputation is shot from day one… but your topic gets closed for being unnecessary/off topic/duplicate.
Now there’s a thread where people can ask questions or make comments about those kinds of things freely like they are able to do on other threads. Basically there’s a “hold your hand” thread on SRK that is pretty much required these days to get gamers that are normally spoon fed everything something to work with and place where they can breathe and be natural and learn the game on their terms. It’s ok to be a noob now on SRK which is cool since we were all noobs once.
That’s why I feel GGPO is a better training ground. You get a more interpersonal relationship with the people you play. I think the new SFIV lobby system might make it better like that. It’s just the way the game is designed network wise all you do is play faceless people, and when you see a ken you’re like, “OOOH ya, another flow chart motherfucker lets get this over with :rolleyes:.” If the SFIV network system had lobbies and shit in order to have people join rooms and associate with one another I think people would be more willing to help each other. Maybe the new SSFIV game will be conducive to teaching people SF.
I mean who the fuck messages a flow chart ken saying, “Yo, start playing footsies.” Not to mention some of them just plain don’t want to improve because of the gaming generation we are in. Also, I guess its just personality differences, but the non-nurturing environment made me WANT to get better. Remember in the end we all make our own choices as well. A random idiot giving you artificial neg rep shouldn’t deter you from playing a game you like. Shit, I got neg rep bombed by a bunch of retards here, and still would because of my game preference. Is that gonna make me quit the game I like?
Also, I will say that “new players” are sorta being used as a scapegoat by the OP. Capcom chose to water down their games for money. It was their choice to give the finger to the vets who have been filling their wallets with dough for all these years all in order to capitalize on the mass market. Can you really blame new players for that? All they did was buy the shiny game. Not to mention out of the big clusterfuck of new players there are plenty of new players willing to pick up, and learn the older SF games, and appreciate them for what they are. This also adds numbers to the scene for those games. Even though no one cares about them anymore.
It’s also proven that people have different methods of learning that actually applies to them, and some people simply CANNOT learn some ways… it just doesn’t stick.
If I remember correctly the three major types are:
Audio:
You learn best when you hear an idea or concept presented verbally. IE: Someone telling you after your match "Dash up throw is bad, don’t do it."
Visual:
You learn best when you can actually see a concept before your eyes. IE: This is what it looks like when somebody does four back to back AHVBs after a guardbreak timed like this.
Kinetic:
You learn by doing. IE: Ramza yelling at me and showing me videos of people holding down/back in 3s, but me not getting it until I actually DO it and see how easy it is to stand up if you see an overhead.
This brings up another point. Does anyone honestly think SRK members who dropped SF4 over neg rep would have stuck with the game long anyway? Quality over quantity to me. It’s not my sole interest to increase tournament attendance numbers.
but yah VERY GOOD POINT. I suck at math, and the only way I understand that shit is when someone shows me how to do problems. If its explained on the board I just start day-dreaming cuz I never remember/understand it. :xeye:
I’d also like to point out one aspect of the “noob hate”:
This crap is 100% online.
Go to a good arcade or a tourney, be humble, demonstrate that you are eager to learn and you will have nothing but amazing experiences from some of the most helpful and skilled players around.
Its just a matter of seeing someone as a person and relating to them, which really doesn’t exist much online (on SRK) and definitely doesn’t exist when playing on XBL/PSN.
how many posts on srk.com revolve around the fact that games need to be easier?
I can’t execute that. I can’t see that fast. Man, there’s no way I can out think that guy ever. I have to do that to escape, well thats fucking retarded. LOOK all over here on srk.com, its in 90% of threads here to some degree.
developers READ this shit people. They’re taking ideas from places like srk.com and implementing those things into their games to sell more copies. If new members weren’t allowed to post, there would be MUCH LESS of these types of posts going on. Therefore, developers would probably even take a 2nd glance @ them. This will never happen though, people will always be able to post on srk.com regardless of join date.
prior to srk.com, tournament level games weren’t this retarded simple EVER. sf4\BB 6 are a new era of creating games. Instant feedback gained through the internet can yield a better product if it applies to more people. Well, how can we change the game for the better? HEY I KNOW! lets look @ fighting game websites and see what people DON’T like. They’re obviously not listening to veteran players about creating a game because no OG would make sf4 like that. No good SF player would water the game down that bad, even on accident.
because you know the HDR project that sirlin had sole input on (along with ideas taken from tournament players who beta tested with him in the earily builds) didn’t have any problems what so ever.
I wouildn’t be worried about OUR forums causing the easiness of the new games. Most of these games were made in japan and probably had the japan equvilent of gamefaqs that they’re listening to. Like 2chan or something. It seems rather errogent to assume that japanese game designers are going to USA forums for ideas on how to improve their game, and thats assuming that these game designers even know how to read english.
SF is 200x more popular in japan than in the states. I doubt they’re trying to solely aim for the japanese market when pretty much everyone their already plays. so if they’re not just aiming @ the japanese market, where else could the aim @? america. Now, how do well this game to americans? lets see what americans don’t like about SF.
pretty much 90% of the ST OG’s on ggpo hate HDR. All you have to do is go ask them because I have and in a personal setting when its only 2 people talking and not on a forum, I have never had 1 super turbo OG tell me they flat out like HDR. They all hate it, the question is just how much. This obviously isn’t speaking for them all, just the ones I talked to.
I just took fighting games seriously 6 months ago.
Honestly, if a new player puts in a good amount of dedication and wants to really get involved with some old games, then no I don’t see them hurting SF. I do see some new players that complain about some concepts that really should not be complained about at all though, cross ups and stuff. Really, that shouldn’t be complaint about, but I guess I could see why new players would hurt the Street Fighter community.
Prior to sfiv being released, there were only a few tournament games that have been around for a while. ST, mvc2, 3s, cvs2, GG series. For a period of time, like 10 years I believe, You could count on st, mvc2, 3s and cvs2 being in the line up.
When a new player jumped into the scene, there were always the same complaints. Thats really hard to do consistently, the game is too fast etc, no auto correct on DP for st made it hard for people to reversal against vets… these complaints were around prior to sfiv, its just that capcom never did anything to help those players. Why should they? The mentality @ the time was go fucking practice and stop complaining. If there are players who can stop it, you should be able to do the same with practice.
After all these years of the same types of NEWER players complaining about system mechanics, sfiv finally let them have their way for once.
newer players lack the knowledge of what creates a decent fighting game. Just because a newer player has a trouble with execution, they think thats the problem. Well, execution is such a big part of SF that if you were to make it simpler, you’ll be effecting the game as a whole. Execution is a reward you gain through practice and training. Newer players don’t get this, they just want to complain and not practice. They shouldn’t have any type of power to influence a games design what so ever.
I really don’t see how dumbing down a game as old as SF would attract new players in the first place. It’s not like newbies are gonna notice that shit anyway. Nobody who plays games casually is gonna buy SFIV because of auto-correct DP shit is nonsensical. I don’t really see how new players can be responsible for dumbing down anything.
so they dumbed the game down for vets? is that who they did it for? they certainly needed like a 10 frame revesal window when OG ST players can do it one?
man valle really fell off, he needs helps like this!
Missed the point, how is dumbing down a game as old as SF gonna bring new players? Shit is ill informed as fuck, how would new players even know that shit is watered down in the first place when they don’t even play the fucking game? You’re making it seem like there was some massive outcry about the learning curve in SF from casuals. Most casuals don’t give a fuck about becoming good at the game. They don’t care about becoming a Master Street fighter.
