Ok guys, I’m thinking of dropping Strider as I just don’t find him fun anymore. That leaves me with only Nemesis and Doctor Doom. Can anyone help me out here for a good character to use?
What assist are you using with Doomykins?
Plasma
Ever try playing Deadpool? Quick Work unblockables are fun, and I could see some “Plasma Beam lawlTeleport” tricks going on, too.
Tried it, ran it, recommended it to people, stopped playing it.
Just throwing stuff out there. Wesker and his gun, and his Weskerness. Felicia, either low or otg. Vergil is good everywhere, I guess. Jill, for alpha counter swag, a get off me assist, and her and beam are good buddies. Akuma wouldn’t hurt either of them, and he’s a powerful third. Skrull with grudge and X-factor crazyness. Magneto beam and switch to missiles? That’s all I can think of off the top of my brains.
I’ve decided to go with Skrull as anchor, so my team is Nemesis/Doom/Skrull. Issue with Wesker: I got bored of him when I used him and I dislike him being so anchor-centric nowadays. Plus, his DHCs are bad. Issue with Felicia: I just really ****ing hate her theme. Issue with Vergil: A bit too technical for my tastes, as well as too much meter burned. Also, I’m one of those weirdos who won’t use a character if that character is overused(Cept Doom. I’m married to Doom). Issue with Akuma: DHC choices are a bit meh, as I believe Akuma makes a better 2nd character than an anchor, especially with missiles, so I would sacrifice beam for missiles and I’m not quite sold on that. Issue with Jill: Not my cup of tea, and I would rather have her in 1st than 2nd or last. Plus, that’d leave Doom anchor, which is OK at best. Issue with Magneto: None, but meh.
I understand the sentiment about not using overused guys. I’d say my most overused fella is a Vergil I cannot use yet on my alt team, but that is because he extends my Taskmaster combos specifically in a way that allows me to DHC to Chaotic flame for a kill on most characters. Also, Vergil’s Rapid slash can extend Dormammu combos a small amount, and it allows me to maintain a solid zoning game if I want. I do feel guilty, though, and maintain my honor by being a really shitty Vergil for now (I first tried playing him 2 days ago).
I love Skrull, so I definitely like his addition. He’s got dat grudge assist, and abuses X-factor better than most characters barring Wesker and Phoenix, maybe Arthur if you count the infinite blockstun thing. I’m not sure how much Nemesis/Doom would benefit from Tenderizer’s perfect angle for incoming characters, so Orbital Grudge is probly the way to go. But Iunno, can stone smite extend Nemesis or Doom combos easily?
Doom maybe, but not Nemesis. Uses a wall bounce. Nemesis makes better use off of orbital grudge anyways, has decent pressure and sets up for a reset. DHCs are all top notch too
That was what I was thinking, I just don’t exactly know what Doom enjoys. Yeah, grudge does seem like a good fit, though.
Well, I’ve been checking out some things with Nemesis with Shuma assist, out of curiosity. I tried DP H with Shuma assist for a delayed otg, and Nem’s recovery is far too long, and Shuma’s mystic ray is way faster than I thought, though the Shuma assist does catch them every time. Nem just can’t do anything off of it.
What I found I like, but I can’t make any good combos with it.
For one thing, Shuma’s assist can be used as a regular otg if you heavily delay the first air series. Not too flashy, it’s more finicky for a gimmicky version of a Wesker or She-Hulk otg, but unlike those two, Mystic ray does heavily augment Nem’s neutral game. Big ass laser, full screen coverage, and it can relaunch if you time it just right. Not terrible.
And this is much more interesting stuff for combos. If you’ve used up a wall bounce or ground bounce, calling shuma at the same time as standing H and doing either Nem’s DP M or QCF L, they get caught by the shuma assist on both occasions. Does not cause a reset if the combo is early. At the end of combos with a lot of hitstun, you can go straight into hyper, either one if you’re in the right positioning. Problem is, I can’t seem to get high enough damage before the ending, and it seems like a waste to forego a relaunch in some cases to hit with a few specials.
So, to test the theory, I did j.H, cr.M, st.H, DP M, launcher, MMH delay downward DR, land, st.H plus shuma, DP M, BHR. Did 722k. Whoo…
I know I can maximize the damage here, but my problem is more that with the same starter, I did this, j.H, cr.M, st. H, DP M, launcher, MMH delay downward DR, land, relaunch, MMHS, BWA. Simple shite, it did 721k. So, yeah, the tech itself is interesting, but I have found no good way to utilize this for damage at all.
For DHCs, delaying BWA into spikeballs does good damage, and into Hyper Mystic Ray, slightly worse but still decent damage. DHCs from Shuma to Nemesis are pathetic, at best.
As for resets, the specific ones with shuma assist are no better than most. The one interesting one I found works on back and neutral techs, j.M j.S, land and jump again, j.MMH, st. H + Shuma call, DP M, Nem recovers before they touch the ground, but they reset quite close to the floor. If they are blocking from any but the forward techs, they will block a st. L, and then can be caught by a light command throw or lvl 3. Not fantastic, though I have checked a few situations where I had my brother on reset spam foot dive, and Nem will hit first if you time the st.L right, then into launcher, or probly more. On block, throwystuff. On a forward tech, someone with a good air crossup will hit Nem. So, resets are okay, but not uniquely amazing to that combination.
However, I’m not saying Shuma’s terrible for Nem. The odd degrees of extension are not what I’d hope they’d be (I bet a better Nemesis comboer can find some cool stuff with the ability to ground bounce or wall bounce twice), but it’s still a good fullscreen hit that keeps people away and/or still. And it’s not horribly slow, and Shuma’s short, so it’s not too easy to punish. Shuma can also keep Nemesis safe on ground strings, and the Nemesis assists lead to good Shuma stuff, like otg ray with Nem assist for a relaunch all the damn time, and with clothesline rocket, it actually resets them with the punch and the rocket keeps them still, allowing for a really swanky throw reset for Shuma, which drains shit and can be combo’ed off of (I’ve seen some pretty cool Shuma stuff of a throw in combo videos). So, dedicated players of the Tentacle Twins could work them together on a team amazingly. I’m thinking a good anchor for a team like that would be Vergil, Magneto, Wesker, Akuma, Ammy, anything with lockdown, distance, and can extend Shuma’s combos. That said, I am never playing a team with the both of them.
After writing this, I found that you can cr.H, QCF H, st.M, st.H,call shuma, QCF M, Shuma hits, Rocket hits, launch, MMHS, BWA for 744k, still not too great.
I’m pretty sure that NO ONE will be using Shuma because he’s the Roll of this game: No unique features that separates him from the cast or makes him picked over some others. Probably his biggest things are Mystic Smash, which is a poor air dash substitute, Chaos Dimension, which Duke of all people knows is inferior to X-23, and Mystic Ray assists which is, lets face, a super watered down Doom Missles. Honestly, the only use I shuma actually having is taking out missles if Doom is firing them.
Oh, there’s no way I’m using Shuma when there’s a much better unblockable-user that I actually know how to play. And my liking of Shuma comes from the fact that his cr. H can be jump cancelled, and that his mystic smash in the air is overhead and seems to have a few plus frames, those together make for scary shite. If he was more mobile I’d think he was amazing, but as it is, he’s great at mixing up, and yet he can’t get close easily. I wanted to see if his assist had some crazy-awesome properties for Nem, and I was a bit disappointed.
Sorry for the repeated posts, but this Shuma/Nem thing was eating at me some more, so I had to lab it some more. And I actually figured out how to do damage with Nem and Shuma, my current incarnation is,
j.H, st.H, DP M, st. MH, QCF L, dash if necessary, st.H, then immediately call shuma, same time calls and shuma before Nem cause droppage, rocket hits, launch, air HS, BWA, 824k. I can add a few normals in a few gaps, but they lower the damage.
With Wesker assist for more killyness (sort-of a random anchor with an otg kinda thing), it goes the whole thing I just typed up until the launch, air MHS, call wesker, and then whatevs, but I did cr. H, rocket, PUNCH HIM, for 846k, or 839k without the j.H (skipping the opening j.H makes the timing WAY easier on the air MHS). I occasionally get more, like 855 or 862, but it’s based off of how many hits the shuma assist lands, so I’m going with a conservative estimate. And different followups to the otg seem to do more damage on occasion, but so little extra that it’s not too important.
So, Nem and Shuma have damage, by Shuma bridging the gap in which people would fall out of M or H clothesline rockets. Still, situational, but cool looking. The DHC is not bad, pumps the earlier combo to 1 mill, didn’t check for the second one. Still, eh, not learning the team. But now I have closure.
Don’t know how much of a necro this, but I’d like the input on a new team i’ve been thinking up for a while now…
One night I tried to find who else could fit in a theme with Nemesis for some giggles and managed to create a Nem/Ammy/Vergil team.
(With all their alts, the team has a Halloween vibe going on. Nemesis = Zombie, Talbain Ammy = Werewolf, Possessed Vergil = Vampire *A bit of a stretch but whatever)
From my time lurking the Nemesis forums, I know that both Ammy and Vergil are good pairings for nemesis, but what I can’t seem to decide on is what the order should be. Both Ammy and Vergil are very good seconds and anchors, so I’m at a loss. I’m leaning more towards Ammy on second simply because I feel Nemesis and Ammy have much better DHC compatibility then Nemesis and Vergil.
Also, I’m not really sure of any good Vergil, Nemesis tech. His assists is a really GTFO assist, and does well to extend combos, but thats about all I can see…
Any and all input is welcome; being my first post and all I hope to make the most out of it.
Hrm, both good orders.I just picked up ammy assist with Nemesis. It’s good, but I spent all my recent time coming up for ways for X-23 to use the assist, so I have very little cool tech with Nem/Ice yet. But, thinking of who should go on second, I’d say you should choose based upon who would want the Nemesis assist and the third’s assist more.
For Ammy second, she’d have Nem sometimes and Vergil most times, I bet there’s some relaunch capabilities there, and Ammy can use Vergil to tell them to back off after a blocked string, or in the corner, set up an easy attempt at her instant overhead. Vergil on anchor would be damn good, it’s Vergil, and his assist could help Nemesis keepaway really damn well. Hulks beware.
For Vergil second, he’d have ice and a bounce from Nem if he’s still alive. The Nem assist will definitely help Vergil’s combos, just make sure to keep the bounce in question unused, and the Nem assist would allow Vergil to have a bigger conversion off a helm breaker. Ammy ice would be crossup heaven for Vergil, but he does have that as an anchor too. Ammy on anchor here would be, well, Ammy anchor, both choices for last are pretty godlike anchors.
For the DHC, I’ll lab it later, but maybe swords can get more damage.
I’ve actually gotta go right now, but I have a bit more to type.
I recommend Ammy 2nd actually. Veil of Mist DHC is amazing when combo’d with Bio Weapon Assault. I’ve done extensive testing with it and there is a LOT you can get out of it. Setups, mild combos, resetting the DHC-ing back to 1. Plus, Vergil anchor is pretty good.
Vergil assist = Great for Nemesis keepaway and ground control.
Hey Gil, I meant to lab this, but I have been working and other stuff since 8 hours ago, and I’mma sleep soon, because I gots work in the morning. DHCing Veil off of BWA, is there a way to get more damage than Big Ammysplosion DHC without throwing a ton of meter out the window? I’m thinking there might be something there with her abuse of the extra ground bounces, or perhaps lightning with Ammy sword (the original lightning loop, thank you very much).
I think finding the most damage off one extra meter is key to who goes second in this team, as either anchor wants that meter BAD, and whoever pulls out the most damage with the least amount of meter lets Nem get free kills off of bnbs, all while setting up a Dark Someone for the helpless opponent.
Here’s the deal with Veil of Mist. After a throw combo, you can get a few things. You get an instant free tag into a person of your choice. If it’s someone with an OTG you Tag to them on the 2nd or 3rd Rocket. If it’s someone with a large tag in hitbox, they can usually get something in the corner from the tumble the tag gives. Such as Nemesis, Sentinel, Chris and others. The other important aspect of Veil of mist is that it almost solidifies Nemesis grab resets. I don’t have Ammy combos so I couldn’t really check, but pretty much anyone with an OTG move that you can combo afterwards you can make use of this. Nemesis combo too. And yes, you can burn a lot of meter, but it still lets you get up to 4 meters spent on damage(1 dedicated to Mist).
Thanks for the input! I went back to the lab and played around with the DHCs a bit and I found that Bioweapon Assault into Ammy Rush does more damage then Vergil’s Dimension Cut. With mashing and praying to the gods the second and third rockets hit in Bioweapon Assault, I can get around 907,000 damage off of a simply Nemesis BnB. At this point, doing as much damage with Nemesis before he dies is my main concern simply because I don’t think I know Ammy and Vergil enough to pull out a win if he dies too early.
However, when I began to play around more with Vergil’s DHC, I found that Bioweapon Assault into Vergi’s Swords can, I think, begin Vergil’s Sword Loop Combos. I haven’t gotten them completely down yet, but from what I can tell, by DHCing I can completely forgo the OTG assist needed to start the loop and go straight into the loop from the bounce off of Bioweapon Assault. I wasn’t able to completely finish the loop, but I figured that it was because I don’t know the whole combo, I’m wondering if this is even possible, or am I just barking up the wrong tree entirely…
Also, this Veil stuff sounds interesting. Now I have to go into the lab and see what I can dish out with a Vergil OTG (I still don’t know much about Ammy, does she even have a self OTG move? I’m thinking its her 3H with glaive but I’m not sure).