I wouldn’t say this game is more 3rd strike-esque. It’s an interesting combination that lies somewhere between 3S and ST. Fireballs are actually very good in this game, whereas they were essentially free meter for the opponent in 3S (they had a few spacing uses if we’re being pedantic, but largely they weren’t a threat). That is a huge difference that heavily affects the neutral game, and makes it the game play differently than 3S. The fireballs, however, aren’t as dominating as they were in ST either. Most non-fireball characters have some method to go through them.
What I love about this game so far is that they seem to have taken the best things from each version and made it work together.
-Good fireballs, high damage and stun (not ST high but high), and single meter and super from ST
-A sort of alpha counter from the Alpha series
-EX moves and buttons mattering a lot from 3S
-A way to cancel moves for a cost and a tempered “revenge” mechanic from SFIV.
Because he is bad. all that on paper theory crafting sounds good until you actually play the game, and play necalli for a significant timeframe. 2-3 people who play the character who could play anyone and still compete at high levels is not a good judge of what necalli can do. and if you actually watch the games they play, with a critical eye, you will notice that they work a lot harder than others to win. (when playing other top players of their caliber).
Can he win? yes. Can he win a major? no. Why? Because all of his dmg is off of a hard read. a clean jump in, a dash up punish (which is very fast admittedly). The problem lies in being able to do this to an equal player best of set. Which is very difficult. he shines in the corner. /golfclap. so does nearly every other mid/high tier character who does not have to work as hard. so to bank a major off of the ability to pseudo “vortex” someone to death with his high burst dmg is not realistic.
There is a lot of theory crafting and such from people who do not actually play necalli. I encourage anyone and everyone who thinks he is good, to play him consistently. You will change your tune. I damn near gaurantee it. Especially if you experiment with other characters.
As an aside: because of his on paper attributes, yes technically he has the tools to win. The problem is real world scenarios. So yea, haitani and pr balrog and such will do good. can you honestly say it’s the character? no. Will they be playing necalli in a year? not if they expect to win. There is no scenario where you can say “boy i wish i was necalli right about now” that you can’t say with other characters who can do that, and better. At best you can say corner game is top 3. nothing to sneeze at. But in the end, i ask again can you win a major like that? Not with him. You’re going to need a character who can do more.
I’ve had a lot of different opinions on Necalli, at first I thought he was extremely strong, then I thought he was pretty weak.
Right now I have him as pretty strong, and very much a tournament viable character.
Its just so easy to open people up with him. Sure he has weak neutral but this game isnt as footsie based as people make it out to be as far as i can tell.
explain if you don’t mind what you mean that this game isn’t footsie based. how is it not? when all the characters who have strong fundamental buttons are the best in game? Also what is your definition of opening people up with him, and how is it easy? Example: Karin , how do you open up a karin w/o the aforementioned methods (which aren’t reliable or safe) ? When you say tourney viable i agree. unless you mean specifically he can win a major or hell be in a grand finals? Curious. i don’t know what we agree or disagree on. edit i read what you wrote on other page. i don’t see how that is not footsies. or maybe my definition of when i hear the term footsies is different. i don’t see how you can effectively play “keep away” w/o having the buttons and abilities(Which are included in footsies for me) to do so.
This game is very offensive and I think Necalli thrives in this system. You say it’s all theory crafting and the character can never win a major and yet Haitani just got 4th place at Final Round and basically choked against Tokido - he easily could have made grand finals. The Japanese all think highly of this character and Momochi listed him top 3. I have no idea how you can say this character is bad and can’t win a major.
my G you just said some generalized ass shit like this game isn’t as footsie based as people make it out to be. i’m asking you to explain that. cuz i disagree wholeheartedly and dunno where you get that idea. then on top of that you say some shit like necalli can open people up so easily. my question is explain that to. you just saying a whole lot of nothing, then try to pawn it off as dissmisive or what not? you was doing that same stupid shit in the cammy thread. if you gonna say something then get called to explain yourself, don’t backtrack and shoo it under the rug. Or think that you talking to people who dont have an understanding of games, or hadn’t played games at high levels. (been around the block few times my friend). I genuinely want to know what your mindset is because hey, even though i been around forever playing these games at decent levels, maybe some new perspective might help me. and if you kept reading you’d see what exactly i mean by footsie and leave the floor to you to maybe shed some light on what you talking about in relation to my example and what i am thinking when i hear the term. w/e.
because normals are pretty stubby and its often way harder to whiff punish on reaction in v than in previous titles.
when you look at a lot of characters who have good pokes, they really use it as a preemptive tool, perhaps in a zoning way.
without super many characters simply don’t get much off a poke. cammy does, because she gets an arrow which lets her pressure, which is the real key for her.
I don’t know how you aren’t sure how Necalli opens people up easy. He has good frame traps, a throw an amazing overhead and a cmd grab.
I’m always happy to explain anything I say as long as you show me you aren’t going to derp all over the conversation. Its not worth the frustration if you aren’t aware of your use of logical fallacies.
So I am at 5k all with Necalli and he is not bad at all. I don’t know where this is coming from, but I personally think he is great. Is he the best character in the game? Absolutely not, but this character has all of the right tools to win a major. I never thought upon release that I would actually click with a character such as Necalli. I thought he looked boring from the trailers, but when I finally got my hands on him, he had everything I wanted in the character. More so than any other character in the cast. I love that I can play footsies with him, anti air consistently, and be a bully all at the same time. He is just a MONSTER. Yes, there are some harder matchups, but no matchup seems like a legit struggle. I just feel some characters beat him in the neutral and you have to play more patient, but at the same time he can hold his own too.
This character is great, mark my words. No character in SF5 is bad.
I don’t know to much about Alex. This is how i view Necalli and his mu’s without going into reasons why i feel this way.
He simply imo has to work to hard to win consistently over time, and that will translate into poor tourney results compared to the other cast. Again the Haitani argument means nothing to me, because there are exceptions to every rule(xian’s gen, gamerbee’s adon, prbalrog’s rog, etc etc). And I hold fast to he (haitani) will need to switch toons for him to see consistent positive results as necalli as the game grows older. I don’t understand why people who play him consistently would think otherwise. I believe this will be one of those things where time will tell the tale. Did i say he was dan? no. I said he can compete, and he can be played. But let’s not sit here and say he is one of the best, or he is “strong” or that he is godlike when he powers up. It gets old to constantly see that.
My definition of bad is this: a character who has to fight uphill battles constantly, will have limited high placings in major tourneys, and won’t sustain the test of time. Definition of good is this: a character who has nearly nothing but 5-5s or better, and can win a major, and can dictate the pace of any match vs nearly anyone. Riddle me this: You know how when you’re playing a game or a set in a tourney, how someone might swap toons to favor a matchup that is just to hard for their primary main char? Do you think that anyone would ever “swap” to necalli to close out a deal because there tourney char has it rough?
6-4
Birdie Cammy Chun Li Karin Nash R.Mika.
5.5-4.6
Ken Ryu
5-5
M.Bison Vega Zangief Laura
6-4 (Necalli)
Fang Dhalsim Rashid
This game like all others is highly subjective. Time will tell the tale.
To be fair, there was almost no talent at Hypespotting compared to the last two big tournaments. I do think that Necalli is pretty decent though. Playing Alex for the past few days has really made me appreciate being able to go in and go ham with Necalli.
The thing is, I think most of Necalli’s matchups are 5-5s. I’m not sure if I agree with your bad match-ups, but who knows, over time you could be proven right. What’s the consensus on Necalli’s bad matchups? I think it’s still too early to tell. I suspect Birdie is a tough one though.
cr.hp has mediocre hitboxes and does only a little over half the damage? It’s slower outside of VT? His DP is reliable as an anti-air while cr.hp isn’t as you’ll trade a lot.
I’ve been messing around with him a bit in an attempt to find a some solid backup characters. One thing that stands out to me as being sort of shitty for him is that 2 and 5 Hp launch on counter hit. That means you get less damage for the counter than for the regular confirm. Doesn’t really make sense but whatever