My training mode adventures

Classic Fighting Games Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
1

I’ve discussed in the online players thread how I’ve spent more time in training mode recently. That’s been helping but I feel that I need to have a structured practice strategy so that I can consistently improve and chart my improvement. With that in mind, I’ve made a list for the three characters I play most and what I need to practice every day. This will evolve over time as I get better at the game and learn more, but for now these are all things I feel need daily practice to become 100% consistent. There will be some overlap between characters since some of these things are pretty general. There’s also a couple “figure out how this shit works” thrown in there, I’ll drop those and start practicing the answer once I know the answer.

Chun
hit confirms - cr mk, back fierce, close standing roundhouse, standing mp, jump in roundhouse and fierce, UOH (standing and crouching dummy for all, add in random parry at some point)

kara throw

interact with divekicks (parry, find out when to standing jab crouching jab sa2, see what else works)

practice counterpokes (have dummy throw out various pokes at random times, react appropriately)

practice parries - low parry then punish, parry various characters jump ins, red parry, specials, and supers. notable things to work on for now - Ken’s target combo red parry, Necro drill kick, Necro spin thing red parry, Akuma RH tatsu red parry, Yun’s setups into Genei Jin ending with shoulder red parry, Dudley jump in RH

mixup after SA2, learn setups and practice them

explore every way to deal with jumps ins, especially character specific difficult ones (parry, dash under, crouch under, option select crouch/parry, maybe backdash?)

Record Chun mirror dummy throwing out pokes and interact with them

Ken
hit confirms - cr mk, short short, short jab short, UOH, back mk overhead, target combo + shoryu x2, target combo SA3, cr mp, standing mp, standing and crouching fierce

kara throw

practice counterpokes and parry situations

set up Chun li dummy, interact with common situations (fierces, mks, standing and crouching roundhouses, kara throw)

execution - cr mk into jab shoryu, max damage combo after jump in

find situations where short short SA3 is viable and cr mk SA3 is not, learn when to use each (this may not be possible in training mode, may have to come from real matches)

Ryu
hit confirms - cr mk, short short, short jab short, UOH, standing close mk, standing fierce, crouching fierce (hit confirm into SA1, SA2, and high damage punishes)

cancel fireball into denjin

hit confirm cr mk into roundhouse tatsu

crouching or standing fierce, ex donkey kick, roundhouse tatsu or appropriate finish depending on screen location

find out if he has useful kara grab, practice if so

That’s all I have for now. If you have any comments, I will definitely appreciate them. If you’ve got more useful ones to add, or maybe “that’s fucking stupid don’t practice that” or whatever else. I’ll post here and there about how this is going, what I’m seeing improve over time, maybe offline match footage showing how this affects actual gameplay. Not sure if anyone will care about this lol, but I suppose if we have a couple “watch me play online and help me improve” threads there can be a “training mode all day err day” thread.

Things I’ve learned from day 1 - my hit confirms are way worse against Urien. like horribly worse. which tells me I confirm mostly off sound I guess? I have not conditioned myself to react to that metallic noise. he’s the only character that makes a different noise on block, right?

2

for chun you are missing sggk, and far rh super link is useful too, need to use that.

and I wouldn’t try to rely on jab supering parried divekicks, standing rh comes out in 4 frames, I would use that instead.

or make em land on a meaty low forward.

jab super needs to be used against like yangs mantis slashes when they are red parried. ibukis toward forward move on parry, and uriens jumping rh on parry etc. etc.

also use it if you feel a shoto is baiting you to parry so he can dp, so like say he throws out a cr forward wanting you to parry so he can then cancel into uppercut, you would use cr jab>sa2 there because the jab would beat the srk.

also find out what moves can be punished just from blocking, like stand blocking a UOH gives you a free reversal super etc. etc.

3

Jab only. Startup should be the same every punch strength, only diff is speed/where fireball comes and stays out. LP the best wall for them to deal with. Unless you find out more with using varied speed, (Back Throw) Corner wakeup meaty going over/behind them, to give your opponent even more to think about than Jab Hadoken coming from the front. Probably not HP, it would be way too fast, distance spacing. Then blockstring into Denjin, lots of various kinds is really good to learn. See ROYDROYDROYD youtube tutorial, has the good stuff in why a certain SRK strength for shifty placement of your Ryu automatically. The game wants you to hit the Denjin if you set it up right.

Make sure they’re standing! crMK to LK Tatsumaki is… “Safer” in different ways such as avoid flying over them for non combo, same knockdown pressure if it hits or the slight lull if spaced max distance, can be a jungle parryxget yours window. Very unsafe, use sparingly of course. Not a BnB.

Its Only ->MP overhead so it may be natural to your finger placement to do it easily enough, or maybe not if you’re more used to Chun and MK. Don’t play those 2 characters back to back too much and wonder why no Kara throw. It also helps you option parry throw(from neutral) or if you’re the type to already be walking up throwing anyway, hold forward-> then MP to throw may be natural? Best do it from neutral as a clean input, this is just a note on holding towards changes the normal to command normal so be wary if you ever forget and things aren’t working.

Ryu also gets less than Ken from MP’s, crouch or standing far. But never forget those are important Ryu tools/buttons to fall back on or push to their limits as part of a footsie toolset. They are used defensively more than Ken’s.

Took out the 3rd line of the quoted stuff didn’t know if you meant only after Denjin Stun, I might have some misconceptions myself so talking it over & thinking about it, or someone else with more knowledge is welcome to chime in. And look at that, tons of words, with probably no training regimen! Talk Strike!

4

With shotos don’t forget that short jab short can be a red parry bait because cr.lp can be parried high and low. It’s good to know who will eat a cr. short X3. Also there are a few that short jab short will not fully combo on. Remember that you can walk forward a smidge and do UOH into super on stand or crouch after a short jab short. Meaty UOH on wake up is nasty and leads to a few different options with all the shotos. Great way to land (hit confirm) a double srk or SA3 in the corner with Ken. If you connect a jumping hk really high, high enough it makes it tricky to get in a low normal, you can cancel directly into super. Not terribly difficult to hit confirm. Particularly useful with Ken but any of them can use it.

Ken
-Definitely play around with jumping mk crossups. Get a feel for doing it meaty on wake up and also how one can press the button at different times to cross or not. Crossup mk into target leads to powerful bnb. Play with his post SA3 ambiguous cross up (unblockable haha).
-A nasty option select on wake up is cr.lk st.lp but buffer a lp srk into the st.lp, negative edge helps for me cuz of my slow fingers. If they are standing it should combo on some of the cast. I think you input a tap forward throw incase they are crouching. Great in the corner for the double srk potential.
-It’s possible to hit confirm srk off of cr.mk. Obviously this is made even more powerful by getting his mid screen kara lp srk down. Make sure you can do regular double lp srk in the corner without fail. Alex cannot be double srked and the twins (a few others?) need to be karaed in the corner.
-I don’t put a fireball in my target to SA3 but figure out which you prefer, there is a gain of 1 damage for the fireball and it gives a bit more time for the confirm. Personally I tend to throw the fireball out by accident sometimes when the TC is block then eventually I get parried and ouch. A safe follow up for TC can be EX fireball to keep them at that nice distance if you can spare the meter.
-See if you can get a feel for stopping his TC at the cl.mp. It leaves you in frame advantage and gives you some further mixup potential. A cr. mp followup into hit confirm can catch those trying to counter or get in on you. Walk up throw works great. Walk up a bit but not too close and cr.lk X2 is good too.
-You must be able to whip out st.hp mp.srk SA3 on command. It does beefy damage and also builds a good amount of meter. Go to punish unless you need to use a cr.mk instead of st.hp for the extra distance gained.

Ryu
-If they are waking up a walk back a bit then f.st.mp into ex fb will hit many crouching characters. Good to add into okizeme.
-You must use his kara throw as part of wake up and tick game.
-A bit unsure but it seems like most low parrys, even from farish, can be followed up with a cr.hp into ex step kick. You can hit limbs that are way out there and the step kick will close the distance. Tapping down for the cr.hp then neutral then doing the step kick motion is helpful for me to make sure the normal gets out there quickly.
-Jumping hp/hk into SA1 before they land can work. If they parry you can hk tatsu.

All things to be practiced. Some more difficult than others. Hope this helps. Apologies for the length.

5

Do dash jab short short super with shotos. Can double as a crouch tech and jab is faster than short and stuff attempts. Better than short jab short imo

6

thanks guys for all the stuff, will add it and work on it. no need to apologize on the length, it’s all helpful and I appreciate it.

7

I have never been able to hit confirm Ken cr.mk. I’m 99% sure it’s witchcraft.

8

Something that took me a while to get used to when practicing in training mode was the progression from muscle memory to visual/audio recognition to smooth reflex. Maybe this is obvious to everyone but here we go anyway.

Use auto block to get the hang of the raw execution of the combos down pat. Then going to random block to practice specific hit confirms till the success rate is very high. To practice wake up meaties you’ll need no block for timing or random block for recognition. Then continuing with random block but just going wild jumping/crossing/dashing/walking around mixing various options up at a fast pace. Then even hitting arcade mode to try to get some of these down in a vaguely real match (very optional). Then trying things in ranked where people wont kick you out for fucking around. Then eventually using these new tools in your best play without thinking to hard about it. The process can seem grueling but its well worth it, as you know.

9

applied everything you guys added and ran through tonight. it’s a pretty long sit down actually. fun though.

not much to report so far. hit confirms have always been hard for me and they continue to be hard. Chun’s cr mk isn’t even 100% accuracy on standing opponents so as you can imagine not much else is either. I’ll keep at it. it does keep getting better. I’d say I’m like 90% with Chun’s cr mk on standing, and close to 100% on crouching dummy.

confirming Chun’s back fierce into SA2 feels so good. there’s a satisfying thunk sound on the other guy’s body. lol.

some questions:

is Chun’s standing strong confirmable? feels really hard.

when Akuma goes for demon flips, it seems like hitting standing jab or standing roundhouse stops all the possibilities. is that accurate or have I just not explored this enough?

10

If the gouki players presses a kick button early in his demon flip your gona trade or he will hit you if you mistime your jab or standing rh.

Its possible on a crouching opponent. On standing its expectation to hit+confirming.

11

ryu low forward.
honestly i would not even bother trying to hit confirm it.

you confirm that a low forward will hit by watching the opponent when you start the move. if they just started walking, if they just whiffed a move. if they’re in startup for something.

you’re not going to hit confirm really anything you mentioned into any super.
your doable hit confirm normals are close strong and close forward. towards fierce also with sa2. and the others sa2 also. i think sa1 is like 5 frames startup. you can’t link it.

a lot of the other stuff you mentioned are cancels. and you need to input that stuff very early. ryu doesn’t have any fancy cancel frames like chun li’s low forward. and he doesn’t have ken’s target combo.

depending on spacing you can use whatever normal xx hadou to hit confirm. never do that in the corner since the pushback isn’t enough to make it safe on block. midscreen depending on what you do it is quite safe against any big punish i can think of.

12

Hit confirming shoto low forward is not witchcraft or whatever it is possible to visually confirm it. You have to train yourself to see it and when you do you will know that you actually confirmed it because the animation of the hit character is different depending on when you cancel the low forward into super. The one you always see is the fast cancel that happens asap off of low forward. If you wait like a few frames or something to cancel it, the hit character will look different. This is what you train yourself to see. Idk if it is really humanly possible to learn this shit on OE cause its crap but after sitting in an arcade long enough you can tell

13

oops thought I already thanked everyone for the last batch of posts; I appreciate it.

I’ve had difficulty on those Ryu confirms and yeah it seems exactly like Tebbo said. most of Chuns have been going well (still a little sketchy on close roundhouse but pretty sure this is an execution issue on my end) and Ken’s confirms are going better minus cr mk which I just expect to take a long time before I ever get good at it. from all accounts and what everyone has said it isn’t an easy confirm. Ken’s cr mp, standing far mp, and target combo are all getting more accurate as I put time in though, so I’m happy about that.

I went through a couple day period recently where I just could not get things to come out. I’d throw out Chun buttons and confirm and super just did not come out. had to step back, watch my hands while doing it a bunch, then come back. it’s amazing how bad execution habits can easily get ingrained in your hands after just a bit of time. think I’ve got it sorted out now anyway. gets pretty frustrating throwing out a Chun cr mk and confirming and watching literally nothing happen afterward.

my execution is still way better when I’m on the left side of the screen than when I’m on the right. I’m going to start beginning my training mode sessions on the right side of the screen for every character. my quarter circles are jerky and rough, my reactions and hands feel slower, and stuff comes out correctly less often. getting both sides of the screen where they need to be on basic execution will be my goal until I get that sorted out.

oh here’s a question: I notice that sometimes in standing hitstun there are different animations. sometimes they look like they’re crouching after the hit, sometimes they’re standing. what causes this and does it affect how long I have to cancel the move?

14

sorry jblair, but I def feel like hit confirming shoto c.mk is the loch ness monster of 3s. lots of people claim to do it well but nobody does it consistently. I believe a few people can call on it in clutch situations (TOP Ken players) but its not something that should get lumped in with koshkosh, or any of the links. if you aren’t top I wouldn’t spend too much time on it. I sure don’t :stuck_out_tongue:

15

I like that loch ness analogy.

It’s probably there… But you gotta be a really sick explorer to find it.

Most people need to finish cub scouts first before they think of exploring.

16

Hm. So if it’s that hard to confirm then when I see it in tournament play, what’s happening? I have two guesses.

  1. they’re throwing out the cr mk and buffering the second quarter circle + drumming. so if the other guy dashes on it, walks onto it, or gets counterpoked, you automatically get super but otherwise it’s just a whiff cr mk and super never comes out. and in that case it would only be useful when you’re whiffing, you wouldn’t put it on top of someone because if they block super would come out.

  2. what Tebbo described a few posts ago. they’re not hit confirming but they are looking for the other guy to stand up, walk forward, or hit a button. when they see one of those, they cancel into super.

one of these, both of these, or is there more?

17

both plus ded. its not impossible to confirm, but you got bigger fish to fry.

youd be surprised how much more you can see when playing on a jpn cabinet. you are basically inside the world of 3rd strike. theres many things you cant see or even notice when watching videos.

i dont know the exact mechanics of it, but confirming into shoryu is much easier. id say its more useful too. at least if you mess up you didnt blow a whole jinrai.

remember that when playing vs a good ken, hit confirming low forward is just begging to get your blocked cr mk reversaled. :slight_smile:

18

there’s also a difference between entirely going off a hit, as in you’re not really prepared for a hit and reacting to the hit, and being pretty sure they’re going to get a hit. due to whatever you expect them to do. makes a difference in your reaction.

there are definitely transcendent moments too. where you see stuff you don’t normally react to. and like ryan said, it’s quite a different experience on versus city. the screen is huge and your face is right in the screen. it eats up most of your peripheral vision. you notice things easier than on any other sort of setup.

19

AirMailing Arcade cabs to many dropoff locations in all regions of Mongolia

A real 25th Anniversary of Street Fighter, Worldwide 990512 for all

Its late - I’m dreaming

20

Give me some money and free time. Help me make the money and the free time, I’ll get as many cabs out as I possibly can.

But that’s for another time.