MvCI Meta and Tier Discussion

Dormammu

Better burrow? Traps? How? Normals? How? I’m talking range and count. Boulder trap loops and grenade rocket skate confirms were life. (hard as fuck at first but shit if I can do it.) If he had these tools with these mechanics? Shiiiiet. The loss of log trap alone is a big deal. Even his small gun was better and faster in UMVC3.

RR is trash, Ryu is still trash

That is all

Finally got to see Coles Arthur. Thought it was gonna be Jason cole, lol.

But yeah the dude was doing a lot of stuff I’m talking about, specifically the bottle zoning was real. I didn’t agree with his use of golden armor though… Arthur gets more powerful in golden armor but with chip not being great it really doesn’t matter that much. Arthur is there to setup his teammate and frustrate the opponent and the regular armor seems to do a good enough job of that.

Arthur has the true keepaway cheese. He can bottle to hit the ground and air right in front of him, or he can dagger to hit the area on the other side of the screen.

Right now my only problem with Arthur is all the stuff that people have to disrespect his zoning like teleports and armoured moves. Luckily though, with super jump Arthur becomes even more viable… but still… things like teleport into power stone are incredibly strong as it ports directly to Arthur and gives a free easy ass conversion.

Thinking about using powerstone or reality on Arthur to try and counteract the port cheese.

Reality.

that nerf to his rocket skates was huge. like why

I’d go with power.

Random notes (some courtesy of Yipes commentary)

  • Dante reset isn’t real. Can just upback to get out of it which forces a lighter reset/conversion at best.

  • As seen in that tweet, apparently Dorm’s level 3 creation lets you up back out of it for some reason.

  • Spencer’s c.LK is now plus one on block. Which according to Yipes means it forces you into a 50/50 everytime you block it.

  • Supposedly tags have faster start up than jabs. Not sure exactly what that means but the tags do seem really fast.

  • Thanos’ big punch level 1 either doesn’t scale or scales very little.

Burrow is faster frame wise and his traps are bigger and cover more ground than the spec on the screen boulder/shrapnel/net trap used to take up. You can actually confirm full combos off them now, and his normals have better reach/coverage (he has legit lows now). Log trap and rocket skates are not as important anymore since movement across the board has been nerfed. Super jumping/tridashing is not as good anymore, and now you can use traps and stones (time, power, reality or space) to punish obvious approach angles. I cannot stress enough how good the stun gun is. It’s like Strange’s new bolts where you can convert a random hit from fullscreen into a full combo. That is huge for Rocket, since confirming clean hits was one of his biggest problems in 3 (part of why he needed log trap then).

Would Space Storm be an effective way for Nemesis to create untechable resets? You might be able to score a position/angle where they always tech into the grab.

Nemesis punchy party scales, at which point every hit lands except the last. It’s only in higher damage combos so it’s risky going for it without tag or ending the round.

And Space Gem is a meme. Nem is better off with Time/Reality/Power.

I prefer better movement options, but maybe you have a point since the game is fundamentally changed, shut you could lay the same trap in umvc3 in this you have to keep track. I still say coon from umc3 would be better than this coon, shut I had no problems confirming off traps and with tac infinites/partners/assists conversion was not a problem.

Just a different character overall.

(You can see I really liked umvc3 lol)

So if you’re playing a space stone team vs a reality stone team, what are the best counters to someone who spams reality stones once you have them in the space stone cage?

Reflect it and rush them down and they’re basically fucked. They’re forced to make it frame trap themselves. They won’t be able to get another one out unless they mash super out of your pressure

Wait for it and beam them in the face into a tag combo.

Reality stone just went down the stone tier list for me. Teams with strong teleports and movement like F.Champ’s out run it and then can just teleport into the space where you can’t use it unless you tag and make yourself vulnerable. Ultron has beam that pretty much erases it off the screen. Plus once people get better at reflecting and pressuring that isn’t going to help. The storm is good if you’ve already got a big lead, but it isn’t going to make huge damage comebacks unless people come up with some tech for combos that hasn’t already been seen. It ends up making people drop out of combos more than anything.

It’s good at covering spots on the screen, but it’s going to require more nuanced use to get the most out of at top level play. Time Stone surge into tag will likely be more legitimately scary to abuse. Like if you put Dorm/Ultron with Reality I don’t think it makes the team as strong as Dorm/Ultron with Space. They can already cover plenty of neutral without a low durability, slow fireball that dissipates against good movement.

There will be good teams with the stone, but can’t see it being end game with the very visible counters to the surge and a storm that doesn’t look amazing for comebacks.

Space Stone won the Combofiend vs Champ exhibition and now it has also won the first major. Safe to say it’s the early best stone for tournaments at least.

Simply put, reality stone surge is great against those with limited movement options (no teleport) and low durability non multi hitting projectiles. Like everything else Doom Missiles like. If you’re on point with your movement with superior characters it’s not as much of a threat. Most people just suck right now so reality it is.

Space stone is amazing against those who can’t spam outside the box and still decent if you have a teleport. The surge can just screw people up in general and get you a free combo. (or get you combo’d if you abuse it)

Time stone surge I think is dope for people that need a way in and for those that need a way out. It’s use will be specific to the matchup. The storm itself needs to be explored more.

Power stone is good but imo and when people find more optimal setups I’m sure it will be key to some ridiculous combo extensions.

Mind…sucks…I tried to like it. It’s at the bottom of the list for me. Storm is dope but the surge is practically non existent in practicality.

It’s still good for okizeme, JWong made good use of it against ChrisG in the corner, but then again Chris’ team wasn’t like what you’re describing. Justin essentially done a combo into a knockdown, did Reality Surge and tagged into his partner keeping his partner safe, so as long as it’s a hard knockdown or the setup is right it’s still strong for oki, just not as useful in the neutral like you’ve pointed out.

Is it possible to perfect pushblock it on wakeup, every character has get up crouch frames where it seems you can input some shit if you don’t roll. If this is true, reflecting that oki will not be hard in the long run.

Reflecting is just parry timing anyway, it’s not that difficult if you’re expecting it. But good question I’m gonna check that out later. I’m pretty sure you could reflect it.