My sentiments exactly.
And maybe we can go back to discussing what this thread is about instead of bitching now.
Agreed, but Wolverine also has over 100k more health and the ability to relaunch opponents without using an assist.
If X-23’s hops had any invincibility on them, she would be GDLK.
The good thing about x-23’s hyper is that it goes through projectile hypers, which is like most of them, so you opponent has to think twice before trying to chip you out with one or doing a random hyper.
But I do agree, that alone does not make her upper tier, her damage output and stamina is way too low
Low damage is negated by her mobility and ability to stay in, once she stays in
Low stamina is a nonissue. Phoenix has way lower health and everyone dies in like 3 combos anyway except Sentin- everyone dies in 3 combos.
But at the moment, X-23 is outshined by Wolverine. He’s more effective. This could change later down the games life though.
Well Wolverine pretty much rapes face on anyone without a projectile game I feel. He’s basically super fast Sent with everything safe on block and if he hits you easy mode combos into huge damage. He can get lamed out…but that’s like the only way to fight him. You can’t out rush his rush, he’s just going to rip you to shreds. For the rape Wolverine can do once he gets in I would hope he has trouble with projectiles. Good lawd.
I haven’t played post patch sentinel. We were playing 1.01 last night. I’m taking a wait and see approach.
Life/Damage adjustments are lazy man’s balancing. The real reason scrubs QQ’d over sentinel is still there= super/hyper armor moves into BBCE RP Super for like 50-60%. That and level 3 xfactor.
I also think sentinel is best when he’s off the screen. Used for an assist and brought in at special moments to do DHC’s, counter hypers and whatever.
His matchups against characters that blew him up if/when they got in won’t change much. Wolverine getting in= dead sentinel no matter what, it’ll just take one less reset or a couple less meters.
What WILL hurt is his matchups against the characters who had to try to outzone him to win. Chris, Deadpool, MODOK, Arthur. Ammy is in this group too, so his matchup against her will be even worse.
He’s still gonna be solid, and you still have to play Sent Scrubs the same way… AVOID THE DEATH ZONE.
Sent may drop eventually, but X-23 is simply not in that class of characters yet. Because:
This is exactly the case. Wolverine just does everything better. X-23 can start the DHC trick, but Wolverine has one of the better powerup supers to finish one.
Wolvie cant deal with Armor Hulk eats him for lunch. I personally think wolvierines way of getting in are a bit gimmiky all i see is super jump dive kicks and the front or back slash mix up bs I dont think hes that deep. Maybe im missing something but i dont see him having a very long tournament shelf life. I like him and he hits like a tank when he gets in but once people stop not respecting the dive kick i think it will be alot harder for him to get wins.
Also renegade whys shehulk so low both combofiend and ultra david think she is top tier right up by phoniex but you have her really low is it a match up thing because she can be zoned. I know the zero wolvie and trish matchup are bad for her but I feel some further elaberation on why you think shes not very high tier would be helpful.
It also makes some of his matchups against rushdown characters a lot safer for the rushdown character, as he can be handled in 1-2 combos instead of 2-3, gives him a lot less room to mess up and makes exploiting his long recovery moves a lot more deadly, he can’t poke nearly as much. He’s still pretty good though because he still hits like a truck and still requires you to be careful pressing buttons, it just makes his bad matchups much more of a liability.
I wanna use this to make a point. in my list, B is not low. The descriptor is “can body people in the right hands, but have some matchup problems”. They’re still really good characters! Seriously!
And yes, she hulk’s weakness is to strong zoning characters and to rushdown characters that are a constant roving hit box like zero. (how in the hell are you supposed to grab that guy?). Shuma assist improving zoning games will make it even harder for her.
combofiend and justin had to do a lot of work w/ their 2nd and 3rd characters at final round. Luckily justin had a tops character (ammy) and a top assist (Tron). And Combo had Task/Spencer.
in my list I think the A list characters have no bad matchups or very very few.
The B+ tier ones have some, but are mostly to the A list.
B list ones can have random bad matchups all over the cast, but are still really good characters.
Meanwhile his best matchups are still the same as good actually. And yes, Sent now has less room to screw up his attacks making that you need more timming and think twice.
All of his moves are punishable by a jab hitconfirm to a full combo except for drill claw and dive kick. Those are the only two moves that are safe on block.
Speaking of dive kick and drill claw, both moves can be blocked high/low and aren’t very hard to block due to how telegraphed his dive kick is. They don’t have a forward momentum either like Akuma’s tatsu to counter pushblock, destroying whatever frame advantage he gets on block.
Wolv’s main strength as a rushdown really is the priority on his moves. But even in that area he faces problems getting out-prioritized by other rushdown stuff like some of Zero’s normals which have no hitbox and Chun legs. And if you look at other rushdown chars, they atleast have some sort of zoning tool which Wolverine doesn’t even have. Mags and Akuma can zone him out with fireballs/beams, and even Zero and Chun have a decent zoning tool to lame him out if needed. I can’t really think of anything for X-23, but still unlike other rushdown chars, Wolv lacks tools, he’s far too simple and needs an assist just to get past these annoyances.
^ I do agree that he might be a bit overhyped because of how easy he is to pick up, but even ignoring that, he’s still quick and has a really solid 3 way mixup that you can’t underestimate.
This! It’s really important to note that there are a lot of pretty solid characters in this game( for now ). The people who end up low aren’t necessarily bad at all, a lot of them are still great and that needs to be kept in perspective.
Don’t you see a problem there? When a character’s good matchups don’t change significantly but his bad matchups get worse? Seems backwards, but this is the wrong thread for that.
Yeah, still theres a lot of solid characters and again, solid characters if you help them with a good assist or with the perfect assist, it’s all trial and error.
And yeah, we need to go in a Sentinel Matchup thread to go into more details on how this nerf afect him on the matchups.
Why would straight health nerf affect his match ups at all? The strategy would be the exact same but he will just die quicker.
Health is a resource that you wager in a gambit. The more gambits you can wager in the more information about your opponent you can gain and the more chances you have of winning. Sentinel is a character who can one-shot most other characters, so changing him from having three chances to win to two chances to win is a big change.
Edit: It also modifies the amount of resources necessary to kill the character. Did you need to use X-Factor and 3 DHCs ending with a Level 3 to kill Sentinel with your team before? Maybe you don’t need the level 3. Maybe you don’t need the X-Factor. Maybe his health is low enough that you can use a less execution-intensive combo now? Maybe it’s the end of the match after you’ve both played keepaway and you’ve done a larger percentage of damage to him.
If said strategy involves taking small bits of life off via projectiles or chip… I makes a huge difference.
Just to note that this question should be to ihateM.O.D.O.K. xd…
I dont think that this will affect his matchups so much too… He still have great matchups and sent can rely on new stuff to keep the bad matchups in a good point, stll, his matchups are affected at some point.
If I can Tier Sent now, he would be a Tier B now.
He still has the exact same tools as he did before just lower life. Maybe you can’t play as recklessly now but the strategies he had before still apply.
Think of it this way. you’re arthur, you have like 800k health. If you have a strategy chucking knives and lances that gets sometimes traded with spit or drones or something , but you usually end up giving about 20% more damage than you’re taking.
With the health nerf, Sentinel is dead before you and that’s a victory.
Without it, your character is dead, sentinel still has 30% health, and your strategy is a failure.
Sentinel is not a character that can afford to die quicker when he has nothing but hard counter matches across the board now. That is the LAST thing he needs for tourney play when it was already not just free wins for him at the highest level. Nothing new is getting figured out about him that would bring him to the level of offensive power and ability to get people off blocking of characters like She Hulk, Ama, Spencer or Zero. His strategy will be the same strategy that gets lamed out and blo
Yeah im sure he’s not a perfect character but when the odds are that if you land anything you get like 80 percent one meter it gets pretty stupid to fight. The fact that he has 2 moves that are safe on block that he can just ream in your face and easily go into combos is nothing to sneeze at. Especially with how fast he is. I’m sure he loses out to like a team of complete lame out laser and shot types but otherwise he’s a huge threat when a touch of anything is 80 percent one meter.
A character like him is like Rufus where there’s no way to fight him but turtling and that’s better with some characters than others.
X23’s weapon x cancels out assists if once she hits the on point character. Once it makes contact its like She Hulk’s air grab super where everything else gets nullified. Still will have trouble with people spamming projectiles from the air but its better than nothing.