That would be VERY interesting to see… too short notice for it to happen this year… maybe it could happen as an Evo side thing? “Back to Basics”, with more of an emphasis on low-mid tier characters, less emphasis on the current MvC2 game which is everyone using the same characters.
OH OK, i can give a brilliant detailed explanation why ken blows major cock:
GOOD:
his shoryuken is invincible. so you can shoryuken during a hailstorm and take no chip damage - if youre good like that - i’ve seen it done before. so his AAA is pretty good, but hes vulnerable for a long fucking time after landing so its not that good
glitched hurricane kick air combo takes off practically all ure life: c. lk c. fierce lp hurricane kick = OWNED
BAD:
- his dash blows
- his launcher blows
so you will NEVER be able to land that air combo. EVER. besides, you can just block low, PUSHBLOCK, and hes pwned.
finally, i’ve played a BILLION kens, and i have taken all of them down easiliy with sentinel by just flying backwards.
yup. he jumps toward me? FRYING PAN.
he dashes towards me? COMMANDO + UNFLY LASER BEAM TO THE FACE
i can fly back all day every day and he can’t do shit. Sentinel completely outranges him for free, and anything ken sticks out is outprioritized by sentinel.
other reasons ken blows:
3) his projectile is shit.
it doesn’t even reach halfway across the screen. wtf was capcom thinking?
in conclusion - ken is garbage. unlike juggernaut, where you are actually under threat to take massive damage from a glitch, ken’s glitch is just that, a harmless little glitch that will never see any action.
OH, and vote Guile for governor
EDIT: Oh and Megaman rapes everybody. i dunno how to play that guy but i’ve seen that gay blue dude rape down magneto all day every day… ITS HORRIBLE.
EH EH EH EH EH EH EH EH TORUNADO HORUDU EH EH EH EH EH EH
Ok, Reasons why Megaman is supposed to be at the top of the list (not fuckin omega “shitty” red ).
- Megaman will most likely have the first hit due to his size and the 1 frame of his lp.
- Projectile spamming game
- MM’s jump busters can cancel most of Sentinel’s attacks, just so you know. MM’s Jump busters also are useful against Tri jump dudes.
- The rock ball is so good against Sentinel, Storm, and Magz-guy
- he takes damage ok, not too great but ok at the least
- It’s funny when MM SJxxBeat plane after jumping out of the HSF (w/c out for DHC’s though :()
- Wall jump
- His Hyper megaman super is kinda invincible and it’s just like Ironman’s proton cannon meaning if you touch you get hurt.
OR?
Well OR has:
-
A good air combo (end it with coil, mash pp, throw them up and mix them up on the way down)
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A cancellable air dash (which equals tri jump even if it doesn’t work as well as mags you can at least go on the other side and cross up with it)
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oc+hk, omega strike + assist for chip and lockdown. Press back + k or down+k to recover (one pulls him back to full screen distance, the other drops him where he is)
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Controllable coils Db+hk, down + hk, oc+hk all good. I think they are even detached hitboxes not sure though but regardless seem pretty good.
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He even has a jump infinite ala ironman but it’s pretty hard to use and set up
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Long range normals, have you seen his c. lp? standing mp launcher?
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Omega strike games, being able to control where you land leads to certain mix ups.
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Good battery
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Assists aren’t what you would pick him for but they are not useless. I usually pick AAA
He’s just a good character there’s not much more to that. He has a good zoning game, builds good meter, does good damage without needing meter, has a air hyper combo so he can dhc out when need be, and his air dash can be stopped at any time by pressing back iirc. Which although he can’t do it in multiple directions is something even magneto can’t do (stop at the drop of a hat). There’s also the multiple coil throw air comboes but I don’t know how to do those. If he could combo into a air super he’d probably be high second tier soley because of the DHC option but as it stands OR is a mainly a battery character. His supers still serve a purpose though which is DHCing out.
OR is a powerful character.
While i agree with you, i don’t think Using sent/commando as an example of why ken looses in a match is unfair. That’s so unfair.
Ya, those are good reasons why he is a good character but not good enough reasons to be above Dhalsim, MM and Samurai. Samurai gives good chip damage, and he also has good reach… i admit, in terms of mobility OR is over SS. But SS is just far more dangerouse of an opponent… if you mess up even lightly on calling your assists, or if his Cyclops manages to stuff whatever you dished out. That’s it, it’s either your assist is dead or highly damaged.
We are not discussing 2nd tier characters.
2nd tier is pretty established at: Blackheart, Doom, Spiral, Ironman, Cyclops
Everyone else is kinda blurry. People are not convinced of OR and he’s always been one of the best, at one point he was considered/claimed to be absolute top tier in early marvel if I’m not mistaken.
yeah but wasn’t jill and iceman once considered to be top tier too?
^ That’s cammy and iceman… i think.
where’s captain commando?
captain commando r0x0rs everyone because his assist is too good, his air throw is too good, his jumping AND standing fierce is too good (standing has HUGE range and cancels into ninja), his mummy and ninja are too good, and his b&b are rock solid (crouching lk, crouching fierce, captain fire - or super or whatever - this is much better than trying to do that gay corridor sword crap that commando noobs desperately try to land - corridor whiffs on cable completely almost always and whiffs a lot depending on location of opponent when it hits).
yes and captain sword DHCs into HSF. SWEET!
oh he also has a projectile fireball. that actually reaches across the screen. tiger knee that shit with drones all day long baby
in short hes the awesomest character ever, and i laugh when they try to snap him in with magneto. as long as they dont guard break sucessfully. that gets ugly.
unfortunately sentinel kinda rapes him hard with fly back fierce and laser beams. but sentinel rapes pretty much all the low tiers with that so its ok.
oh and random note: jill has unblockable zombies. i saw this used to very great effect on no-assist machines where by calling out an unblockable zombie and landing a sweep on an opponent, either they eat an OTG, or roll and potentially get hit by zombie and eat a combo anyway. or something like that. either way, UNBLOCKABLE MOVING OBJECT on the screen? thats pretty tight, too bad jill is kinda ugly looking, like charlie.
Hey, Higher-Jin,
Talked to you a bit about Jin before on a previous thread, just wondering if you were going to Evolution and all. If so, I’d like to play against you with my Jin team and all, just to see where we both are at.
I’m just asking here because I think there is no way Jin is that low…he ain’t THAT horrible. You are probably just venting cuz he is lacking…but it’s not like he’s much worse off compared to the other non-top tier characters.
If you are going to Evo, tell me, lets battle.
Guile can air combo to super, btw. Other random notes include: air/sj flash kick requires no charge…you can just press u,d,u+k. And, he probably has some 1/3 damage flying screen corner combo…not as good as Charlie’s because of the overhead/throw options, but pretty good: just launch and hold up while doing a magic series, otg falling sj roundhouse or fierce, combo to whatever.
Omega Red is good because of ridiculous invincible moves (c.RK, Omega Strike) and high priority. Is he better than Silver Samurai? He’s better at what he does, at least…it’s hard to say. He’s good a space control (think Venom, or Sent without lasers, sort of), and he’s a really good battery…whereas Silver Samurai needs meter. That’d be great if he had some top assist, since there’d be a reasoon to choose him, but he’s a gamble. More damage potential, less utility all around.
Damn Jin is low on the list of low tiers. I thought he was better than that. Oh well I still use him.
Advice:
The dive kick is great. Use it, then combo into something else. And Blodia Punch sucks. Don’t even bother with the tornado either.
in this case we’re talking about omega vs sam. omega has much more mobility air and ground. he can also control space well in both areas. in the air he can keep away with his coils. if a coil gets blocked almost everyone trys to punish thinking there’s recovery,when his coil can easily be retracted and land a sucessful coil grab. on the ground c.hk can be controlled as well. from a far away distance i hold df hk and cancel by doing vertical omega strike and cancel that by tapping down and kicks and repeat. kinda doing setinels laser, fly cancel repeat. also, his omega strikes are quick and can go in 3 directions.if u sj on top of me i do vertical omega strike, if u do a normal jump towards me i’ll do the hk omega strike. trust man,i been using omega for a while now and played the best from soo to duc. dooesn’t make me the best but has givin me alot of experience with omega. what i’ve mentioned are just basics so don’t think that’s the extent of my omega. want to know more just ask. i’ve played top scrubs, msp’s,thrax’s etc,so i doubt sam would do much. i wouldn’t underestimate your sam but im sure you’ll just be waiting to punish my assist with that lightning super cuz that’s pretty much all he has.so that’s my side of the argument . got any other characters i’ll tell you strats against them as well. anyway my team is omega cable doom.lates.
That’s a great argument, but i still don’t see it as a valid reason (or strong reason so to say) why OR > SS. All you gave was details on how good you use OR, but generally i say, SS > OR. SS has power ups that enable him to do different things, sure they have cons but in a way, it still serves a purpose. But i wouldn’t go too much into that, since i think SS’s ability to give off open/block damage is enough to support my argument. SS is easy to use, unlike Omega red, there is no head ache’s or screw ups.
Again, He does heavy chip damage -his ninja star super dishes out mad block damage and possibly it holds the best chip damage in the game. His supers are connectable after the hit of an assist, and yes it is far more useful than any of OR’s supers.
With that said super, he rapes assists for free since it is nearly unpunishable, unlike OR’s destroyer in w/c you could punish by rolling after taking the hit of the last coil. Not to mention that SS is a much better character to DHC into (obviously) since OR’s supers are not worth the burn. This alone should say allot why SS > OR.
And please, don’t give me that “he needs meter” crap. Cable is one of those characters that relies heavily on meter, yet that doesn’t exclude him from being considered a God tier now does it? It’s just like an argument between Cykes and Cable: Cykes has all these wonderful tools, but he doesn’t have that one thing to put him over cable. Take this as a relation to the SS and OR argument.
I don’t know if anyone said this yet, but even though Dark Sakura may not be worth the 3 supers, she is DEFINITELY better than regular Sakura.
I apologize. Much like the Japanese during WWII, I’ve greatly underestimated the real American hero. Launch, sj.JP, SP, FK, FP, RK, falling sj.RK, FS.OTG standing SK,FK,RK does just shy of 50% damage. And after the first sj.RK, you can do a falling sj.Short to cross up in the corner (you can land on either side) and re-launch, combo to super, etc.
edit: I think O.R and SS are both pretty good characters, actually, but a better comparison would be something like Juggernaut vs Cyclops or Doom. Even with the Cable analogy, there are people who will play Storm/Sent/Cyke and not Cable, because Cyke adds something to the team. Cable teams work because they assume that he can carry his own weight. With a Silver Samurai team (which requires a lot of meter for less damage), he’s not quite as good, so he’s more of a gamble. Omega Red is a safer character, and even though he likes Doom-B (a lot), it’s less necessary to build the team around him, IMO.
Sorry man, I’m still straightening out some issues over here and I don’t have a job or money on top of that.
I might make it next year and I’ll probably at TS5 if you happen to be there. It’s a shame I’d really like to see what you can do with Jin, if you show up in any match vids or if you have any existing ones I’d really like to see them.
I didn’t bother ranking: Psylocke, Commando, or Tronne. Because their assist makes thing alot blurrier, think about it they are just about the only assist characters that have their assist justify them in today’s top tier teams despite their below average point ability.
As far as assist goes they are commonly used in top tier teams so wouldn’t that put them higher than many characters? But as far as point ability goes…
IMO Tronne is easily up there with OR, Sim, and the like. Psylocke, she’s not quite that high IMO she’s a little lower. Commando, well he can chip you with block strings involving the ninja and has the corridor to stop run away. He also the captain sword comboes that are landed off of random launches among other things.
I’d probably rank it Tronne, Psylocke, Commando in that order with commando possibly being tied with psylocke.
yeah i really hope everyone knew this, guile would be a lot weaker if he had to actually charge up for his air flash kick